I am trying to install a CPP 400 series steering box in my 55. There is a real problem with the installation of the pitman arm onto the sector shaft. The hole in the PA is not large enough and that prevents the splines from having full contact. There is not enough room on the sector shaft threads to go through the nut. I called Mid Fifty and they said the nut doesn't have to go all the way on, it just needs to be flush. That is absolutely insane and a minimum of two threads needs to be showing. I got the same thing from tech support at CPP. He claims he has never heard of a problem like I have and required me to send an email with pictures. He either just started working there or is a complete idiot as this is a known problem.
I would like to know if anyone has been able to get the F100 pitman arm to work so there is full engagement of the nut and washer. That would give me hope that another PA would have a chance of working.

 

Post a pic here so we can see how far it's going on .

 

Its going on just over half way. This is supposed to be all Toyota specs but there is no way a corporation would let something like this go down the road. I cant believe CPP and Mid Fifty are willing to say its OK. The sad part is the real danger isn't noticed if the nut and washer on are on it and a few threads are showing. The contact area for the washer is 0.030". No way that is right.

That small shiny spot around the hole is the contact area of the washer. The washer has rounded edges and tends to slip into the dead space.

This is as far it would go with 225 ft/lbs torque.

 

I went with this set up because I'm old and it hurts to turn the wheel in tight places. I really need power steering. I have used the original ram system on my 56 years ago and it worked fine. Something must be wrong here because so many people have used this kit and are happy with it. What is stunning is the fact that Mid Fifty doesn't see a problem and CPP tech support said to ditch the lock washer and use locktite. That still doesnt address the fact the splines are only half way connected as designed and the contact for the washer is 0.030. I have used mid fifty for years and only went with the CPP junk on their recommendation but they will never get anymore of my money.

 

I had the same problem getting the pitman arm splines to seat all the way on the CPP shaft, nut & washer fits flush with the shaft after tightening. Five years since I've done the upgrade with no problems to date. Tech support said it's ok if the nut flush with end of shaft............whatever happened to 3 threads past the nut rule? Mil spec?

 

The three thread rule is still the ASME standard but some factories allow two. I am positive the tech inspectors at Bonneville would never pass a flush thread on anything, especially a steering component. What worries me more than the flush nut is the fact there is only 0.030 surface contact holding the pitman arm in place. That can be seen as the shiny silver ring around the hole. That is all that is holding the pitman arm in place. The lock washer was actually slipping inside the hole. What bothers me the most is the way this is allowed to get passed on to the public. These kits have very little exposure on the road compared to new vehicles from the major manufacturers. It would have been such a simple fix when the machine work was done to just do it right and then use a washer and nut or a large flange nut.

 

I can understand the frustration, but at this point I guess I'd look for a more a more appropriate nut and washer combo. And the red thread locker.

 

Did you ask CPP? I'd send them your picture and tell them your concerns. I have a 56 with a Toyota box and my nut is only flush with the end of the shaft.

 

I have talked to CPP tech and have sent them pictures. The guy claims he has never heard of this problem even though there has been discussion for years on the internet. I heard that Mid Fifty made the pitman arms by taking stock Toyota arms and putting the Ford ball in the end. Toyota arms have a tapered hole for tie rod ends. If that is correct it would lead me to believe that CPP has made the sector shaft and that is where the problem lies. If a stock Toyota arm wont fit on the CPP shaft it means the shaft is not machined properly. It may be time for me to start searching the Toyota groups.

 

I slid the my pitman arm onto the spline as far as it would go by hand and there are about six and 1/2 threads showing. You have about 10 and 1/2 threads showing with 225 lbs of torque. Do you recall how many threads were there before you torqued the nut down? Just wondering if I will have the same problem or there is a difference in the size of one.


Nut and lock washer shown that came with the CCP unit, finger tight. I think, if I have the same problem, I will replace the nut and lock washer with a self locking nut, grade 8. Looks like about four threads taken up by the lock washer. Another option is locktight without the lock washer.

 

I found these metric split lock washers on Mcmaster-Carr. They are 3mm thick. The original lock washer that came with my CCP unit is .220 thick. so, .220-.118=.102 thinner. That is about 1 and 3/4 threads more for the nut. That should leave you with about a half a thread sticking out beyond the nut. Not two threads like you wanted but better than what you have. Plus these washers are a little larger in outside diameter. I hope this helps.

 

Fordman
I think you have the exact problem I have. The most serious problem IMHO is the lack of surface contact of for the nut. The shaft on mine is a metric 22 x 1.5 I think. The nut I have coming is a Honda 90231-MM5-000 - NUT LOCK (22MM). By using a 7/8 grade 8 flatwasher, the Honda nut and red locktite I think I can make it work if I cant get something better lined out. I have some concern with the Honda nut as it is only meant to be torqued to 125 but the nut from the kit doesn't look like anything special. I see some slight damage to the threads on the sector shaft from the tightening.

Because BJMayberry has an OEM Toyota box and I presume a Mid Fifty arm I am now inclined to think the problem is with the CPP sector shaft. I am planning a call to some of the Toyota restoration places to see what the real deal is on the OEM fit. When I find that out i will post it again here.

I did not check the threads when I put mine together as I assumed the arm would just go all the way into the correct position. It wasn't until it didn't that I started investigating what was going on. I have removed my PA which took some heat to get done so my hand tight will be a bit different now than yours which has never been tightened. When I put my PA back on I have 7 or 8 threads showing. If both yours and mine are the same I might be able to gain another 3 to 4 threads to my set up. I will wait till the Honda nut gets here to make a final decision. There is enough room on the face of the pitman arm to machine enough off to make it all fit as a last resort. I have resigned myself to finding a way to make this work as I have no faith in the advice of either CPP or Mid Fifty.


I have searched and have not found any reports on line regarding this set up failing but that doesn't make it right. I just took some pictures to match yours:


Same as yours with the CPP lock washer and nut. Everything hand tight

7/8 John Deere grade 8 washer. All hand tight

Flat washer in position and everything still hand tight.

 

Would a flanged lock nut work any better? With the flanged nut, the washer could be eliminated. Just a thought.

 

Good idea.

They also come in grade 8 or the Metric equivalent.

 

After reading this post, I looked at mine. The box is a rebuilt stock Toyota from a late 80s Tacoma. The bracket and PA are after market from Mid fifty some years ago. The nut is flush with the end of the shaft and there is a rather thick washer behind it.