I know somebody's gonna ruin this thread one way or another, but those of you who know better, don't.

Why does Amsoil refuse to submit their product for API testing? I know they claim that it's a waste of money, but I would think that they'd want to throw in and compete directly with the products they claim are inferior.

What gives? Is there something Amsoil doesn't want it's "preferred" customers to know?

XXL

 

Supposedly, Amsoil still adds a lot of ZDDP anti-wear additive. ZDDP has phosphorous in it, which is bad for cat. converters.

The newer API ratings require low levels of phosphorous and Amsoil doesn't want to take it out.

At least, that is one reason.

$$$ for testing is probably another.

Amsoil is probably good oil, but I'm not sure that it is any better than any other syn. out there, and most of those are API rated.

Amsoil is also expensive, which is OK if you get a better product. But Amosil is sold through a Multilevel Marketing program (pyramid scheme), so I think a lot of the $$$ goes to paying for the pyramid.

 

jschira pretty much has it right, Amzoil has too large of an additive package to pass API testing/certification. The main element is the zinc. API holds the threshold at 1000 ppms and Amzoil exceeds that by about 60%. Zinc is suspected of causing cat problems but there is no actual science to uphold that position. The product is good, the marketing is junk. If you consider that the scope of Amzoil is to manufacture a good synthetic oil with the properties to hold up to long term mileage beteen fluid changes, there is nothing on the market better. But your engine isn't going to last any longer using it or any other oil. There is no oil better than fresh.

 

That's kinda how I see it. You pay 4 times as much for Amsoil than you pay for dino so that you extend your oil change interval to 3 times as long.

Not sure that math really works out.

 

How does their scheme work out, anyway?

For instance, if Mil1ion is a dealer, and he recruits me, does he get a percentage of my sales? If so, do I have to cut him a check or does Amsoil do it?

Do you get $ for recruiting people?

Before you guys get ready to lynch me, I'm a diehard Valvoline man. I'm just fascinated with how crazy these Amsoil guys are.

If somebody bashes Valvoline, I'll just respond with a "well it works for me" but if you bash Amsoil and they hear it, they act like you just punched their mother.

If any of you happen to be musicians, there's a guy by the name of "Ed Roman" who is the Amsoil of the guitar world. His websites are full of essays on why every other guitar sucks but his. Very humorous, IMO. If you get a chance, look it up.

XXL

 

Amsoil's scheme is a little different, but if you recruit a distributor, you get a chunk of change if that distributor hits certain sales targets. So if you just recruit a bunch of deadbeats that are only looking to get a discount on the oil that they buy for themselves, then you don't get much (or anything at all).

But you are correct, if one of your distributors sells a bunch of product, you get a commission.

So there can be 2 or 3 guys with their hands in your pocket every time you buy an Amsoil product. Of course, most retailers (except the big ones like Walmart and AutoZone, etc.) buy through distributors too, so there are 2 or 3 levels of mark-up in their prices. An example is NAPA. Your local NAPA store buys from NAPA who buys from Mobil (or Chevron or Castrol).

 

Matt, I think Amsoil supplies a niche market and they really don't try to compete in the market place with the oil companies. It seems that to the enthusiasts they market to, the lack of API endorsement is not a big concern.

 

That's what bothers me - the "niche market" aspect of it. You don't see Ferrari constantly bashing every other sports car on the planet, they just do their thing and let the product (and name) sell itself. Amsoil seems to have little man syndrome, and feels the need to get up in everyone's face every chance they get.

Same with the dealers - you never see a response like "I use Amsoil and I found that it really does deliver". You always get "I use Amsoil and it's remarkable blah blah blah is clearly superior to Valvoline and my '95 Whatever went 26,000,000 miles without an oil change and blah blah blah" - the last three "blahs" being a personal attack and the subsequent condemnation of the non-believer.

There's no reason for Amsoil dealers to get kicked off the forum, but they always act like idiots. It just doesn't make sense.

XXL

 

Some people feel insecure with the choices they need to make. So when other folk's don't validate their decisions by making the same choice, it challenges their insecurity and they feel threatened. It's the same everywhere. Politic's, religion, sport's and automobiles.

 

Watch out Flash, you'll get banned from the board!

 

Absolutely.

When you paid 3x for something as the next person, you either got duped or you are a genius.

Most people consider themselves to be geniuses.

 

Maybe the deal with Amsoil is nothing more than maximizing their profitability.

They operate using multi-level marketing, where there is no comparitive price pressure and you don't have to pay for marketing. Their dealers set up the web sites, put the ads in the papers and push the stuff- At their personal expense, not Amsoil's.

Compare that to participating in the competitive business of retail sales, where your product sits on the shelf with price tags next to another and has to compete on price and specifications. And you've got to advertise.

I've seen Castrol Syntec, Mobil 1, Pennzoil and Valvoline Synthetic on sale, I've seen manufacturer's rebate coupons on all of them, I've seen them all tied into various promotions like oil filters for 1/2 price, they even sponsor race cars and pay for cuties at auto shows.

Has anyone *ever* seen Amsoil running a sale?

What Amsoil is doing is simple. Max profit at minimum expense. Sell a little less but make more.

Back when they started out in the pre-Mobil 1 days, they did have a unique product better on paper to almost anything else available at the time. But not any more, and what's turned me off on Amsoil is the preposterous whoppers their dealers are sometimes resorting to when comparing their products to their very good synthetic oil competitors. I try to keep an open mind, but they've really turned me off with their claims and conduct, regardless of the merits of their product, I'm not going to buy it.