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Also, a point of curiosity as it relates to DC charging:
I see a lot of people talking about running their fridge in DC mode.
our big camper is AC or propane and it automatically switched between the two if set in auto. So if the shore power goes out it just lights the burner. And when it is plugged in, it just switches to AC.
The in-laws pop up has a 3-way fridge, manually selected.
given the strain the fridge puts on the battery in DC mode, why would you want to use it if propane was an option?
From what I've seen this is often times done as a safety precaution by those who are not comfortable having the propane on while traveling. In some cases where electrical systems have been upgraded and an inverter is available I have seen folks opt to run the fridge on AC via the inverter as opposed to the propane which would be even more of a drain I think given the additional overhead of the inverter. As I have a DC-DC charger installed I have looked at the possibility of using an inverter to run the fridge on AC but it's a fair amount of load and personally from a safety perspective I don't feel it buys me anything over the properly maintained and used propane mode. I have added an ARP Fridge Defend unit to monitor the boiler temps and provide auto-shutdown capability if the boiler starts to overheat, which can occur regardless of the heat source being used. Avoiding damage to the fridge in the first place is a much better option I think.
May I ask how some of you are getting the wires from the roof to the controllers mounted inside?
i love the idea of using the space under the front bed for the control center.
the flux capacitor is particularly cool!
I've been considering this myself. My current ORV has solar prep with a junction box pre-wired above the cabinets at the head of the bed. The intention there is to mount the charge controller in the overhead cabinet right below the junction box. Generally they use 8 gauge wire in the factory solar prep which is a little small for the length of run between the controller and battery in my opinion so I think a lot of folks just run new heavier gauge wire. In order to get the charge controller closer to the batteries under the bed I've seen folks runs the new wire from the junction box over and down through one of the wardrobe cabinets beside the bed into the front pass-thru and then routing back under the bed. Where the wire is exposed in the corner of the wardrobe cabinet you can use some decorative cord protector. If you have a camper without the solar prep in some ways there is more flexibility as it would allow for you to mount the junction box at a more ideal location based on where you wanted to bring your wires down.
May I ask how some of you are getting the wires from the roof to the controllers mounted inside?
i love the idea of using the space under the front bed for the control center.
the flux capacitor is particularly cool!
After connecting all the wires on the roof of my camper I then ran a +/- 8 AWG wire through the fridge vent on top of the roof, through the floor of the camper, then along the underside of the camper to the front of the camper, then back up through another hole into the compartment under the bed. The fridge vent allowed me to easily drop the wires all the way to the floor in the camper. I also used solar wires for this run since the space behind the fridge can get warm. Actual solar wire has a thicker protective sheath and is more resistant to heat.
And yeah, love the flux capacitor sticker too... I came across it on Amazon and knew it would be perfect for the inverter! lol...
I see a lot of people talking about running their fridge in DC mode.
given the strain the fridge puts on the battery in DC mode, why would you want to use it if propane was an option?
I don't mind running it in either mode, but before I had solar hooked up I always ran it on propane when traveling since I didn't have the battery bank or a viable method of keeping the battery bank charged while running it on AC. Also, there are some restrictions when driving with having the propane on... tunnels, gas stations, etc... Now with my solar set up though I don't mind just leaving it on AC mode. The inverter pulls about 25A per hour from the battery bank when running the fridge on AC and my battery bank is 315 Ah's but the solar does a decent job at keeping that up when driving. Of course rainy/cloudy days this is not necessarily the case... Also, once my truck comes in I will install a 30A DC to DC charger and then it won't be any problem at all. I even upgraded the alternator to a dual 332A on the new truck!
Originally Posted by ttavasc
I have added an ARP Fridge Defend unit to monitor the boiler temps and provide auto-shutdown capability if the boiler starts to overheat, which can occur regardless of the heat source being used. Avoiding damage to the fridge in the first place is a much better option I think.
I did the same thing last year! I love my ARP and feel much better about traveling with my fridge on now, especially in mountainous areas where level is rarely a thing. I will admit I don't know anyone personally, but I have read in forums and on FB of folks that had their fridges catch on fire, or better case scenario, their fridge just stopped working after only a couple of seasons. The ARP will protect the fridge from catching fire and it will also prolong the life of the fridge!
Originally Posted by ttavasc
I've been considering this myself. My current ORV has solar prep with a junction box pre-wired above the cabinets at the head of the bed. The intention there is to mount the charge controller in the overhead cabinet right below the junction box. Generally they use 8 gauge wire in the factory solar prep which is a little small for the length of run between the controller and battery in my opinion so I think a lot of folks just run new heavier gauge wire. In order to get the charge controller closer to the batteries under the bed I've seen folks runs the new wire from the junction box over and down through one of the wardrobe cabinets beside the bed into the front pass-thru and then routing back under the bed. Where the wire is exposed in the corner of the wardrobe cabinet you can use some decorative cord protector. If you have a camper without the solar prep in some ways there is more flexibility as it would allow for you to mount the junction box at a more ideal location based on where you wanted to bring your wires down.
My camper came with a "Zamp Solar Prep" and really all that meant is that they installed a simple (reverse polarity - because Zamp is like that) SAE plug on the outside of the camper and then wired it into the campers DC system via a short run of 10G wire... I'd day it would be good at best for a 200W set up, but that's about it. Of course I rewired everything in my camper and completely removed those wires and just rewired my own. I have 6 100W panels on the roof, 3 sets of 2 wired in series and then all 3 paralleled together in a junction box on the roof. I then ran 8AWG solar wire from that box to the inside of my camper. It is then ran straight into a Midnite Solar MNPV6 breaker box, from there it goes to my MPPT charger via 6AWG welding wire, then to my Lynx Power In with 6AWG and then into my batteries via 4/0AWG welding wire. The Midnite Solar breaker box makes it easy for me to add in more solar if I want in the future, however, the 8AWG wire that I ran from my roof would not be able to handle another set of panels wired in series without having a good bit of loss... however I don't plan to install any more solar on the roof so I was fine with that, but I am thinking about adding another 200 watts of portable panels that again would easily wire into the Midnite Solar breaker box. I will also say this, those solar charge controllers can get hot when running at the upper end of their capability. The bad thing about having it installed under my bed is that the heat needs to vent somewhere... I have 2 fans wired in and set to kick on around 80F, one pulling cool air in and the other pushing hot air out, the problem is that's being blown inside the camper... Truth be told, it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference inside the camper, but it's something to think about. Also, I'm still not sure where I would put the DC to DC charger as I heard those get pretty hot too... I'm thinking I will try to put it in the passthrough and run the wires from there to under the bed (which would be very easy to do.)
I don't mind running it in either mode, but before I had solar hooked up I always ran it on propane when traveling since I didn't have the battery bank or a viable method of keeping the battery bank charged while running it on AC. Also, there are some restrictions when driving with having the propane on... tunnels, gas stations, etc... Now with my solar set up though I don't mind just leaving it on AC mode. The inverter pulls about 25A per hour from the battery bank when running the fridge on AC and my battery bank is 315 Ah's but the solar does a decent job at keeping that up when driving. Of course rainy/cloudy days this is not necessarily the case... Also, once my truck comes in I will install a 30A DC to DC charger and then it won't be any problem at all. I even upgraded the alternator to a dual 332A on the new truck!
I did the same thing last year! I love my ARP and feel much better about traveling with my fridge on now, especially in mountainous areas where level is rarely a thing. I will admit I don't know anyone personally, but I have read in forums and on FB of folks that had their fridges catch on fire, or better case scenario, their fridge just stopped working after only a couple of seasons. The ARP will protect the fridge from catching fire and it will also prolong the life of the fridge!
My camper came with a "Zamp Solar Prep" and really all that meant is that they installed a simple (reverse polarity - because Zamp is like that) SAE plug on the outside of the camper and then wired it into the campers DC system via a short run of 10G wire... I'd day it would be good at best for a 200W set up, but that's about it. Of course I rewired everything in my camper and completely removed those wires and just rewired my own. I have 6 100W panels on the roof, 3 sets of 2 wired in series and then all 3 paralleled together in a junction box on the roof. I then ran 8AWG solar wire from that box to the inside of my camper. It is then ran straight into a Midnite Solar MNPV6 breaker box, from there it goes to my MPPT charger via 6AWG welding wire, then to my Lynx Power In with 6AWG and then into my batteries via 4/0AWG welding wire. The Midnite Solar breaker box makes it easy for me to add in more solar if I want in the future, however, the 8AWG wire that I ran from my roof would not be able to handle another set of panels wired in series without having a good bit of loss... however I don't plan to install any more solar on the roof so I was fine with that, but I am thinking about adding another 200 watts of portable panels that again would easily wire into the Midnite Solar breaker box. I will also say this, those solar charge controllers can get hot when running at the upper end of their capability. The bad thing about having it installed under my bed is that the heat needs to vent somewhere... I have 2 fans wired in and set to kick on around 80F, one pulling cool air in and the other pushing hot air out, the problem is that's being blown inside the camper... Truth be told, it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference inside the camper, but it's something to think about. Also, I'm still not sure where I would put the DC to DC charger as I heard those get pretty hot too... I'm thinking I will try to put it in the passthrough and run the wires from there to under the bed (which would be very easy to do.)
I have the Zamp Solar port on the side as well. For my portable panels I just got an SAE adapter, verified which side was + on the side port, then cut the other end off the adapter and wired it directly into the Victron Energy MPPT controller. On the other side coming from the panels I did the same thing - wired a pair of MC4 connectors directly to the controller. At the moment I'm still working out what the power consumption looks like when we dry camp for extended periods before coming to any conclusions about what additional modifications I should make. I'm also not sure I want to give up any of the storage space under the bed or in the front pass-through so I may be in a stalemate with myself about where to install these kinds of upgrades. I am impressed with your installation - everything is clean and tidy - great job! In the meantime we'll just keep on camping with what we've got as it seems to be working for us pretty good.
As for the DC-DC charger and heat. I was originally planning to install the VE Orion-TR Smart 12/30 in the small electrical junction compartment underneath the front pass-through. However, once I saw the size of the charger as well as reading about some of the temps folks were seeing under heavier charge rates I took a different approach. It currently is mounted in an all-weather Telco box stuffed between the front of the battery box and the propane tanks. The Telco box has a solid aluminum mounting panel plus a thermally controlled vent fan. So far it is working out well - I've seen it approach 38 amps after overnighting at a rest area. At the moment I'm running a pair of Trojan T-125 GC2 FLA 6 volts and set up a custom charge profile on the Orion-TR to match the specs from Trojan. I believe that VE has said that newer Orion-TR units have been updated to run a little bit cooler now. You do want to try and manage the heat as the unit will start de-rating when the temps are higher.
I have the Zamp Solar port on the side as well. For my portable panels I just got an SAE adapter, verified which side was + on the side port, then cut the other end off the adapter and wired it directly into the Victron Energy MPPT controller.
As for the DC-DC charger and heat. I was originally planning to install the VE Orion-TR Smart 12/30 in the small electrical junction compartment underneath the front pass-through. However, once I saw the size of the charger as well as reading about some of the temps folks were seeing under heavier charge rates I took a different approach. It currently is mounted in an all-weather Telco box stuffed between the front of the battery box and the propane tanks. The Telco box has a solid aluminum mounting panel plus a thermally controlled vent fan. So far it is working out well - I've seen it approach 38 amps after overnighting at a rest area. At the moment I'm running a pair of Trojan T-125 GC2 FLA 6 volts and set up a custom charge profile on the Orion-TR to match the specs from Trojan. I believe that VE has said that newer Orion-TR units have been updated to run a little bit cooler now. You do want to try and manage the heat as the unit will start de-rating when the temps are higher.
Yeah making the adapter didn't seem hard, and I even saw where some companies sell the adapters that reverse the polarity back for those not wanting to use Zamp brand. I don't know why Zamp chooses to swap the polarity, but it does seem that they make some good panels... at least AM Solar seems to think so. When I bought the camper though I just remember the salesperson harping on how it was "solar prepped" and I fell for it, hook, line and sinker! Kind of like me just seeing the hitch on the back of our Pathfinder and seeing the "tow button" inside and figured I could drive off with anything in the lot... lol... I have learned a lot about tow vehicles, campers, solar and maintenance since middle 2018... lol!
And I have also thought about ways to mount the DC to DC charger outside the camper, even under the camper near where the wires will run up through the floor and connect in with the rest of the system. I really don't want that much more heat being generated under the bed, although, this should only really happen when we are traveling and with our solar set up too it shouldn't take long to replenish the batteries... but I'm also running out of room under the bed to mount anything else too. I'll check out those boxes like you are using. If it's waterproof and large enough to dissipate the heat it should work fine.
And yeah, giving up the room under the bed was a little hard at first, but as it turns out for now we really didn't "need" that extra space. Once we start full timing that may change, but there is also extra stuff inside now that we will take out since our camper is meant for "camping" now and we have extra bedding and other things to accommodate our daughter (and her friends) when we go. When we remove those things we will have a good bit of extra storage opened up. I will admit too that I am thinking about taking the ladder out from under the bed and maybe storing it behind the back seats in the truck (if the space is big enough... it's a pretty slim ladder) and building a small box the protrudes into the storage compartment so that we can kick our shoes under there when we come in. There would be enough room in front of the inverter, and it wouldn't really impede the air flow inside the compartment so I think it will be ok...
570 watts of solar and 300 ah of FLA batteries. The two center panels are tiltable but I've never needed to tilt them. I moved the batteries from the tongue and sacrificed the outdoor mini-kitchen to make it into a solar controller and battery compartment. The solar cables are routed to the compartment through one of the aluminum wall studs.
And I have also thought about ways to mount the DC to DC charger outside the camper, even under the camper near where the wires will run up through the floor and connect in with the rest of the system. I really don't want that much more heat being generated under the bed, although, this should only really happen when we are traveling and with our solar set up too it shouldn't take long to replenish the batteries... but I'm also running out of room under the bed to mount anything else too. I'll check out those boxes like you are using. If it's waterproof and large enough to dissipate the heat it should work fine.
I got the box through the Altelix online store. Here is the link to the one I'm using. I had very specific size requirements in order to have sufficient room for the charger and breakers but still fit between the battery box and the propane tanks and this was the only one I found that worked. I ended up having to move the fan to the lower vent because the height of the charger prevented the door from closing. A few pics below......
1x 100w floater panel with attached PWM controller with Andersen quick connect.
Victron BMV-712
Xantrex 2000w inverter
Victron MPPT 150/75
4x Trojan T-105 LA batteries (installing LiFePo soon)
Front storage area.
Same space with the guards installed. Holes are for easy access to breakers and switches. 2500w tri-fuel inverter generator fits in the 2x4 frame while traveling.
A screenshot I took a few days ago of the MPPT controller doing what it does.
It may have been mentioned somewhere, but I have been unable to find it. How is everyone mounting the solar panels to the roof to prevent damage and leaks?
I have an enclosed car trailer. I would like to install a solar panel or two just to keep my winch battery charged.
It may have been mentioned somewhere, but I have been unable to find it. How is everyone mounting the solar panels to the roof to prevent damage and leaks?
I have an enclosed car trailer. I would like to install a solar panel or two just to keep my winch battery charged.
any info and advice would be greatly appreciated.
I am using adjustable mounting brackets like THESE. The first 4 that I installed, I installed them like the picture shows, but at a later date when I added 2 more I ended up just cutting shorter feet for each corner of the panels. The shorter length will still hold easily enough, but it required less materials and it also fit on the slightly curved roof better.
As far as mounting them... I cut strips of 6" Eternabond tape about 2" longer than the mounting brackets, laid the panel out to determine where the feet needed to be, then cleaned the roof material and stuck the Eternabond tape down. Next, I applied strips of butyl caulking tape to the bottom of the aluminum brackets and then used deck screws to screw them down to the roof. The roof struts weren't spaced so that all 4 panels could be screwed into them, so I made sure the leading edge was screwed into the roof struts. After the feet were secured using the deck screws I then used self leveling Dicor and covered the entire foot so no water could come in anywhere. So far, I have not had any issues with the panels coming loose, or with water intrusion.
I am sure there are other, better ways to do it... but I figured the Eternabond tape would help protect the roof material since the aluminum brackets was not making direct contact. Plus, the butyl caulking tape under the brackets would help seal the holes as I was screwing the deck screws down, then of course the Dicor would cover the entire bottom bracket, and the screw holes.
This setup is installed on a plywood backer board that allows me to remove it from the pass-thru and use it at my house. I used NEMA 14-50 plugs and receptacles so I can release 4 latch bolts, unplug the batteries and slide it out. I plug the RV NEMA 14-50P into the RV NEMA 14-50R and shore power is connected like it was from the factory.
For my solar power I installed 3 - 380 watt commercial panels on the TT. They are connected in series to the factory-installed solar roof cap. The factory wiring is 10 gauge so that is plenty large for my needs. I was able to screw the mounting brackets into the roof rafters and then cover them with Dicor. 100% waterproof and easy to do.
My fridge is 12V and I run it the entire time we are traveling. The solar keeps up with it easily - as long as it is sunny. This is with the 3 rooftop panels as we were driving down I-75.
I installed the batteries under the bed and used Anderson connectors to make them easily removable too.
This is a functional diagram of the entire system. The changeover switch allows the system to be switched between 30A and 50A shore power quickly and without hassle. Open the Victron app on the phone, choose the appropriate power configuration and then flip the switch to match. Their software and integration is amazing and is what drove me to spend the extra $$ for their gear. I will say this - learning Victron configuration is not for the faint of heart. However you can get lots of info from the Victron forum and from reading on the DIYSolar forum. Both are highly recommended for people who like to do their own builds.
This setup is installed on a plywood backer board that allows me to remove it from the pass-thru and use it at my house. I used NEMA 14-50 plugs and receptacles so I can release 4 latch bolts, unplug the batteries and slide it out. I plug the RV NEMA 14-50P into the RV NEMA 14-50R and shore power is connected like it was from the factory.
For my solar power I installed 3 - 380 watt commercial panels on the TT. They are connected in series to the factory-installed solar roof cap. The factory wiring is 10 gauge so that is plenty large for my needs. I was able to screw the mounting brackets into the roof rafters and then cover them with Dicor. 100% waterproof and easy to do.
My fridge is 12V and I run it the entire time we are traveling. The solar keeps up with it easily - as long as it is sunny. This is with the 3 rooftop panels as we were driving down I-75.
I installed the batteries under the bed and used Anderson connectors to make them easily removable too.
This is a functional diagram of the entire system. The changeover switch allows the system to be switched between 30A and 50A shore power quickly and without hassle. Open the Victron app on the phone, choose the appropriate power configuration and then flip the switch to match. Their software and integration is amazing and is what drove me to spend the extra $$ for their gear. I will say this - learning Victron configuration is not for the faint of heart. However you can get lots of info from the Victron forum and from reading on the DIYSolar forum. Both are highly recommended for people who like to do their own builds.
B-Man, that is a very nice setup! If I could do mine over, I would so some of the same things you have done... particularly setting it up as 24V with a step-down, and using less of the larger panels as opposed to more of the smaller 100 watt panels, and I would have built my own batteries... My build above was my first build, and I am happy with it. It functions just as I had hoped, but of course I learned some things along the way. I also totally agree with the Victron equipment. If someone is wanting to do more than just a solar panel to trickle charge a battery, I'd say going with Victron is the way to start off. It is very easy to build on and it all works so well together. As a newbie, I found it wasn't that difficult to install and set up, but there is also a lot of features that I haven't tapped into because I don't even understand! The only feature I use now is that I set up an assistant to ignore the AC input and accept the solar input. The assistant will let me set up parameters though, so I have it set to stop ignoring AC input when draw is over 1500 watts for more than 0.1 seconds, or if the battery SoC reaches 40%. This is nice because it allows me to keep it plugged in at my house, but it only uses the AC input really fi the air conditioner kicks on. Otherwise I use my solar.
Anyway, I watched a ton of videos and read through a lot of online content before/during my installation. I have no degrees or certifications in this area. My set up has been the biggest "electrical" adventure I have ever set out on, but it was a lot of fun, and if we ever sell our current camper and get a new one, I will do it again, of course I would implant those few changes I mentioned above. I also bought a lot of my Victron equipment from Battleborn batteries and spent a good deal of time talking with them on the phone. (Another tip for Victron stuff, but from reputable sellers, such as Battleborn. Victron is set up so that we won't speak to them, only the company we buy from. So that means, DON'T buy anything from Amazon or eBay. Also, Battleborn gave me discounts for pretty much everything Victron I bought from them... they are a great company to work with.) Another great resource is Will Prowse, and for those really cool installation graphics like B-Man posted above, Explorist.life also has those in a whole bunch of different configurations that also help make it really easy to install. This is the one that I used for doing mine. I still haven't gotten around to hooking up a DC2DC charger yet though...
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