Hello all,
I recently (June of this year) bought a 2005 Ford F150 4x4. The one in my sig. Turns out it needed the timing chain/tensioners replaced. I found an almost identical one on CL but 2wd. It was advertised as being a rebuilt 3V engine with brand new torque converter. That turned out to be a lie. The torque converter is not new, and it looks like the engine has more miles on it than mine. I bought it as a donor. Both trucks have been at the repair shop for over a month (lazy mechanics is all I can figure) and now I am told the donor truck has a 2V engine not a 3V. It came with no intake manifold, throttle body or transmission. My engine runs fine but every now and then it coughed and sputtered and lost power. When turned off, and then back on it would run fine again until it randomly did the same thing. Anyway, would the 2V engine work with the ECU of the 3V? I am asking because I have already spent over 5k on this truck trying to get it to pass smog. I am a disabled vet and the money is not there to do a timing chain job on the 3V I would love to just throw in the towel and give up. However, as mentioned I already have 5k invested. I am thinking the best way to go would be to somehow pay for the timing chains/tensioner job. I am going to the repair shop today to discuss my options but wanted to throw this out here in the 2004-2008 forum to see what you all think.

Jim

 

No, it won't work.

As with anything, it CAN work with enough time and money. Kinda like how with enough time and (our) money you can weekend-at-Bernie's the leader of the free world. But realistically, no, it won't work.

Honestly I'd try to find a way to fix the 3V properly. Are there vet resources to help with costs? Maybe ask on the forum? I'd do it for you for free if you weren't several states away. You served our country and deserve a break.

 

I used vet resources to help pay the vehicle registration when I bought the truck because there was three years of back registration due. But I can ask and see if there is another partner organization that does that. The mechanic stated he has some connections he can try and get me a good low mileage engine for $1,500. (instead of $2,500) So instead of spending that on repairing my engine I'll spend it on a whole engine. That was the plan with the donor truck. Which cost me $1,050. I can get $328 of that back by selling the donor truck to Pick n Pull. But I am going to need some help getting the $1,500. Anyway, I didn't think it was possible to get the 2V to work without spending boat loads of cash but thought I would check just in case. Thanks for the info.

 

Make sure any used engine has at least a little warranty because ANY 3V is sketchy. There have been forum members here have timing set failures at 70k or less.

THEN the catch is getting it in and running before a 30 or 90 day window.

Does PnP require the cats be there? If not and you can find someone to Sawzall them out you can probably raise another $200-$300 there alone. Take pics of the cats and send to rrcats.com for a quote

 

Also I would pull the oil pan on any used engine while it's out. Look for plastic pieces of chain guides. This could also be the time to install a HV pump but if on a budget I understand every dollar counts, so the stock pump will work for now.

Truthfully any seller who isn't afraid of what they're selling should allow the pan to be pulled BEFORE purchase-- I don't feel that's an unreasonable inspection request, esp with the KNOWN ISSUES of these engines.

 

The donor truck already had the cat missing, as well as the transmission, driveshaft, battery and throttle body. I have read on the forums that the 3V may have problems at any mileage was is not exactly comforting but I have no choice but to pray I get a good one. Had I done my research before I bought the truck instead of after I would not be in this mess.

Jim

 

I agree. Before deciding to go the used engine route I had thought of buying a HV oil pump along with the timing set to ease my mind with the build. The engine ran fine most the time, good power, no oil smoke or anything. But it would not pass smog even after replacing 2 coil packs all 8 spark plugs, the cam position sensor, and the O2 sensor. Made no sense. The CEL would not go out even after driving it around to reset it.
Another thing I forgot to mention in keeping this truck is that I had the VA install a mobility scooter lift in the bed so I can take my electric mobility scooter with me. That is why I bought the truck in the first place. They would not install it in the 1992 Ranger I had so I bought the F150. Money was tight, so I bought the cheapest one on CL. Never do that. There is a reason for it being that cheap...

Jim

 

Hmm, it almost sounds like your existing 3V isn't that bad? Is the shop confident it needs a full timing set? Do you think their diagnostic abilities are good?

 

The shop it is at now is not the one that diagnosed the timing chain issue. When I first bought it, I had a friend of a friend (who is the head mechanic at a local church mission who repairs and sells vehicles donated to the mission.) He and his brothers, who are also mechanics, working out of their house replaced the items that the smog test said were defective. After they did that, the CEL light stayed on. They put 30-50 miles on it and it would not go off. And I am guessing they had the random issue with it coughing and sputtering. They returned it to me, and I was able to drive it for almost three weeks until the 45-day temp registration permit expired. And 95% of the time it ran fine. They told me it would need the timing chain/tensioner replaced, and they would not do it, too much work they said. I don't deal with them anymore because after I bought the donor truck, I asked them to swap motors and they ignored my texts and didn't return my calls. I am now thinking how can it be a timing chain or tensioner issue if it runs fine most of the time? I read on the forums here that the tensioners are held against the chains by oil pressure. And I also read that the oil pumps on this POS engine is known to be inadequate. Since the engine is already out, maybe I should buy a HV oil pump and have them install it in the engine then put it back in my truck. Rockauto.com has a 20% more volume pump for like $265. That would have to be cheaper than a whole engine, wouldn't it? But then again, how would that cause the CEL light to stay on? There must be a reason for that. I guess as soon as it does do the cough and sputtering, it sets it off, and the only way to reset it is fix the cough and sputter issue. I used to be a mechanic in the mid 80's before my disability accident, but this modular engine is beyond my comprehension.

Jim

 

Forgot to answer the question regarding Pick n Pull taking the truck without a cat. Yes, they will, it just lowers the amount they're willing to give me. I also tried Peddle because someone told me they pay a lot more than most junkyards. They are based in Texas, but at the moment, nobody in my area is looking for that year/make truck. They did say to keep checking back as things change constantly.

Jim

 

So yeah, I'd return to square one with diagnostics. If the CEL is on, codes are present. You really need to figure out what those are.

You can buy a basic code reader, but I'd reco researching Forscan if you have a laptop. Inexpensive and incredibly powerful for Fords.

You can prop up failed tensioners with heavier oil. I've been running 15W40 and 20W50 in our '08 for several years. It's not the "right" fix but it buys time.

However I don't think failed tensioner seals are causing your intermittent problems.

 

Good to know. I have two laptops, a gaming laptop (yeah I know an old fart playing computer games, go figure) and a small, slow, Gateway laptop I use for checking emails and such when I am in the recliner for the night. Anyway, the more I think about it, the more it sounds like I am trying to fix the wrong problem with the engine swap. However, right now, the engine is out of the truck. I am now thinking I will buy the HV oil pump and have them install that, then put the engine back in. The labor for the swap has already been paid for. Once in, they can run a diagnostic on it and find out what codes it throws. The "mechanic brothers" never told me about any new codes after they replaced the abovementioned parts, but it makes sense that if the CEL light is on there has to be a code somewhere.

Jim

 

They should have cleared codes after all work was completed, but it sounds like we don't know if they did?

Also once cleared it'll take a certain amount of driving to set the emissions monitors as "ready" for emissions testing.

 

You read about 5.4-3vs which had an issue, you don't read about those that run fine on and on. My '07 is at 80K miles, it's quiet under the hood, only the exhaust purr is heard in the cab and I like it. I run 5w30 MC blend oil and filter.

 

I'm not sure if they cleared the codes after working or not. Since they didn't return my calls or text I gave up on them. I see I can get a Forscan Pro for Fords on eBay for $30. Will have to get one, but I am going to wait until the engine is back in the vehicle. Since I only get paid once a month I can wait until next month to do that.
tbear853 you are right. I see dozens f not more on the road and they sound fine. I also see dozens for sale at prices 4 to 5 times what I paid for mine and no mention of a timing chain issue. These listings are from dealers, not private parties on CL. Which I will no longer trust unless I can see it in person.

Jim