400 Build - First Build Advice Needed
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
400 Build - First Build Advice Needed
Project: 79 F150 Longbed 4X4 AUTO
Forewarning: I'm almost 100% green to all of this, so any and all advice is welcome.
Just tore down a block to get the 400 crank to put in a 351m. The 400 block was a MCC from '73 so decided to use the 78' 351m. I've tried to do as much research I can here but still can't decide on parts. I've been stewing for a while and have almost given up to the point of just building the MotorTrend 400 here.
So my question, is there anything wrong/could be better about this build now that we're almost 25 years removed? Here are the specs:
Pistons: Silv-O-Lite cast pistons
Cam: COMP CAMS X-TREMEENERGY268-DEGREE CAM
Heads: Stock
I already have:
Edelbrock Performer 400 Intake
Other parts suggested:
Timing: Cloyes Gear 9-3521X9
Headers: HOOKER COMPETITION LONG TUBE HEADERS 6902HKR
Carb: 650cfm
With decking the block .025 and 0.030 overbore the article says it produced a static compression ratio of 9.45:1. Which is on par with TMI.
Dyno made 380hp/478torque which is plenty for me. Mostly will be a daily driver with very occasional towing and highway. Just need something decently dependable and while its out, and while I work on everything else with the truck, I'd like to do what I can to liven it up. Just finished rebuilding the C6 today so this is the next giant I have to tackle.
Forewarning: I'm almost 100% green to all of this, so any and all advice is welcome.
Just tore down a block to get the 400 crank to put in a 351m. The 400 block was a MCC from '73 so decided to use the 78' 351m. I've tried to do as much research I can here but still can't decide on parts. I've been stewing for a while and have almost given up to the point of just building the MotorTrend 400 here.
So my question, is there anything wrong/could be better about this build now that we're almost 25 years removed? Here are the specs:
Pistons: Silv-O-Lite cast pistons
Cam: COMP CAMS X-TREMEENERGY268-DEGREE CAM
Heads: Stock
I already have:
Edelbrock Performer 400 Intake
Other parts suggested:
Timing: Cloyes Gear 9-3521X9
Headers: HOOKER COMPETITION LONG TUBE HEADERS 6902HKR
Carb: 650cfm
With decking the block .025 and 0.030 overbore the article says it produced a static compression ratio of 9.45:1. Which is on par with TMI.
Dyno made 380hp/478torque which is plenty for me. Mostly will be a daily driver with very occasional towing and highway. Just need something decently dependable and while its out, and while I work on everything else with the truck, I'd like to do what I can to liven it up. Just finished rebuilding the C6 today so this is the next giant I have to tackle.
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 10,470
Likes: 2,632
From: Near Salt Lake City
Slurpee,
Find some closed chamber (pent roof) cylinder heads from a 351 C
That will bring the compression ratio up to around 10.5 or so
I will put pics below
The aussie heads have small ports that will fit your 2v manifold you bought and have the smaller 63-65 cc chambers
There is a good article about 351 C and M heads that you should read
Find some closed chamber (pent roof) cylinder heads from a 351 C
That will bring the compression ratio up to around 10.5 or so
I will put pics below
The aussie heads have small ports that will fit your 2v manifold you bought and have the smaller 63-65 cc chambers
There is a good article about 351 C and M heads that you should read
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
Slurpee,
Find some closed chamber (pent roof) cylinder heads from a 351 C
That will bring the compression ratio up to around 10.5 or so
I will put pics below
The aussie heads have small ports that will fit your 2v manifold you bought and have the smaller 63-65 cc chambers
There is a good article about 351 C and M heads that you should read
Find some closed chamber (pent roof) cylinder heads from a 351 C
That will bring the compression ratio up to around 10.5 or so
I will put pics below
The aussie heads have small ports that will fit your 2v manifold you bought and have the smaller 63-65 cc chambers
There is a good article about 351 C and M heads that you should read
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 10,470
Likes: 2,632
From: Near Salt Lake City
I do not run premium in mine
Closed chamber 351C 4V heads on a built boss 302 motor
The closed chamber heads do not seem to detonate or run on like the open chamber heads do
Spark knock , ping , detonation and dieseling (run on) all very bad on the engine (pistons and rods)
I have my boss tuned well enough to pass 1980 I/M specs at 3.0 percent CO and 300 ppm HC
Closed chamber 351C 4V heads on a built boss 302 motor
The closed chamber heads do not seem to detonate or run on like the open chamber heads do
Spark knock , ping , detonation and dieseling (run on) all very bad on the engine (pistons and rods)
I have my boss tuned well enough to pass 1980 I/M specs at 3.0 percent CO and 300 ppm HC
Trending Topics
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 4,469
Likes: 965
From: Tri Cities, TN
I've had a 351C or two around for 30+ years. A lot of stuff you read about them is not correct. Here is a link to a sticky written by a man who has forgotten more about Cleveland's than most of us will ever know. COBRA JET: Unleashing The Performance Capabilities Of 351 Cleveland Engines With Open Chamber 4V Heads (Q Code) | The De Tomaso Forums (infopop.cc)
I would not recommend 4V heads they are expensive and there is no manifold that will work on a 400 without some sort of spacer. Your money will be better spent on a good set of pistons. Read George P's article and apply that thinking to your engine. If you plan on burning 87 oct you need to keep your dynamic compression at no more than 7.5-1.
I would not recommend 4V heads they are expensive and there is no manifold that will work on a 400 without some sort of spacer. Your money will be better spent on a good set of pistons. Read George P's article and apply that thinking to your engine. If you plan on burning 87 oct you need to keep your dynamic compression at no more than 7.5-1.
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
10 Things Every Truck Owner NEEDS (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
Rezvani's Latest Post-Apocalytic Monster Is a Ford F-150 Raptor Underneath
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Most Expensive Ford Trucks Ever Sold on Bring a Trailer
Joe Kucinski
2027 Ford Super Duty Buyer's Guide (Every Model, Engine, & Package)
Brett Foote
Top 10 Ford Truck Tragedies
Joe Kucinski
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 6,628
Likes: 345
From: Albuquerque
Trying to run 4V heads on a 400 is not a good idea. No intake manifolds made, exhast headers wont fit. Those heads are designed for high rpm use. Most people dont go over 9.5:1 with pump gas.
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
Thank beartracks, that's what I've read mostly too. And it doesn't seem necessary for what I'm trying to achieve anyway
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
I've had a 351C or two around for 30+ years. A lot of stuff you read about them is not correct. Here is a link to a sticky written by a man who has forgotten more about Cleveland's than most of us will ever know. COBRA JET: Unleashing The Performance Capabilities Of 351 Cleveland Engines With Open Chamber 4V Heads (Q Code) | The De Tomaso Forums (infopop.cc)
I would not recommend 4V heads they are expensive and there is no manifold that will work on a 400 without some sort of spacer. Your money will be better spent on a good set of pistons. Read George P's article and apply that thinking to your engine. If you plan on burning 87 oct you need to keep your dynamic compression at no more than 7.5-1.
I would not recommend 4V heads they are expensive and there is no manifold that will work on a 400 without some sort of spacer. Your money will be better spent on a good set of pistons. Read George P's article and apply that thinking to your engine. If you plan on burning 87 oct you need to keep your dynamic compression at no more than 7.5-1.
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 10,470
Likes: 2,632
From: Near Salt Lake City
The aussie heads are closed chamber 2v heads
True you may never find any for sale cheap in America
Cant even mow the lawn with 7.5 compression are you kidding?
Granted 400's have issues and I would not build one for performance but the spacers work and the compression only can be raised a few ways
Have you checked out piston selection for a 400 (slim pickings)
Bob Glidden and Jack Roush know more about the 351C than anybody else on the planet IMO
True you may never find any for sale cheap in America
Cant even mow the lawn with 7.5 compression are you kidding?
Granted 400's have issues and I would not build one for performance but the spacers work and the compression only can be raised a few ways
Have you checked out piston selection for a 400 (slim pickings)
Bob Glidden and Jack Roush know more about the 351C than anybody else on the planet IMO
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
The aussie heads are closed chamber 2v heads
True you may never find any for sale cheap in America
Cant even mow the lawn with 7.5 compression are you kidding?
Granted 400's have issues and I would not build one for performance but the spacers work and the compression only can be raised a few ways
Have you checked out piston selection for a 400 (slim pickings)
Bob Glidden and Jack Roush know more about the 351C than anybody else on the planet IMO
True you may never find any for sale cheap in America
Cant even mow the lawn with 7.5 compression are you kidding?
Granted 400's have issues and I would not build one for performance but the spacers work and the compression only can be raised a few ways
Have you checked out piston selection for a 400 (slim pickings)
Bob Glidden and Jack Roush know more about the 351C than anybody else on the planet IMO
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 4,469
Likes: 965
From: Tri Cities, TN
Bob Glidden and Jack Roush built 351C race engines and that was 40 years ago. I don't think he wants an engine that won't idle below 2500 rpm.
You do realize that 8-1 dynamic is about the limit for 91 oct. pump gas.
You do realize that 8-1 dynamic is about the limit for 91 oct. pump gas.
Thread Starter
|
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 233
Likes: 36
From: KY
Definitely Don't want an idle at 2500. Sounds like a terrible daily driver haha