400 vs 460 starter
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From: Az
400 vs 460 starter
Are these 2 starters compatible? I have a 78 F-150 with a 400, and my starter's been grinding. I want to replace it, but would rather go with a new one, instead of remanufatured. There's a guy on ebay that sells starters with more output, but was wondering if I could use for a 460.
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Not clear what you're asking. Do you want to put the 400 starter on a 460, or vice versa?
The mounting is identical. I can tell you from experience, however, that a 400 starter will not be strong enough to start a high compression 460 for very long. One of the low compression ones, I don't really know. All I know is I tried one on my high compression 429 and it was too weak.
The other way around should be fine. The 460 starter is much larger - it's the big Delco starter with the solenoid mounted on top.
The mounting is identical. I can tell you from experience, however, that a 400 starter will not be strong enough to start a high compression 460 for very long. One of the low compression ones, I don't really know. All I know is I tried one on my high compression 429 and it was too weak.
The other way around should be fine. The 460 starter is much larger - it's the big Delco starter with the solenoid mounted on top.
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the 429/460 and 351M/400 use the same bellhousings, so it will definitely bolt up. Question is, do they use the same flywheel diameter and amount of flywheel teeth
try it and see, report back. I'd wager it will work
try it and see, report back. I'd wager it will work
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From: Porterfield
Yes the starter will bolt up from a 400 to a 460 . And they use the same size flywheel with the same number of teeth... But like the other guy said don't know if it would have the ***** to spin the 460 very long .. If your looking to get one of those CVR high torque starter off ebay That's the same starter I use on my pull Truck. I has lots of *****.....Just make sure your battery up to snuff and it will spin anything over ..... It also can be adjusted to avoid things that get in the way with the multi holes mounting flange... Cool Bean's Man.........
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The 400 has a longer stroke than the 460, the cranking resistance would be about the same. Heck, the 400 may even be harder to crank.
Just cuz that 460 is a bigger piece of iron, doesn't mean it's harder to crank. I'd have to see that to believe it. I've seen new small blocks that were a bitch to crank, and 454's that spun over easily. That logic doesn't hold any water.
I'd bet at the parts house, the 400 and 460 take the same replacement starter anyway. They de-proliferate the parts applications.
460 stroke- 3.85"
400 stroke- 4"
Just cuz that 460 is a bigger piece of iron, doesn't mean it's harder to crank. I'd have to see that to believe it. I've seen new small blocks that were a bitch to crank, and 454's that spun over easily. That logic doesn't hold any water.
I'd bet at the parts house, the 400 and 460 take the same replacement starter anyway. They de-proliferate the parts applications.
460 stroke- 3.85"
400 stroke- 4"
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maybe your's does, but his doesn't.
that's hilarious, and now you have an engine that you can't get fuel for on the street. A 13:1 motor won't run on unleaded 94 octane fuel.
put 13:1 in the 400 and stroke the motor, it would need a bigger starter too.
so what's your point ??
we've built 15:1 motors making 700 HP on the dyno, and running high 7's/low 8's in the quarter. We use aftermarket mini-starters.
SO ?? that and a quarter will buy a cup of coffee. Has nothing to do with the original question here.
that's hilarious, and now you have an engine that you can't get fuel for on the street. A 13:1 motor won't run on unleaded 94 octane fuel.
put 13:1 in the 400 and stroke the motor, it would need a bigger starter too.
so what's your point ??
we've built 15:1 motors making 700 HP on the dyno, and running high 7's/low 8's in the quarter. We use aftermarket mini-starters.
SO ?? that and a quarter will buy a cup of coffee. Has nothing to do with the original question here.
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From: Porterfield
Who said my Engine was a Street Motor......All I said was I had a 4.300 Stroke 13 to 1 motor and it needs a High Torque Starter.
When I was building my Stroker 400's they where 16 to 1 Comp. And yes they needed a high torque Starter.
Would I ever drive my Super Stock Pulling Truck On the street... NO I wouldn't....
Question is ?
Would you ever run your 8 Sec. ProStock 1/4 Mile Drag Car on the street...In full race trim..
When I was building my Stroker 400's they where 16 to 1 Comp. And yes they needed a high torque Starter.
Would I ever drive my Super Stock Pulling Truck On the street... NO I wouldn't....
Question is ?
Would you ever run your 8 Sec. ProStock 1/4 Mile Drag Car on the street...In full race trim..
Last edited by shazam; Nov 29, 2003 at 10:03 AM.
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to repeat...
his motor isn't your motor, he's just asking if the 400 starter will work on HIS 460
not YOUR 460...
I doubt he's running 13:1 + CR, that gets driven what, once a month in the summer ??
and towed around town....
his motor isn't your motor, he's just asking if the 400 starter will work on HIS 460
not YOUR 460...
I doubt he's running 13:1 + CR, that gets driven what, once a month in the summer ??
and towed around town....
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From: Porterfield
And Like I said earlier Yes the starters will work ...
As for how Much I drive my truck .. I have at least one Truck Pulling events Every weekend From the last week in June till the Second week in Sept. Some weekend's there 2 or 3 which I pull in Two classes. The tracks are usally 300' long , with each run lasting 22 to 26 Sec. and I burn 2.5 Gals of 116 Octane Racing Fuel in each run .. I usally go thur a 55 gal drum each season.
More then just a Sunday afternoon Show and Shine..
As for how Much I drive my truck .. I have at least one Truck Pulling events Every weekend From the last week in June till the Second week in Sept. Some weekend's there 2 or 3 which I pull in Two classes. The tracks are usally 300' long , with each run lasting 22 to 26 Sec. and I burn 2.5 Gals of 116 Octane Racing Fuel in each run .. I usally go thur a 55 gal drum each season.
More then just a Sunday afternoon Show and Shine..
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The best thing for the guy to do, is bolt it on and see how it works. The results may surprise you. I've swapped more parts on more vehicles and engines than I can count, with amazing results.
As for how much your truck is driven, your truck is a special interest competition vehicle. I put 220 miles on my 400 4-speed '82 F150 in the last week at 11 mpg, with 4.11 gears, mostly highway and some off road. I'd wager that is more mileage than your puller sees all year.
Like I said, it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.
Of course if he can spring for a high torque mini starter, more power to him, no pun implied. But if he ALREADY HAS the 400 starter, I'd bolt it on and let 'er rip. Both 460 and 400 starters are for big V-8's with the same bellhousing, trans, transfer case.
That starter doesn't know what engine it's bolted to, it just spins when it's hit with 12 volts.
question: did you build the motor in your pulling truck yourself ?? i.e. assemble shortblock, check all clearances, port heads, pick camshaft, etc.
As for how much your truck is driven, your truck is a special interest competition vehicle. I put 220 miles on my 400 4-speed '82 F150 in the last week at 11 mpg, with 4.11 gears, mostly highway and some off road. I'd wager that is more mileage than your puller sees all year.
Like I said, it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.
Of course if he can spring for a high torque mini starter, more power to him, no pun implied. But if he ALREADY HAS the 400 starter, I'd bolt it on and let 'er rip. Both 460 and 400 starters are for big V-8's with the same bellhousing, trans, transfer case.
That starter doesn't know what engine it's bolted to, it just spins when it's hit with 12 volts.
question: did you build the motor in your pulling truck yourself ?? i.e. assemble shortblock, check all clearances, port heads, pick camshaft, etc.
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From: Porterfield
question: did you build the motor in your pulling truck yourself ?? i.e. assemble shortblock, check all clearances, port heads, pick camshaft, etc.
Yes I did .. If you run a Seach on the 351C/M 400 Forum for ShaZam or Strokers you'll see some of my build list ...
I built 4 400's with the last one being 435 Stroker
that Put out 799 Hp. with over 600# Tq.
I ran it for 2 Seasons Truck Pulling and now I'm moving up to the 385 series motors.
I currently have 3 Vintage 429/460 Blocks that I'll have 2 of them built by spring..
Yes I did .. If you run a Seach on the 351C/M 400 Forum for ShaZam or Strokers you'll see some of my build list ...
I built 4 400's with the last one being 435 Stroker
that Put out 799 Hp. with over 600# Tq.
I ran it for 2 Seasons Truck Pulling and now I'm moving up to the 385 series motors.
I currently have 3 Vintage 429/460 Blocks that I'll have 2 of them built by spring..
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Originally posted by cantedvalveFord
The 400 has a longer stroke than the 460, the cranking resistance would be about the same. Heck, the 400 may even be harder to crank.
Just cuz that 460 is a bigger piece of iron, doesn't mean it's harder to crank. I'd have to see that to believe it. I've seen new small blocks that were a bitch to crank, and 454's that spun over easily. That logic doesn't hold any water.
I'd bet at the parts house, the 400 and 460 take the same replacement starter anyway. They de-proliferate the parts applications.
460 stroke- 3.85"
400 stroke- 4"
The 400 has a longer stroke than the 460, the cranking resistance would be about the same. Heck, the 400 may even be harder to crank.
Just cuz that 460 is a bigger piece of iron, doesn't mean it's harder to crank. I'd have to see that to believe it. I've seen new small blocks that were a bitch to crank, and 454's that spun over easily. That logic doesn't hold any water.
I'd bet at the parts house, the 400 and 460 take the same replacement starter anyway. They de-proliferate the parts applications.
460 stroke- 3.85"
400 stroke- 4"
And, no, you are going to lose that bet, because I specifically said that the 429/460 starter is the large Delco unit with the solenoid mounted on the starter.
Stroke has very little to do with cranking resistance. Cranking resistance is solely determined by static compression. In fact, a long stroke engine will have less cranking compression than a short stroke one at the same CR, because the crankshaft has more leverage.
Last edited by scroob; Nov 30, 2003 at 02:52 PM.
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From: Az
Actually, SHE, knew it would bolt up, but didn't know if the teeth would be correct to spin the flywheel. I'd do it myself, but I can't hold a starter above my head for long (and put in shims). Not forgetting my lack of reach, since my truck is lifted. So, my hubby does the r&r on the starters. Sorry, I wasn't clear enough.
I just bought a starter from AutoZone. I knew the teeth were grinding down, and the night I posted, it was almost dust. But, for the next time around, I'm GOING to buy a higher torque starter. I get so tired of having to replace starters every few years.
As for compression, my hubby's car has all that modification stuff (nos, bigger cam, etc). My motor is just stock, with a larger carb. But, I thank you for the help!!
I just bought a starter from AutoZone. I knew the teeth were grinding down, and the night I posted, it was almost dust. But, for the next time around, I'm GOING to buy a higher torque starter. I get so tired of having to replace starters every few years.
As for compression, my hubby's car has all that modification stuff (nos, bigger cam, etc). My motor is just stock, with a larger carb. But, I thank you for the help!!