In search of a "kinder, gentler me" I have designated this year to learning how to:

"attack the issue - not the person"

Maybe this is whacko - if it is it sure fits me. But none the less it has brought me more peaceful relations and I have found those I am addressing more willing to listen to what I have to say and help me either figure it out or reach a middle ground "all" can live with.

Strictly FWIW. Personally, I'm going to go stick my head back in the sand .Oh, for the record I still say "Bill Gates" and think that says it all.

 

That is the basis of all that is good and will completely confuse the enemy (evil).

Good point, ct!

 

Do not grow weary in well doing, my friend. We are all aware of the problem and on guard. However, it is refreshing to know that someone is willing to address.

Let the big mare eat!!

 

GG,

R&R if you must but please don't stay out of it henceforth. Ignorance is pervasive and the struggle against it is neverending. I do not believe anyone here is actually "evil".
Shouting down or belittling one's adversary hardly qualifies as rebuttal. While I too abhor the needless disrespect, I try to have(sometimes unsuccessfully) patience with those who for whatever reason characterize issues as black and white.

And Big Orn I had meant to mention: "Chelating"
WOW your somethin' boy. Don't ever say I have a way with words again.

BTW I thought the jousting yeaterday went pretty well all and all.
I was a little surprised the mod stepped in.

 

I wondered if anyone would notice, given the experiences I have had with evil cannot be explained in any other form than chelation.

And as far as the repartee - I too enjoyed it. Makes the blood stir and thins the poison therein.

 

Don't worry, my fellow FTEr's, I am not going anywhere. I'll be cold, stiff, and well dead before I even begin to Consider backing down from my beliefs. I have decided to choose a different approach on these attacks. We'll see how it works. But there is no way in heck that anyone of this illmannered ilk will keep me away from these discussions or this site, that I have grown to enjoy thoroughly enough to be a part of my daily ritual. I value the insights and views of too many of you to let anything keep me from debating and garnering a better understanding for myself. That being said, back to the forums,,, after a java refill, of course

 

Evil is what you make it.

I sincerely doubt the existence of a singular and pervasive supernatural force as a wellspring for the problems in the world. That is, evil does not exist outside of what we name as 'evil' actions or incidents.

The definition then becomes open-ended and dependent on one's experience. What one person considers to be an act of evil, another may shrug off.

Whistler

 

Bigorn, you amaze me-in a good way.

 

EVIL... That FAT PIG Rosie O'Donnell

 

...now that was verbose... ^

 

I have posted here once and still maintain that you can always distinguish the character of man by what it takes to get his “goat”. Who better knows how to go about this than a person who, whether they know it or not, resides with evil?
Whistler said,
But, I believe that evil exists with or without us (human beings). Evil is what it is and can only become known when we acknowledge it, or do its bidding. It moves about as a lazy summer breeze, touching us when we least expect it and at times feels refreshing. As we sit in the shade of hopelessness wiping the sweat of despair from our brow, it comes along and gives us excuses, causing us to throw blame first at our closest loved ones then down the line until we feel we have divested ourselves of the blame. It soon becomes our closest ally, our constant friend, who in times of trouble stirs our emotions and shapes our words. It strokes our minds much in the same manner as a young mother caresses the head of her child, cooing us all the while. It maintains this position in our life until we eventually have no recourse but to either acknowledge it and refuse it or accept and live with it.
My daughter finally begged me to rent a “scary” movie called “28 Days Later”. It was not scary, but vile and disgusting…bloody. I didn’t like it. But it did make me think. In a way, that virus is like evil, but not spread in such a manner, even though evil is contagious. Instead of having 10 to 20 seconds before the “rage” takes over ones mind, evil takes over instantly. It doesn’t change ones appearance physically, but it changes ones mind…and logically so.
For me evil followed me wherever I went. It had “feelings” for me – if you will accept that in a spiritual sense. Then one day, after I had decided to forever reject the “Darkness”, it followed me home, suitcase in hand, ready to become part of my new life. I promptly sent it away and it wailed for me constantly for weeks afterwards as it stood just outside my door. After a few months of refusing it, it became its true self once again, thrashing and tearing at my mind. It was the hardest thing I ever did – confronting the evil. After I did this, it went away...it fled.
So, yes, I may have a warped and twisted mind, but not to the point that I will ever allow evil to reside here again.
I do not claim to be unique or special for I can name several here at FTE that have went through the same thing. I bet if you ask them, they too have seen evil and, whistler, it is not what you make it, it is what you allow it to do.

 

BRAVO, BigOrn !!

Very well said. And by a man that CLEARLY has open lines of communications within his own mind.

Yea, I'm definitely saying that is not the norm in todays world.

My hat is off to you.

 

Big Orn,

I think the difference between what you are saying and what I am saying is a matter of perspective and/or conceptualization.

Now I don't know the nature of the situation you were facing, but when you say 'it (evil) stood just outside my door' I assume you are not speaking of an actual person or palpable thing. If this was a person or animal, please let me know.

In your post you make use of wonderful metaphors and similes to get your argument across. However, phrases like "It strokes our minds much in the same manner as a young mother caresses the head of her child, cooing us all the while" and "evil takes over instantly. It doesn’t change ones appearance physically, but it changes ones mind…and logically so" or "thrashing and tearing at my mind" are indicitive of an internal struggle. That is, you were fighting something inside your own head.

I am not suggesting you are mentally ill--indeed I have situations where I "throw blame first at our closest loved ones then down the line until we feel we have divested ourselves of the blame". I think everybody here has probably had similar experiences towards spouses, parents, children, etc.

The issue then boils down to "From where do these thoughts originate?" Do they spring from your mind, unaided by an 'outside force'? Or is there an presence that somehow penetrates your consciousness and plants them there, leaving you to wrestle them (perhaps with the help of God, if you are so inclined)?

I personally go with the first explanation. Human beings are capable of very 'evil' thoughts, words and deeds on our own. I cannot fathom the existance of a force that covers the entire planet equally with the power to manipulate our minds.

Of course, I cannot prove this to be the case. So, like religion, it really comes down to a matter of belief and/or faith.

I just have two questions however, if there is a force of evil that plants bad thoughts into our minds is there then a force of good that plants good thoughts into our minds? And secondly, if this is the case, are each of us merely battlefields in whose minds some cosmic struggle between two diametrically opposing forces is occuring?

Eagerly awaiting your response,

Whistler

 

Ha! No, this is not a person or animal, but I do admire your humor!

Not necessarily originating in my mind, but more towards allowing it to enter. This can only be acceptable if you believe that evil is a spirit.

Thanks, but it has been suggested that if you can actually see (whether physically, mentally or spiritually) things of such nature you could be nuts. Just wanted to acknowledge the fact that I know I am allowing myself to wander quite a bit out on that limb.

If you will indulge: Ephesians 6:12 – For we do not wrestle with flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
If I am a believer of one part then I must believe in it all, therefore to me it is a presence that I allow to penetrate my conscience. But I do not wrestle alone, for He (God) which is in me is greater than he (evil) which is in the world.

Cause and effect – if you will. I cannot quote the Bible word for word for it is not written in that manner, but is eluded to by the Bible as a whole. Yes there is a force of good and evil. Both have their causes and effects and were created by God, for God. If you cannot believe in God then all this is disputable. Not only are there battles going on all day long in our minds, there are also battles waging in Heaven against Good and Evil.
How I discern the supernatural from the natural, the good from the evil, stems from a long life of living in the realm of evil, being part of it and participating in its army – so to speak.
As far as my way of putting it into prose? It is more readily acceptable versus “thumping the Bible”. I have heard (and felt) too much of the “Fire and brimstone” jargon to ever accept it as inclusive to all. So, to my FTE family, I would rather keep the language light and agreeable.

 

Interesting philosophy, Big Orn. It is completely foreign and incompatible with mine but, nonetheless, just as valid.

I personally thought your writing was quite good. It was very evocative and had a certain etheral quality quite appropriate to the topic and your personal beliefs.

I'm not sure of your opinion regarding futher debate on this topic You have your beliefs and I have mine and while I would not be opposed to more discussion, it is unlikely we will be able to change the other's mind. I will, however, definately think more about your ideas.


Take care,

Whistler