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I know this is hugely variable based on factors including storage conditions, UV exposure, dry rot and how hard the tire was used previously, but how long would you guys run a tire after the manufacturing date if it appeared to be in good condition? Tire industry seems to cap them at 10 years. DOT doesn't have an age limit on commercial tires but the little bit of research I did says fleets typically change out the re-tread carcasses after 7-10 years too.
What prompted this was my 19.5 HD3 Contis on the front of my F-450 are starting to get the common tread chunking and tread separation. I thought I'll throw the new, old spare on and another new, old spare that my dad had in his shop for the time being. Both are mounted on spare steel wheels so I was going to have the tire shop dismount and put them on my aluminum wheels and run them for a few months. I planned to get 6 new tires this fall before winter, so I'd just run the spares until then. However, when the shop checked the date codes dad's tire was manufactured in 2007 and they won't touch it other than to dismount and replace it. Mine was manufactured in 2016 so they would do it, but very reluctant. They cited danger of rubber breakdown and tread separation as the main concern. I understand that, but I already have that and these would be better for at least a little while. As much as it pains me to see on my Platinum truck, I'm tempted to just throw them on with the steel wheels they are already mounted on until October.
Note: Not going to buy steer tires. They are not for me. Also trying to avoid buying two new 225 width tires as the plan was to go with six new 245 tires in the fall.
It may be tempting to use a full tread older spare and the tire may look fine but after a few heat cycles start to split apart because its old and dry. I wouldn't bother with either older tire and just get new tires now.
So, just buy one to go with the 2016 tire.
On a car I wouldn't worry too much, just keep checking for cracking and other signs of wear.
On a truck that sees much heavier loading, I wouldn't run that 2007 tire at all.
It may be tempting to use a full tread older spare and the tire may look fine but after a few heat cycles start to split apart because its old and dry. I wouldn't bother with either older tire and just get new tires now.
If I buy anything this will be the option I go with. Six new ones not one or two. Just make the credit card a little mad for the next couple months rather than saving and paying cash.
Originally Posted by senix
I took my fronts off as they are not a steer tire. they are just collecting dust in the backyard in the shade for now.
Running Cooper Roadmasters up front.
Get a good steer tire.
Respectfully, no.
So here's another question...how often does everyone change out the spare tire they carry under their truck? Essentially after 10 years they are junk too.
I know this is hugely variable based on factors including storage conditions, UV exposure, dry rot and how hard the tire was used previously, but how long would you guys run a tire after the manufacturing date if it appeared to be in good condition? Tire industry seems to cap them at 10 years. DOT doesn't have an age limit on commercial tires but the little bit of research I did says fleets typically change out the re-tread carcasses after 7-10 years too.
What prompted this was my 19.5 HD3 Contis on the front of my F-450 are starting to get the common tread chunking and tread separation. I thought I'll throw the new, old spare on and another new, old spare that my dad had in his shop for the time being. Both are mounted on spare steel wheels so I was going to have the tire shop dismount and put them on my aluminum wheels and run them for a few months. I planned to get 6 new tires this fall before winter, so I'd just run the spares until then. However, when the shop checked the date codes dad's tire was manufactured in 2007 and they won't touch it other than to dismount and replace it. Mine was manufactured in 2016 so they would do it, but very reluctant. They cited danger of rubber breakdown and tread separation as the main concern. I understand that, but I already have that and these would be better for at least a little while. As much as it pains me to see on my Platinum truck, I'm tempted to just throw them on with the steel wheels they are already mounted on until October.
Note: Not going to buy steer tires. They are not for me. Also trying to avoid buying two new 225 width tires as the plan was to go with six new 245 tires in the fall.
If you can afford a platinum F-450, you can afford to install new tires. Replace the spares too. Can you put a price on your life and others on the road with you?
My Father's (RIP) 2014 FORD had only 19k miles on the Michelin tires, but I replaced them last year as they were too old to be safely used. If you look closely, they are cracked between each tread block. From a distance, they look fine. Plenty of tread left.
I always replace all the tires on my F-350 SRW when they wear to the point of losing traction, treadwear or age.
If I buy anything this will be the option I go with: Six new ones not one or two.
Why only 6 new tires? Why not 7? What about your spare tire?
Since you are changing tire diameters from approximately 31.5" to approximately 33.4", on a 4WD DRW vehicle, you will need a spare tire that is closer in diameter match than a worn saved stock tire nearly 2" less in diameter.
Even if keeping the truck in 2WD during the temporary time period that the spare is needed, the four tires across the back of a DRW need to match in diameter under load, otherwise the taller tire within the pair will be overloaded when matched with a shorter tire, when the truck is loaded.
This is one of several self-imposed tire cost increases (and/or tire/wheel safety compromises) that comes with "upsizing" commercial tires with steel corded sidewalls on 15° taper rims.
I don't know if a 245 will fit the spare tire carrier under the F-450 pickup. The only F-450's that I have experience with are chassis cabs, which do not come with a provision to carry a spare tire under the truck.
Originally Posted by 406f150
So here's another question...how often does everyone change out the spare tire they carry under their truck? Essentially after 10 years they are junk too.
I can't speak for everyone, but what I do is rotate the spare tire (an "All Position" type) with the steer tires (also "All Position" type).
So essentially, on a DRW truck, I run a 3 tire rotation. All on the front axle only.
This means that the spare tire not really a still spare, but is instead an actively working tire regularly exercised (so that the emollients in the middle of the rubber compounding are manipulated to migrate to the surface to replace the evaporated face emollients that were exposed to atmosphere, ozone, exhaust gasses, UV, and all the dirty looks from pencil pushing Prius owners, which I am also).
The dual pairings of drive tires on the rear axle never get rotated, and all 4 of those tires remain dead even with each other, so that no single tire on the rear takes on more weight than its paired partner.
The 3 tire rotation also extends the life of the tires most subject to wear... the front tires. These are the tires that do not have the benefit of sharing the load with a partner tire. These are the tires that are run at or near their max capacity all the time (in a diesel truck with a heavier engine, combined with any accessory such as a snow plow or a heavy duty winch bumper). And these are the tires that can at times turn, twisting and grinding against the pavement in one spot sometimes, without benefit of rolling.
The rear tires are ALWAYS rolling during directional changes. They are ALWAYS partnered in sharing a load. And, when the F-450 DRW Pickup truck is empty, the total load on the rear axle may be under 4,000 lbs, while the rear tire capacity is over 14,000 lbs. So the rear tires have a relatively easy life compared to the front tires, other than delivering the torque to get the truck motivated from a stop.
So that is what I do with my spare... I use it throughout that 10 years, just like a regular (front) tire.
All Position tires are sometimes synonymous with steer tires, but individual tire models and brands have distinguishing tread, shoulders, sipe count, and compounding characteristics that might make some All Position tires have more tractive force and water ejection qualities than other featurelessly ribbed strictly steer tires.
In the life of owning the vehicle, what really are you saving by stretching the time of replacement? I don't screw around, it's too aggravating and not worth the risk. I rotate and when they are close to being marginal I replace them all. Spares I get aren't matching and usually a tire on sale from online with the only requirement that they are the same size. I don't own a dually but would keep the same philosophy. I did buy a takeoff once from Ebay like Joe T mentioned. There are lots, cars wreck every day with perfectly good tires that are resold.
I had a whole front wheel leave the truck a few years back, and yeah the other stuff got expensive. To the tune of $4000.
Originally Posted by BDWSD22
If you can afford a platinum F-450, you can afford to install new tires. Replace the spares too. Can you put a price on your life and others on the road with you?
My Father's (RIP) 2014 FORD had only 19k miles on the Michelin tires, but I replaced them last year as they were too old to be safely used. If you look closely, they are cracked between each tread block. From a distance, they look fine. Plenty of tread left.
I always replace all the tires on my F-350 SRW when they wear to the point of losing traction, treadwear or age.
Bought the truck used at wholesale price with over 100k miles so I didn't spend a mint on it. About the same as a Lariat that was 2-3 years older was going for in my area at the time. Aside from that it's not that I can't afford new tires. Just trying to get some use out of the resources currently available to me first if I can. Would be a bonus that it would set me up with fresh tread for the winter.
If the spares had any visible cracking I wouldn't consider using them. The amount of tread left isn't my main concern.
Originally Posted by Y2KW57
Why only 6 new tires? Why not 7? What about your spare tire?
Since you are changing tire diameters from approximately 31.5" to approximately 33.4", on a 4WD DRW vehicle, you will need a spare tire that is closer in diameter match than a worn saved stock tire nearly 2" less in diameter.
Even if keeping the truck in 2WD during the temporary time period that the spare is needed, the four tires across the back of a DRW need to match in diameter under load, otherwise the taller tire within the pair will be overloaded when matched with a shorter tire, when the truck is loaded.
This is one of several self-imposed tire cost increases (and/or tire/wheel safety compromises) that comes with "upsizing" commercial tires with steel corded sidewalls on 15° taper rims.
I don't know if a 245 will fit the spare tire carrier under the F-450 pickup. The only F-450's that I have experience with are chassis cabs, which do not come with a provision to carry a spare tire under the truck.
I can't speak for everyone, but what I do is rotate the spare tire (an "All Position" type) with the steer tires (also "All Position" type).
So essentially, on a DRW truck, I run a 3 tire rotation. All on the front axle only.
This means that the spare tire not really a still spare, but is instead an actively working tire regularly exercised (so that the emollients in the middle of the rubber compounding are manipulated to migrate to the surface to replace the evaporated face emollients that were exposed to atmosphere, ozone, exhaust gasses, UV, and all the dirty looks from pencil pushing Prius owners, which I am also).
The dual pairings of drive tires on the rear axle never get rotated, and all 4 of those tires remain dead even with each other, so that no single tire on the rear takes on more weight than its paired partner.
The 3 tire rotation also extends the life of the tires most subject to wear... the front tires. These are the tires that do not have the benefit of sharing the load with a partner tire. These are the tires that are run at or near their max capacity all the time (in a diesel truck with a heavier engine, combined with any accessory such as a snow plow or a heavy duty winch bumper). And these are the tires that can at times turn, twisting and grinding against the pavement in one spot sometimes, without benefit of rolling.
The rear tires are ALWAYS rolling during directional changes. They are ALWAYS partnered in sharing a load. And, when the F-450 DRW Pickup truck is empty, the total load on the rear axle may be under 4,000 lbs, while the rear tire capacity is over 14,000 lbs. So the rear tires have a relatively easy life compared to the front tires, other than delivering the torque to get the truck motivated from a stop.
So that is what I do with my spare... I use it throughout that 10 years, just like a regular (front) tire.
All Position tires are sometimes synonymous with steer tires, but individual tire models and brands have distinguishing tread, shoulders, sipe count, and compounding characteristics that might make some All Position tires have more tractive force and water ejection qualities than other featurelessly ribbed strictly steer tires.
There's a used, serviceable 245 in the shop that I will mount up for the spare to go with the 6 new ones. pretty sure it will fit under the truck, but I haven't measured yet. If not it will get a spot in the front of the box or against the headache rack of the flatbed when it goes on.
Swapping the spare through with the fronts as you described is probably the only way to really use it up before it ages out. If I get a non-repairable flat in the future then I'll buy a new set of 2 to go on the front and the used one will take the spare position again. If the major flat happens on the rear the two new ones will still go up front and the used fronts will go on the same side in the rear that got the flat so the wear amounts all stay matched up. If I didn't want to change sizes I'd just get 2 new fronts right now.
Bro just spend $150-200 on a used one that has life and also toss your good spare up front. Talking less than $300 all mounted up and your truck doesn’t look Sanford&Sons pieced together and is SAFE. Use your dad’s as a spare.
I would actually put some thought into it and toss your 2 most matching up front. Since its just temporary any uneven wear in the rear won’t matter.
When you get your 245 sell all 7 225 tires for $700 with the spare rim/tire on marketplace with an honest description and ‘as is’.
Also a 245 should work as a spare. The size is fine for the space.
How old? That will be answered in a moment, in response to one of our sentiments in held common, which I hope you will let go of.
The THREAD you referenced, which was begun by another FTE member, was about his 19.5" commercial tires being under-inflated, and I was merely responding to that thread within the context set forth by the original poster.
Yes, under inflated steel sidewall tires can fail dramatically via zipper failure. And over-aged, under-utilized tires can fail similarly.
Originally Posted by 406f150
I had a whole front wheel leave the truck a few years back, and yeah the other stuff got expensive. To the tune of $4000.
One of my favorite FTE thread titles by another member having a similar experience is called:
"Ya picked a fine time to leave me loose wheel..."
Originally Posted by 406f150
Just trying to get some use out of the resources currently available to me first if I can.
That's the exact same sentiment that I was operating under.
How old was the blown tire in the photo above, and that you found in the other thread?
Let's put it this way: When Ford brought to market the reimagined Super Duty brand to full size pickups and chassis cabs back n 1998, Ford did a number of things to get attention. One of those things was to give Gary and Monika Westcott, of Turtle Expedition fame, a brand new 1999 F-550, which became the foundation for their Turtle V Expedition rig.
For decades prior to the existence of "EarthRoamer" and "Expedition Portal" and "VanLife," the Turtle Expeditions 1 through 4, with the latter two both based on Ford trucks (#3, a brick nose 6.9L, and #4, an OBS 7.3L IDI) captured the riveted attention of camping enthusiasts who wanted to wander off the beaten path, and do so self reliantly. Before the existence of YouTube, forums, blogs, or even the world wide web, Gary and Monica regularly submitted articles published in magazines like Peterson's Off Road, Four Wheeler, Trailer Life, etc, as they traveled around the globe, slowly, like a turtle, in their protective shell.
While today the Westcott's have faded into the cacophonic white noise of many me too expeditioners, it was quite different just prior to the turn of the millennium. Back then, the Wescott's were celebrities in the world of truck camping. Their articles on sponsored products that they incorporated into their rigs made them quintessential "influencers" and "key opinion leaders" before such terms existed in the vernacular of marketing.
So it made sense for Ford to give them an F-550 upon which to design and build their ultimate "Tortuga" Expedition V vehicle... an all terrain, all climate, all countries camper that wasn't on a UniMog or a MAN military troop transport 6x6... but rather on a plebian 4WD light medium truck chassis... a concept that Earthroamer copied and commercialized.
The first thing that Gary Westcott did was have Stockton Wheels build a set of custom 20" super singles, to run 335/80R20 tires, so that he could ditch the OEM dual rear wheel 19.5" wheels and tires, even though Ford had upgraded the tires to traction type with their gift.
There were initially two tire models in the Continental General LMT series, both Load Range F...developed for the introduction of the 1999 Ford F-450 / F-550.
The LMT 460 was the All Terrain, All Position tire with big center tread lugs for traction, but closed shoulders for steering stability. This was the traction tire upgrade. The LMT 400 was the All Season, All Position tire that was the standard issue tire for all Ford F-450 and F-550 chassis cabs prior to 2002.
It is important to understand that prior to 1997, there was no 19.5" tire on the market with a speed rating higher than 75 mph. The "M" in the LMT name stands for General / Continental's all new 19.5" tire's speed rating, M, which is 81 mph. No other 19.5" tire on the market at that time was speed rated higher. In fact, no other tire even matched the speed rating of M... which sort of forced buyers to continue to select the General Continental LMT series if they wanted to maintain the tire same speed rating as OEM. The now ubiquitous 87 mph speed rating N for 225/70R19.5 LRG tires that are quite common today, didn't exist with any brand of commercial tire, including Continental, back in 1998.
Anyway, the blown tire in the back of my truck, is one of the LMT 460 tires from the F-550 that Ford gave to Gary and Monika Westcott, who brought the tires to a rally that I was involved with, attended by a few Ford employees in the Super Duty program, from leadership to engineering. In a circuitous path, I somehow ended up with the OEM tires and wheels that the Westcott's didn't want, which were stored INDOORS, until one fine day, 10 years later, I was in a conundrum similar to yours.
I had bought four new Michelin XDS2 drive tires, but I hadn't bought steer tires yet because I was scheduled to receive some steer tires from Ford (Continental HSR) which I hadn't received yet. So in the meantime, for what was intended to only be a temporary interim solution, I pulled a couple of those LMT 460's out of storage (indoors) and mounted them on the steer axle.
Why?
Because I was "just trying to get some use out of the resources currently available to me first if I can."
On the first trip longer than 10 miles, I felt a subtle vibration at 65 mph, but there was no place to pull over, as I was heading into a tunnel, where after I entered, KA-BOOOOOOOM....the reverberation of the sound in the echo chamber of the tunnel amplified the horror, to be immediately followed by FLAP BANG FLAP BANG FLAP BANG... which was the tire tread alligator beating on the truck every revolution. The tunnel was nearly 3/4 of a mile long, so that wasn't fun listening to the truck get wrecked while trying to get safely out of the tunnel. Had to call a taxi to take my wife to the airport from the side of the freeway, while I spent the rest of the day playing musical tires in order to get the truck back home. No tow truck was called or harmed during this exercise.
Originally Posted by 406f150
Would be a bonus that it would set me up with fresh tread for the winter.
You might be better off breaking your new tires in during the summer, to settle the tire tread blocks in and get rid of new tire tread squirm, so that your tires will be broken in and ready for when you need them to work for you during the winter.
Originally Posted by 406f150
If the spares had any visible cracking I wouldn't consider using them.
The blown tire's sidewalls were not cracked. The entire LMT series of tires were junk. During the years 1999-2003, there were so many LMT series tire failures, I know of at least two large contractors who changed the color scheme of their company trucks to have front fenders of a different color than the rest of the truck body, due to how many fenders had to be replaced from blown tires. A different color fender doesn't have to be color matched to the surrounding paint.
Ford abandoned the LMT tires, and moved on to a Continental offering that was not co-branded with General, with both a higher load rating (G) and speed rating (N), and never has looked back since. General ceased production of that tire shortly thereafter, despite having introduced a third version of the LMT Series, the LMT 450, a Mud +Snow rated Drive tire with open lugged shoulders and the center tread blocks of the LMT 460.
Despite understanding all of this, I still thought I could get some use out of the resources currently available to me, for just a short while.
I'm not telling you what to do. I'm telling you what I did that didn't work out too well for me.
Thanks for the responses @Y2KW57 ! That's the kind of real world feedback I was looking for. Wanted to make sure I got the facts right on your situation. Sounds like those were pretty poor tires to begin with and a little aging didn't help them.
I've seen a fair number of newer tires get bulges, flats, or blowouts too so I didn't really know if the "don't drive on a 10 year old tire or you'll die" thing was an over-exaggeration like "if you have a CP4 fuel pump it will fail."
Hadn't really thought about the break-in squirm but that's a fair consideration too.
"Ya picked a fine time to leave me loose wheel..." That was me!
Bro just spend $150-200 on a used one that has life and also toss your good spare up front. Talking less than $300 all mounted up and your truck doesn’t look Sanford&Sons pieced together and is SAFE. Use your dad’s as a spare.
I would actually put some thought into it and toss your 2 most matching up front. Since its just temporary any uneven wear in the rear won’t matter.
When you get your 245 sell all 7 225 tires for $700 with the spare rim/tire on marketplace with an honest description and ‘as is’.
Also a 245 should work as a spare. The size is fine for the space.
Problem solved?
Going to one of the tire shops that keeps a bunch of used tires on hand after work to see what they have for 19.5s.
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