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My comment wasn't referring to OP. It was referring to the comment that I quoted.
IT still applies, no sub panel is to be bonded.
GFCIs work by detecting a ground fault. A ground fault is where current is flowing on the ground. The ground is only a safety to pass voltage in case of a failure in a device where voltage needs an alternate path back to earth. In normal operation there should never be potential on a ground, and why bonding in a sub panel is dangerous.
A ground fault somewhere on a circuit means if you grab a metal drill you can be zapped. GFCIs can be aggravating but serve a purpose in potentially wet areas.
GFCIs work by detecting a ground fault. A ground fault is where current is flowing on the ground. The ground is only a safety to pass voltage in case of a failure in a device where voltage needs an alternate path back to earth. In normal operation there should never be potential on a ground, and why bonding in a sub panel is dangerous.
A ground fault somewhere on a circuit means if you grab a metal drill you can be zapped. GFCIs can be aggravating but serve a purpose in potentially wet areas.
Not trying to be a dick bro. I have just seen so many dangerous setups in sub panels and generator to house connections that it touches a nerve.
It would suck to grab something in the middle of the night while trying to fuel a gennie and get lit up or wire one up incorrectly and get 180v on a 120v appliance and mess it up.
I have the new Powerboost with the 7.2kw generator. I have a plug in my home electrical panel to run my house off my stand alone generator. It works great, but when I try to run my house off the F150's generator, the message center says ground fault, and it wont power the house. Both generator's are the same wattage. The plug's are the same. Anyone have any ideas? Attached is a pic of the plug in my house. The truck generator powers an RV just fine, so I know it works.
I did some digging into this and it seems the Powerboost system is a bonded neutral and total GFCI protected system.
What this means is:
To connect safely and in code compliance to your home will require a 3 pole GFCI transfer switch (not a standard 2 pole) which transfers the neutral as well as the 2 lines (hots).
The reason is twofold. You cannot have a ground/neutral bond in two places and the GFCI system will not allow it because it sees potential on the ground coming from the house as it is in parallel with the neutral.
The 3 pole transfer switch breaks the neutral from the house and transfers it to the generator.
You could technically backfeed without a transfer switch by not connecting the ground from the powerboost to the panel but obviously this creates the danger of no return path for voltage in the case of a short or open in the neutral between the gennie and the panel.
I did some digging into this and it seems the Powerboost system is a bonded neutral and total GFCI protected system.
What this means is:
To connect safely and in code compliance to your home will require a 3 pole GFCI transfer switch (not a standard 2 pole) which transfers the neutral as well as the 2 lines (hots).
The reason is twofold. You cannot have a ground/neutral bond in two places and the GFCI system will not allow it because it sees potential on the ground coming from the house as it is in parallel with the neutral.
The 3 pole transfer switch breaks the neutral from the house and transfers it to the generator.
You could technically backfeed without a transfer switch by not connecting the ground from the powerboost to the panel but obviously this creates the danger of no return path for voltage in the case of a short or open in the neutral between the gennie and the panel.
It seems like Ford purposely designed their generator so it couldn't be used for a house. Shame..
It seems like Ford purposely designed their generator so it couldn't be used for a house. Shame..
Not really, MOST if not all construction intended generators are designed with the protection built in. Some have switches or plugs to change the ground according to needs. Ford built the truck, targeting contractors and as such was required to have the GFCI receptacles to keep the lawyers at bay.
The bigger any portable generator, the more likely to have GFCI protection, therefore need the appropriate transfer switch to connect to the house.
Remember that most of these regulations are in response to stupid things that have happened
Not really, MOST if not all construction intended generators are designed with the protection built in. Some have switches or plugs to change the ground according to needs. Ford built the truck, targeting contractors and as such was required to have the GFCI receptacles to keep the lawyers at bay.
The bigger any portable generator, the more likely to have GFCI protection, therefore need the appropriate transfer switch to connect to the house.
Remember that most of these regulations are in response to stupid things that have happened
Someone should tell Ford you can still get killed by a GFI circuit.
It seems like Ford purposely designed their generator so it couldn't be used for a house. Shame..
If I were in a pickle and did not have another option, I would personally connect it backfeed style (kill the main in the panel first, do not forget) and leave the ground disconnected.
Yes there is a chance of not having a ground causing several problems if there was a fault but we’re talking emergency.
With a 3 pole transfer switch, it becomes plug n play and like already said, most portable generators of any size are just like the Powerboost and would require the same transfer switch.
Does your utility supply a ground? The simple answer is no. I would suggest looking at separately derived and non separately derived sources. If you do not break the neutral then you are prohibited from bonding at the generator. The easiest solution here is to simply not use the ground wire when connecting to the truck. This is easier then trying to remove the bond in the inverter and keeps the bed outlets all grounded and GFCI protected as designed.
If I were in a pickle and did not have another option, I would personally connect it backfeed style (kill the main in the panel first, do not forget) and leave the ground disconnected.
Yes there is a chance of not having a ground causing several problems if there was a fault but we’re talking emergency.
With a 3 pole transfer switch, it becomes plug n play and like already said, most portable generators of any size are just like the Powerboost and would require the same transfer switch.
when at my lodge hunting business off grid we called those "suicide cables" of course we were not connected to any grid and in complete control of our power supply so not nearly as lethal as a regular home owner.
It is really not a good idea to use those hookups short of a disaster scenario and your local big box store is unavailable
Neutral floating: The neutral of the inverter generator is isolated from system ground.
HEV (Hybrid Electric Vehicle )
Neutral bonded: The neutral of the inverter generator is bonded to system ground. Connecting loads that also have neutral bonded to ground will cause the ground fault detection to trip.
Note: If additional grounding measures are required, consult with a qualified electrician.
Neutral floating: The neutral of the inverter generator is isolated from system ground.
HEV (Hybrid Electric Vehicle )
Neutral bonded: The neutral of the inverter generator is bonded to system ground. Connecting loads that also have neutral bonded to ground will cause the ground fault detection to trip.
Note: If additional grounding measures are required, consult with a qualified electrician.
Then either break the neutral at the transfer switch or lift the ground before it enters the inverter.
1 person posted that they did not use ground on end of cord connecting to truck. Claims this fixed issue. I will be adding a a box in garage this summer for generators and will make a short pig tail to connect to powerboost truck only with no ground wire connected.
Below is a 15-year old manual transfer switch that I use with a 7550 generac generator for my house when needed.
I have used it after we have lost power from hurricanes over the years and it will do most of my house ( except for the AC). I have never worried or knew about GFIC when using these two together. And they always worked fine. Will I be able to use the 7.2 gennie from the F150 Hybrid w/o any mods in the same manner?
I purchased a 2021 F150 XLT Powerboost Hybrid with 7.2 generator. From day one, the system alerts, at startup up, a fault and advises to check circuit breaker. Reset is not working,, but all outlets have voltage.. During a recent power outage when attempting to power my residential transfer switch from the on-board 240v outlet, the display registered a fault and was unable to power my house.
Thankfully I have a portable 7.2kw generator that worked as should.
Using the propower screen, there is a generator test option, when tested the system faults and disconnects power..
The outlet tests hot until under load or "tested" with meter.
Truck has spent 3 days, two trips to dealership with no fix. Service tech and manager say there is a software update coming via wifi at some unconfirmed future date.
Meanwhile, 240v will power my RV via a 240/120v 30a adapter with no issues. All 120v outlets appear to be working and holding under load.
In recent news, these trucks were used in Texas to power up residential neighborhoods. I doubt these neighborhoods had 3 pole transfer switches.
Would like the system to work as designed.
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