Compressor wheel
Thread Starter
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
Compressor wheel
Okay, so I am chasing down an oil leak and purdy sure it's turbo related. So while I have the turbo off I plan on considering replacing the turbine wheel given I will likely do the 360* rebuild on the turbo since the truck has 240+k on it. The truck is stock for the most part and not going to change the injectors until they need to be. I've read about the billet wheel being a tad heavier and creates a little lag down low...100-300 rpm spool up. I've also read of folks that did this they get shaft and/or wheel slop after not so many miles because of it not being a balanced assembly. So I'd like to hear from those of you that have done this relative to performance and longevity. Also, should the exhaust wheel be cleaned up while I have it apart...and if so suggestions and/or how to's for this...
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 27,345
Likes: 5,941
From: Lake Hartwell, GA
I built my truck for reliability, longevity and efficiency.
Years ago I installed a 360° bearing kit and a Riffraff 4/4 billet wheel. Loved it! It did great! Until I got into heavier towing and then I needed to run 30+ PSI of boost and near 3000 RPM in 4th and sometimes 3rd gear. That is how I ended up with the T4/SXE combo.
The RR billet wheel is probably the best all around performing compressor wheel available to someone like yourself. In most cases when comparing exactly the same sized compressor wheels, a billet wheel will be lighter, not heavier. But, this is not always the case. You are mostly looking for surface area of the blades and the angle of which the blades are set.
KC Turbo came out with a turbine wheel that somewhat mimics the Borg Warner SX-E design not too long ago that replaces the OEM turbine wheel. It is a pretty big hit based on what I have seen here from trusted FTE'rs.
As for balancing the assembly, sure, go for it. Places like Barder Turbo will be glad to help you out with that. Be prepared to pay ~$200 for the task. I didn't balance my RR 4/4 compressor wheel and it was great for 10's of thousands of miles towing heavy cross country. That same turbo is still in service in another FTE'rs farm truck hauling hay bails in east GA.
Some people will have the compressor wheel balanced to the assembly, but 99% of them will not. Is there risk of it being off, sure, but there is also risk of you being struck by a falling Chinese rocket sub-assembly if you are near the Indian Ocean.
As for creating lag down low, a billet wheel alone will not do that. I don't know where you read that, maybe on Facebook or another more aggressive forum that focuses on "you dun it wrong" rather than "how can we help".
Shaft or wheel slop... Maybe if they used an impact gun to remove and install the compressor wheel. Since you are installing a 360° bearing anyway, you will only need a wrench and a ratchet with the appropriate sized socket. Easy day!
Do not worry about cleaning up the exhaust wheel in anyway, shape or form. If it is damaged, then it will need to be replaced. If there is damage on either wheel, the housings need to be inspected as contact is a big no no.
Clean the turbine and compressor when it is apart. A toothbrush and some Simple Green will go a long way and brake cleaner for the really tough stuff.
Hopefully this helps you out!
Years ago I installed a 360° bearing kit and a Riffraff 4/4 billet wheel. Loved it! It did great! Until I got into heavier towing and then I needed to run 30+ PSI of boost and near 3000 RPM in 4th and sometimes 3rd gear. That is how I ended up with the T4/SXE combo.
The RR billet wheel is probably the best all around performing compressor wheel available to someone like yourself. In most cases when comparing exactly the same sized compressor wheels, a billet wheel will be lighter, not heavier. But, this is not always the case. You are mostly looking for surface area of the blades and the angle of which the blades are set.
KC Turbo came out with a turbine wheel that somewhat mimics the Borg Warner SX-E design not too long ago that replaces the OEM turbine wheel. It is a pretty big hit based on what I have seen here from trusted FTE'rs.
As for balancing the assembly, sure, go for it. Places like Barder Turbo will be glad to help you out with that. Be prepared to pay ~$200 for the task. I didn't balance my RR 4/4 compressor wheel and it was great for 10's of thousands of miles towing heavy cross country. That same turbo is still in service in another FTE'rs farm truck hauling hay bails in east GA.
Some people will have the compressor wheel balanced to the assembly, but 99% of them will not. Is there risk of it being off, sure, but there is also risk of you being struck by a falling Chinese rocket sub-assembly if you are near the Indian Ocean.
As for creating lag down low, a billet wheel alone will not do that. I don't know where you read that, maybe on Facebook or another more aggressive forum that focuses on "you dun it wrong" rather than "how can we help".
Shaft or wheel slop... Maybe if they used an impact gun to remove and install the compressor wheel. Since you are installing a 360° bearing anyway, you will only need a wrench and a ratchet with the appropriate sized socket. Easy day!
Do not worry about cleaning up the exhaust wheel in anyway, shape or form. If it is damaged, then it will need to be replaced. If there is damage on either wheel, the housings need to be inspected as contact is a big no no.
Clean the turbine and compressor when it is apart. A toothbrush and some Simple Green will go a long way and brake cleaner for the really tough stuff.
Hopefully this helps you out!
Thread Starter
|
Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
I built my truck for reliability, longevity and efficiency.
Years ago I installed a 360° bearing kit and a Riffraff 4/4 billet wheel. Loved it! It did great! Until I got into heavier towing and then I needed to run 30+ PSI of boost and near 3000 RPM in 4th and sometimes 3rd gear. That is how I ended up with the T4/SXE combo.
The RR billet wheel is probably the best all around performing compressor wheel available to someone like yourself. In most cases when comparing exactly the same sized compressor wheels, a billet wheel will be lighter, not heavier. But, this is not always the case. You are mostly looking for surface area of the blades and the angle of which the blades are set.
KC Turbo came out with a turbine wheel that somewhat mimics the Borg Warner SX-E design not too long ago that replaces the OEM turbine wheel. It is a pretty big hit based on what I have seen here from trusted FTE'rs.
As for balancing the assembly, sure, go for it. Places like Barder Turbo will be glad to help you out with that. Be prepared to pay ~$200 for the task. I didn't balance my RR 4/4 compressor wheel and it was great for 10's of thousands of miles towing heavy cross country. That same turbo is still in service in another FTE'rs farm truck hauling hay bails in east GA.
Some people will have the compressor wheel balanced to the assembly, but 99% of them will not. Is there risk of it being off, sure, but there is also risk of you being struck by a falling Chinese rocket sub-assembly if you are near the Indian Ocean.
As for creating lag down low, a billet wheel alone will not do that. I don't know where you read that, maybe on Facebook or another more aggressive forum that focuses on "you dun it wrong" rather than "how can we help".
Shaft or wheel slop... Maybe if they used an impact gun to remove and install the compressor wheel. Since you are installing a 360° bearing anyway, you will only need a wrench and a ratchet with the appropriate sized socket. Easy day!
Do not worry about cleaning up the exhaust wheel in anyway, shape or form. If it is damaged, then it will need to be replaced. If there is damage on either wheel, the housings need to be inspected as contact is a big no no.
Clean the turbine and compressor when it is apart. A toothbrush and some Simple Green will go a long way and brake cleaner for the really tough stuff.
Hopefully this helps you out!
Years ago I installed a 360° bearing kit and a Riffraff 4/4 billet wheel. Loved it! It did great! Until I got into heavier towing and then I needed to run 30+ PSI of boost and near 3000 RPM in 4th and sometimes 3rd gear. That is how I ended up with the T4/SXE combo.
The RR billet wheel is probably the best all around performing compressor wheel available to someone like yourself. In most cases when comparing exactly the same sized compressor wheels, a billet wheel will be lighter, not heavier. But, this is not always the case. You are mostly looking for surface area of the blades and the angle of which the blades are set.
KC Turbo came out with a turbine wheel that somewhat mimics the Borg Warner SX-E design not too long ago that replaces the OEM turbine wheel. It is a pretty big hit based on what I have seen here from trusted FTE'rs.
As for balancing the assembly, sure, go for it. Places like Barder Turbo will be glad to help you out with that. Be prepared to pay ~$200 for the task. I didn't balance my RR 4/4 compressor wheel and it was great for 10's of thousands of miles towing heavy cross country. That same turbo is still in service in another FTE'rs farm truck hauling hay bails in east GA.
Some people will have the compressor wheel balanced to the assembly, but 99% of them will not. Is there risk of it being off, sure, but there is also risk of you being struck by a falling Chinese rocket sub-assembly if you are near the Indian Ocean.
As for creating lag down low, a billet wheel alone will not do that. I don't know where you read that, maybe on Facebook or another more aggressive forum that focuses on "you dun it wrong" rather than "how can we help".
Shaft or wheel slop... Maybe if they used an impact gun to remove and install the compressor wheel. Since you are installing a 360° bearing anyway, you will only need a wrench and a ratchet with the appropriate sized socket. Easy day!
Do not worry about cleaning up the exhaust wheel in anyway, shape or form. If it is damaged, then it will need to be replaced. If there is damage on either wheel, the housings need to be inspected as contact is a big no no.
Clean the turbine and compressor when it is apart. A toothbrush and some Simple Green will go a long way and brake cleaner for the really tough stuff.
Hopefully this helps you out!
What is the advantage of the turbine wheel on the exhaust side...can see this as getting into a that doesn't match this scenario?
I actually read that about the billet wheel here on FTE in a post within an old thread while I was doing some research.
In looking at the T4/SXE unit, can it not be rebuilt?
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 6,850
Likes: 2,328
From: WV
So if I'm doing okay with the stock compressor wheel now towing...I tow 6k-8k regularly, but occasionally tow 12k...will I be happy with one of those compressor wheels?
What is the advantage of the turbine wheel on the exhaust side...can see this as getting into a that doesn't match this scenario?
I actually read that about the billet wheel here on FTE in a post within an old thread while I was doing some research.
In looking at the T4/SXE unit, can it not be rebuilt?
What is the advantage of the turbine wheel on the exhaust side...can see this as getting into a that doesn't match this scenario?
I actually read that about the billet wheel here on FTE in a post within an old thread while I was doing some research.
In looking at the T4/SXE unit, can it not be rebuilt?
Billet wheels (in general) are lighter and will spool faster. I had the riffraff 4x4 wheel and loved it. If the turbo comes out of the truck I would definitely recommend their billet wheel and a 360° rebuild at a minimum. This wheel not only spools faster but will also cure or prevent surge.
The extra lag you’re thinking of is probably related to the KC turbine. The turbine is modeled after the Borg Warner SXE turbine which is a much newer design but is heavier. I have read that it will spool a bit slower due to the weight, but works much better once it gets going. It’s a bit pricey so adding it may depend on if you have EGT issues or plans to tow heavy in the future.
KC sells a “balanced set” which includes their 5x5 billet wheel and turbine combo. I’m not sure if this means it is balanced weight wise or they are saying it is balanced performance. Either way I have only heard good things about it.
From everything I have read, you don’t need to balance the compressor and turbine as a set. Each component is balanced individually. I’ve installed 2 without doing any balance process. Do not use an impact to remove the old wheel. Every seller I spoke to said this could fracture the shaft.
You lost me on the T4/SXE part. They can be rebuilt but that’s a whole other animal. These are not drop in turbos and require an entire kit to install.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 27,345
Likes: 5,941
From: Lake Hartwell, GA
So if I'm doing okay with the stock compressor wheel now towing...I tow 6k-8k regularly, but occasionally tow 12k...will I be happy with one of those compressor wheels?
What is the advantage of the turbine wheel on the exhaust side...can see this as getting into a that doesn't match this scenario?
I actually read that about the billet wheel here on FTE in a post within an old thread while I was doing some research.
In looking at the T4/SXE unit, can it not be rebuilt?
What is the advantage of the turbine wheel on the exhaust side...can see this as getting into a that doesn't match this scenario?
I actually read that about the billet wheel here on FTE in a post within an old thread while I was doing some research.
In looking at the T4/SXE unit, can it not be rebuilt?
What made me happy may not be the same as you and I don't know enough about your goals, expectations, experience, budget and timeline to say a yes or no on your happiness. If you are doing OK now, do you want to spend $750 to be doing better?
These parts add up quick and if you are contemplating a T4/SXE, you should hit the brakes and take the path that suits your needs. Right now you atpre at a 3 way fork in the road.
Leave it alone, modest upgrades below $1000 or T4/SXE at $2000.
If I could do it all over, I would have skipped modifying the OEM turbo, bellowed up-pipes, high flow outlet, 4" exhaust, etc and gone right to T4/SXE. We live and learn though and I am very, very pleased with my truck even towing heavy long distance.
Thread Starter
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
Billet wheels (in general) are lighter and will spool faster. I had the riffraff 4x4 wheel and loved it. If the turbo comes out of the truck I would definitely recommend their billet wheel and a 360° rebuild at a minimum. This wheel not only spools faster but will also cure or prevent surge.
The extra lag you’re thinking of is probably related to the KC turbine. The turbine is modeled after the Borg Warner SXE turbine which is a much newer design but is heavier. I have read that it will spool a bit slower due to the weight, but works much better once it gets going. It’s a bit pricey so adding it may depend on if you have EGT issues or plans to tow heavy in the future.
KC sells a “balanced set” which includes their 5x5 billet wheel and turbine combo. I’m not sure if this means it is balanced weight wise or they are saying it is balanced performance. Either way I have only heard good things about it.
From everything I have read, you don’t need to balance the compressor and turbine as a set. Each component is balanced individually. I’ve installed 2 without doing any balance process. Do not use an impact to remove the old wheel. Every seller I spoke to said this could fracture the shaft.
You lost me on the T4/SXE part. They can be rebuilt but that’s a whole other animal. These are not drop in turbos and require an entire kit to install.
The extra lag you’re thinking of is probably related to the KC turbine. The turbine is modeled after the Borg Warner SXE turbine which is a much newer design but is heavier. I have read that it will spool a bit slower due to the weight, but works much better once it gets going. It’s a bit pricey so adding it may depend on if you have EGT issues or plans to tow heavy in the future.
KC sells a “balanced set” which includes their 5x5 billet wheel and turbine combo. I’m not sure if this means it is balanced weight wise or they are saying it is balanced performance. Either way I have only heard good things about it.
From everything I have read, you don’t need to balance the compressor and turbine as a set. Each component is balanced individually. I’ve installed 2 without doing any balance process. Do not use an impact to remove the old wheel. Every seller I spoke to said this could fracture the shaft.
You lost me on the T4/SXE part. They can be rebuilt but that’s a whole other animal. These are not drop in turbos and require an entire kit to install.
After your comment about the other items needed for the T4/SXE turbo, that makes it a no brainers move on for now for me...just looking to get in and out with not too many PMS decisions for ease and reliability...
It's a Van Gogh
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 7,795
Likes: 1,329
From: Elk Grove, CA
I just dropped in a Riff Raff billet wheel and I'm very happy with it. Spools faster, more boost. Easy peasy.
Only thing I would do differently next time is replace the compressor o ring. I get a slight weep of oil there that bugs me.
Only thing I would do differently next time is replace the compressor o ring. I get a slight weep of oil there that bugs me.
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,613
Likes: 106
From: Albuquerque
I personally have done the 4x4 billet and 360 from Riff Raff, there is no comparison to the stock turbo.
It spools up real fast ( like OMG fast) You will be happy with it, it did not need to be balanced !
It spools up real fast ( like OMG fast) You will be happy with it, it did not need to be balanced !
Thread Starter
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
I just dropped in a Riff Raff billet wheel and I'm very happy with it. Spools faster, more boost. Easy peasy.
Only thing I would do differently next time is replace the compressor o ring. I get a slight weep of oil there that bugs me.
Only thing I would do differently next time is replace the compressor o ring. I get a slight weep of oil there that bugs me.
Thread Starter
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
Everything else purdy much stock on your truck? Did you delete the EBPV also?
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
Did you go with a new pedestal or diy modify? What's involved with an AIH delete...is there any wiring mods to deal with like the EBPV delete pedestal?
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,613
Likes: 106
From: Albuquerque
Thread Starter
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Cargo Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,033
Likes: 308
A picture would be nice! For the EBPV delete, I'm sure you used a pipe plug like Jason suggests, but how did you handle the shaft holes for the butterfly blade in the exhaust manifold for the turbo outlet? Also, did you install the bellowed up-pipes?