1955 F250 223 IL6

I tried to start my engine for the first time today. It would crank but wouldn't fire. I am pretty sure I have spark as I have an inline spark indicator on cylinder number 6. In the attached video you can see the spark and it almost catch but not start. That is the closest it got to starting.

I have a pertronix 6v positive ground electronic ignition conversion and a 1.5 Ohm Pertronix flamethrower coil which is what their tech support said to use.

I also have a leak at the carb it looks like. I think it's at the shaft. The carb was rebuilt by my neighbor who is a mechanic but maybe that is the issue. I assume it's not supposed to be that way. See pics.

I am open to any suggestions.

 

I would double check my firing order & timing..... is the carb squirting fuel

 

You are still 6v, correct? Did you use the starter from the "new" engine, or the old one? If it was on the new engine, it's likely a 12v starter.

 

I got a rebuilt original 6v starter. I had a 12v starter in which was obviously wrong.

The carb is definitely squirting. The only time it made even a hint of firing was when I pulled the choke out about 3/4 of the way but it was a barely noticeable. You can hear it in the video. I had also tried some starter fluid which had no effect.

I am pretty confident on the firing order. The cap is marked with the correct order as is the intake. I verified it was at TDC in the compression stroke. I will triple check that the wires from the distributor are going to the correct cylinder.

I may try swapping the old coil, but I don't know which engine it came off of. If it was the '55 engine maybe it will work.

i know this is probably an obvious question/answer for most people on here, but how do I check the timing before it is running?

 

You seemingly have spark, so I wouldn't futz with the coil at this point.

I would look at your initial timing, triple checking it.

According to the shop manual, the damper should have 5 timing marks at 0 (long mark), 3, 5, 7, and 9 degrees before top dead center. The timing pointer should be at 5 degrees for initial timing and should coincide with the points in the distributor opening up for cylinder 1. Did you ever get your B6TZ-6023-A pointer?

 

I had the EXACT same issue with my 215 inline 6 after I rebuilt it. It would pop off occasionally, but would never run.
The issue was the timing between crank and cam sprockets. My cam sprocket did not have a timing mark as the manual said it should have so I wasn't lining them up right.
I wound up using the key ways as position markers when I installed the timing chain.
Once I did that, she lit right off. But being just one tooth off can keep it from running.

 

all typical to a first start up. As mentioned above double check the timing.
put #1 cylinder on a compression stroke and line the timing marks up at the correct degree you want the timing set at.
check that the rotor is pointing at #1 tower. The petronics slightly complicates getting a accurate static timing.

I would consider using 12 Volt just to the starter until you get things worked out.
Also you could remove the plugs to get it cranking over faster so you could put a timing light on it, you may have to ground down #1 plug if you are using a inductive pickup timing light.

 

This is why I spin a motor over 5-6 times and double triple quadruple check cam timing before anything gets bolted together, and especially before engine goes into vehicle. Way too much trouble when you're at 8packs stage to go alllllllll the way back and re-do cam timing.


8pack, you got fuel and probably spark, just keep trying the little things, I was young and naive when I went through this and it was a PITA with my first rebuilt 223. It ran poorly, the timing and advance wasn't set right, I was using a cheap timing gun from 1977. I had never set timing before and my dad really didn't know what to do. The carb was rebuilt by me and the fittings leaked and the bowl leaked and didn't stop leaking for many months after it was finally lit off, broken in, and driving. Yep that's right, some issues took far beyond initial startup to resolve. Oh and I only got 7 minutes into cam break in before it began getting too hot for my comfort. Shut it down and tried again next day, got hot after 6 minutes, shut it down a second time.....took three days to break in for 20 lousy minutes.

Why? My timing advance wasn't hooked up and I didn't fully understand how/when too hook it up or measure it, so I never plugged it in, and therefore at 2000rpm the engine was getting hot from too little timing advance.

I was young and couldn't understand the process:

Set cam timing chain/teeth
-Turn engine to TDC 1 and approximate 4º BTDC timing
-Approximate setting distrubutor to point rotor at wire #1
-Leave advance unhooked
-Attempt to fire engine and at the same time keep it revved to keep it running and at the same time grab distributor and move it back and fourth until engine is "happy"
-Point timing light and set at 4º BTDC
-hook up vacuum advance



I was just too ignorant to understand that exact process; I didn't know how to approximate stuff. It was extremely frustrating.
It is the closest I can assume what it must feel like to have a health issue as an adult and need to re-learn how to speak, walk, read, etc.

I knew I was screwing up. I knew I was doing something wrong, or getting the order of operations wrong. I could see myself screwing up. I just couldn't understand how to figure it out myself.

Good times.

 

All your feedback was invaluable!!

The 6v starter worked perfectly once I changed the solenoid and the starter button for new parts. They both worked, but it definitely was getting full voltage.

I thought the timing needed to be retarded so irritated the distributor counter clockwise and still got nothing. I decided to try turning it clockwise, just because CCW didn't do anything. It started to sputter and want to fire. Rotated it a little more and it fired up!!!

I have no idea where the timing is yet and haven't hooked up the vacuum advance. I am going to fashion a pointer out of tape tomorrow. I marked the timing cover where the pointer was on another cover I have. I will set it to 4* BTDC or as close to it as I can get. Right now it runs smooth as silk and it is really quiet.

I called my engine builderbuilder as I wasn't seeing any oil making it up to the top end. He said it might take a few minutes. After about 4 minutes it started to drip out and the fan was blowing the oil backwards. It wasn't flying out of the valve train but it was dripping along the length of of it. I out the valve cover back on to keep oil from flying everywhere.

I did have to shut it down a couple do times as I was worried about the top end getting oil and my carb was leaking and I didn't want to have a fire. Also the fuel pump bowl ran dry maybe because the carb was leaking so badly all the fuel was spilling out. It was pouring out. My engine builder said it was not likely I would damage the cam from the start and stops due to the low spring pressure so he felt it was fine. I ran it for about 20 mins at different RPMs once I sorted out the carb.

I asked my neighbor who rebuilt the carb what do do about the flooding. He suggested I open up the bowl and check to be sure the little hole (I can't remember the name of it) wasn't plugged with a little piece of dirt. The float seemed to be hanging up on the back side hitting the carb body. He said a stuck float would cause the leak everywhere. I gently bent it away from the carb body and made sure it moved freely and buttoned it back up. The leak seems to have been resolved.

The fuel pump bowl seems reallly low when it is running. Pic attached. Should it have more fuel in it?

I pulled it out of the garage and drove it to the end of the driveway and back! My brake pedal is really soft so I need to figure that out. The brakes were bled and there were no air bubbles but it may need to be checked again. I adjusted the linkage as there was a lot of slop. Power brake conversion with front disk brakes.

I am sure there will be some more bugs to work out. I don't have a temperature gauge and I need to sort that out ASAP.

So short story I got it running with all of your help and feedback!!

My heater valve is leaking so I need to sort that out.

@bmoran4 my dipstick is 9" from the tip to the top of the steel part. Pic attached. I have a 1960 block with a 1955 oil pan so 1955 should be correct dipstick. I don't know if I have the correct dipstick or if this one is at least useable. How can I be sure I have enough oil? I have a little more than 6qts in it now and it is 1/2 way up the full mark. I had to add some oil after it was running since the oil filter and any place oil gets hung up has to be filled first.


Dipstick in place.

9" from tip to the steel cover

Fuel bowl is really low on fuel.

Leak at heater valve

 

Bill that is awesome on the start up! Congratulations. And you drove it down the driveway and back again. Woo Hoo!

 

Congratulations! Glad you got your timing close enough to hear it run and take it up and down the driveway!

As to the oil dipstick, the 55 is 16" long and is part EAG-6750-B. In 58-63, a B8C-6750-A was used in the F series and was 12 5/8" long.

If using the 55 oil pan, I think you should use the 55 oil dipstick.

 

if you look in the pic the tube that goes down into the block and holds the stick is either non existent or very short. Is there a separate tube I need to find as well? The 9" stick hits the bottom of the pan right now so a longer one won't fit at all and there would also need to be a different tube.

 

Ahh, I forgot that the oil dipstick is mounted to the cylinder block and not the oil pan on the 6 cylinder despite the picture staring me right in the face! On a closer look, it seems you are missing a little tube, 9N-7020/B8A-6754-B which was used 1954/64 F100/600 223 I-6



https://fixthatford.com/oil-indicator-tube-9n7020.html

 

Thanks!

bigwin is not around for a few days I think so I will reach out next week and see if he has a dipstick and tube. I might as well get them together. Shipping from that link is $8-12 but if Kevin doesn't have one I will order from there.

 

when I get home I'll look. I should have both.