FE Longevity
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Feb 2011
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From: Townsend, MT
FE Longevity
I have a 410 in my '66 F250 that I built about 10 years ago. Pretty basic complete rebuild with new valve seats and guides, forged pistons, fairly mild cam, headers, etc. Runs great and pulls well. I currently have a little under 50K miles on it. The last 10K or so it has started using oil. Lately it has been using a quart every 250 miles. Still runs great and never really see any smoke except for a little on decel. PCV is not the problem.
Two questions: Where is the oil use happening? Rings or valve guides?
Why are they worn out in under 50K miles and how can I make it last longer? Or am I just asking too much for this vintage of metallurgy?
To be fair, it typically weighs 6K to 8K pounds and I run it hard. 70 to 75 on the two lane, 80 to 85 on the interstate. When something needs hauled, I hook it on the trailer and can gross anywhere from 15K to 30K.
Have I just scrubbed the rings out of it from hard and heavy use? I wouldn't think that heavy use would have any effect on valve guides...
Can I make an FE take a 100k miles of hard use? How?
Two questions: Where is the oil use happening? Rings or valve guides?
Why are they worn out in under 50K miles and how can I make it last longer? Or am I just asking too much for this vintage of metallurgy?
To be fair, it typically weighs 6K to 8K pounds and I run it hard. 70 to 75 on the two lane, 80 to 85 on the interstate. When something needs hauled, I hook it on the trailer and can gross anywhere from 15K to 30K.
Have I just scrubbed the rings out of it from hard and heavy use? I wouldn't think that heavy use would have any effect on valve guides...
Can I make an FE take a 100k miles of hard use? How?
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,672
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I've seen FE's use that much oil and not smoke a bit. In those cases it was a leaky intake gasket. See if you have oil pooling in the bottom of the intake. Dang intakes can leak oil and not lose a drop of coolant or have a vacuum leak...they're sneaky that way.
That said, I've always wondered if carbureted engines had shorter lives due to fuel imbalance across cylinders.
On one hand 50K is short but you have been working it.
That said, I've always wondered if carbureted engines had shorter lives due to fuel imbalance across cylinders.
On one hand 50K is short but you have been working it.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,899
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From: Southern California
Does it smoke after a high vacuum period (decel, downshift) when you open the throttle again? If so I would put my money on intake manifold gaskets not sealing 100%, either in the valley or under the valve cover. Source; I just changed mine three times trying to seal it up after a valve job with the heads resurfaced. I doubt if it is in the bottom end unless it wasn't built/broken in properly.
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Feb 2011
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From: Townsend, MT
Spark plugs are dark, but not black. no real carbon to speak of.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: Brentwood,CA
The single biggest issue I have encountered is improper ring seating. This is directly attributed to ring material used and following what the manufacturer specs for cylinder final finish (RA) and ring end gap. This can be said for lots of engines that are built. The bores need to be sized and finished correctly. No guessing on finish it needs to be checked and referenced.
The next big issue is ring pack sticking, this one is two fold. It can be from a rich condition that washes down down cylinder or it can be from a lean condition causing high heat and piston deposits. You will see this as brown spots under the piston from the rod side and lots of brown or scuffs between the rings. Rings that are lightly sticky can be set free using a high detergent diesel oil with lots of CA or you can also use AutoRx, the later is a pure Ester so while slow it is very good at cleaning deposits.
The next big issue is ring pack sticking, this one is two fold. It can be from a rich condition that washes down down cylinder or it can be from a lean condition causing high heat and piston deposits. You will see this as brown spots under the piston from the rod side and lots of brown or scuffs between the rings. Rings that are lightly sticky can be set free using a high detergent diesel oil with lots of CA or you can also use AutoRx, the later is a pure Ester so while slow it is very good at cleaning deposits.
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Feb 2011
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From: Townsend, MT
To back up a little bit, the reason I am asking is the engine started missing and lost all compression in one cylinder. I just got done pulling the heads this afternoon.
The bores look good. Crosshatch almost all the way to the top. Thinking the rings were not the culprit.
As for the miss, number 3 exhaust valve seat dropped.
Any idea why the valve seat would drop?
All the pistons are light brown on top with no carbon to speak of with the exception of number 4 - it is shiny clean in the center with a smidgen of carbon around the edge.
The bores look good. Crosshatch almost all the way to the top. Thinking the rings were not the culprit.
As for the miss, number 3 exhaust valve seat dropped.
Any idea why the valve seat would drop?
All the pistons are light brown on top with no carbon to speak of with the exception of number 4 - it is shiny clean in the center with a smidgen of carbon around the edge.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
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From: Concord, CA
I have a 410 in my 67 Parklane with 153,000 miles on it and never rebuilt maybe a quart down after one year, or about 1000 miles. Smoke is very, very subtle to see. I do have oil restrictors in the heads to cut down on the amount of oil going to the top end and running past the original seals for what it is worth.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2020
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To back up a little bit, the reason I am asking is the engine started missing and lost all compression in one cylinder. I just got done pulling the heads this afternoon.
The bores look good. Crosshatch almost all the way to the top. Thinking the rings were not the culprit.
As for the miss, number 3 exhaust valve seat dropped.
Any idea why the valve seat would drop?
All the pistons are light brown on top with no carbon to speak of with the exception of number 4 - it is shiny clean in the center with a smidgen of carbon around the edge.
The bores look good. Crosshatch almost all the way to the top. Thinking the rings were not the culprit.
As for the miss, number 3 exhaust valve seat dropped.
Any idea why the valve seat would drop?
All the pistons are light brown on top with no carbon to speak of with the exception of number 4 - it is shiny clean in the center with a smidgen of carbon around the edge.
A piston that's washed off around the edge and then has a ring of carbon and then looks pretty normal in the middle means that the cylinder is pumping and burning oil.
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