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I currently own an F-250 4x4 XL 8ft bed truck and travel trailer RV. The trailer weighs less than 10,000 lbs loaded. My truck doesn't have an issue pulling it. I want to upgrade to a 5th wheel RV, but use the same truck without upgrading. I put my VIN number into VIN decoder and came up with these numbers. What do they mean? Can I pull a 15,000 lbs 5th wheel.
Some key details are missing, but I guess you have a gas motor. Lets assume it is a 6.2 and 4x4.
It would appear to me that your max 5th wheels is 15.5K. Lots of other numbers have todo with ttrailers that have either a weight distribution or no distribution off of your receiver.
So first things first. Get your truck on the catscale and see what the weights are per axle. Then technically you can add the two (ticket will have done this) and then review that number with what the yellow sticker indicates. Subtract and then you have the avail payload. Not an accurate enforceable number and likely won't be a lot of room.
Using the white stick axle ratings is a more accurate and enforceable number. A catsscale gives you those numbers so just subtract the mainly rear gross rating. Difference is what you can have for payload.
a 5th wheels king pin wt is what goes in the bed of the truck and becomes payload. The other important and enforceable number is the max tire load at max psi. So don't exceed either.
So when looking at trailers, other than floor plans and features, first look at the while sticker on the 5er. Take the GVW and then 20% of that will be the king pin wt. Lots of 5er's will advertise a king pin wt that is inaccurate once it leaves the factory. Go by the sticker.
So knowing your payload and knowing the 20% king pin wt will help you to decide and 5th wheel no more than about 15K lbs.
You can also go to fleetford.com and look at the towing guide for your year for the numbers.
20% of GVW of the trailer is probably a minimum number to use. Depending on how it was built, and how it is loaded, pin weight could be up to 25%. I was reading a post by a full-timer on a forum yesterday. They have been on the road for about 5 years, and he said that his pin weight has been at 23% pretty consistently.
If you have a toy hauler model, the pin weight can be much higher, as they are often built to hit about 20% when loaded. That means that they are pin heavy when not loaded, so that loading a heavy “toy” doesn’t take too much weight off the pin.
If you find that your 250 doesn’t have enough payload capacity, you might look at a similar floor plan in a bumper pull. You’ll normally run out of payload capacity long before you run out of towing capacity. By their nature, bumper pulls have less weight on the nose, so they don’t hit you as hard on your available payload.
As others have stated, the payload is going to run out well before the towing capacity. I tow with a F250, and here's my setup:
Truck: 2018 F250 CCSB Lariat 4x4 6.2 (gasser). Payload: 2849
Trailer: 2016 Surveyor 275BHSS (Classified as 1/2 ton towable). Dry 7404, dry pin 1140, GVWR 9943, Loaded weight 8200-8300, loaded pin 1700-1800.
Payload in truck aside from the pin: Wife, kids, dogs, fiver hitch, tonneau cover, tools, etc.... Approx. 1000 lbs. (8025 on the scale).
Between what I normally carry, and the extremely lightweight loaded pin weight of my '1/2 ton towable' fiver, I'm essentially maxing out my 3/4 ton's payload. If I had a heavier diesel, I'd be way over my payload.
So yes, 3/4 tons CAN tow fivers, but realisitically, they can only tow really specific fivers, with really specific setups, to still be within their numbers. Most fivers, especially if you're looking at 15000 lb fivers, are going to exceed the numbers of a 3/4 ton.
Just to give you an idea our trailer weighs between 15600 to 16000 fully loaded and our pin weight is between 3200 to 3400 depending on water on board. We are also loaded to the max weight of the trailer because we live in it all winter and have a 5KW generator built into very front compartment we also pull with a F350 DRW.
Some key details are missing, but I guess you have a gas motor. Lets assume it is a 6.2 and 4x4.
It would appear to me that your max 5th wheels is 15.5K. Lots of other numbers have todo with ttrailers that have either a weight distribution or no distribution off of your receiver.
So first things first. Get your truck on the catscale and see what the weights are per axle. Then technically you can add the two (ticket will have done this) and then review that number with what the yellow sticker indicates. Subtract and then you have the avail payload. Not an accurate enforceable number and likely won't be a lot of room.
Using the white stick axle ratings is a more accurate and enforceable number. A catsscale gives you those numbers so just subtract the mainly rear gross rating. Difference is what you can have for payload.
a 5th wheels king pin wt is what goes in the bed of the truck and becomes payload. The other important and enforceable number is the max tire load at max psi. So don't exceed either.
So when looking at trailers, other than floor plans and features, first look at the while sticker on the 5er. Take the GVW and then 20% of that will be the king pin wt. Lots of 5er's will advertise a king pin wt that is inaccurate once it leaves the factory. Go by the sticker.
So knowing your payload and knowing the 20% king pin wt will help you to decide and 5th wheel no more than about 15K lbs.
You can also go to fleetford.com and look at the towing guide for your year for the numbers.
Senix, I did go on a cat scale when I went from Florida to Texas. I was loaded in bed of the truck and towing a 34 ft travel trailer. Here were the numbers. Hope they came out ok. Not sure how to interpret the numbers though.
steer axle is your front wheel.
Drive axle is your rear wheels.
Trailer is what is over those axles.
b
This I loaded weight with your TT. So what it does not tell you is the unloaded weight. That is what you need for the 5er calculations.
Based upon what I see, your rear axle has a RAGWR of probably 7K, unloaded is probably 3200 lbs. front is probably what is listed on your sheet or close to it.
steer axle is your front wheel.
Drive axle is your rear wheels.
Trailer is what is over those axles.
b
This I loaded weight with your TT. So what it does not tell you is the unloaded weight. That is what you need for the 5er calculations.
Based upon what I see, your rear axle has a RAGWR of probably 7K, unloaded is probably 3200 lbs. front is probably what is listed on your sheet or close to it.
I also have the sticker from the door jam. Thanks for your help.
truly missing is the unloaded weight (loaded with fuel, kids,wife.dog and hitch). unload minus the 10K gvwr should give you close to what is on the yellow stick for payload availability (3440 lbs).
20% of GVW of the trailer is probably a minimum number to use. Depending on how it was built, and how it is loaded, pin weight could be up to 25%. I was reading a post by a full-timer on a forum yesterday. They have been on the road for about 5 years, and he said that his pin weight has been at 23% pretty consistently.
If you have a toy hauler model, the pin weight can be much higher, as they are often built to hit about 20% when loaded. That means that they are pin heavy when not loaded, so that loading a heavy “toy” doesn’t take too much weight off the pin.
If you find that your 250 doesn’t have enough payload capacity, you might look at a similar floor plan in a bumper pull. You’ll normally run out of payload capacity long before you run out of towing capacity. By their nature, bumper pulls have less weight on the nose, so they don’t hit you as hard on your available payload.
Got to give real experience on this recommendation.
My father had a 11,000 GVWR bumper pull toy hauler. He just bought a new RZR that didn't fit in his existing toy hauler. He has a 2019 F-250 Crew Cab Short Bed. He just picked up a Vengeance Rogue Armored 4007. It's GVWR is 17,065. I'm telling you that that big ole 5th wheel tows so much better than that bumper pull its not even close. Its like night and day difference. It is so much more comfortable towing it than the bumper pull and all we did to my father's truck was install Stableloads. And yes, my father had a weight distribution hitch for that bumper pull toy hauler...
Got to give real experience on this recommendation.
My father had a 11,000 GVWR bumper pull toy hauler. He just bought a new RZR that didn't fit in his existing toy hauler. He has a 2019 F-250 Crew Cab Short Bed. He just picked up a Vengeance Rogue Armored 4007. It's GVWR is 17,065. I'm telling you that that big ole 5th wheel tows so much better than that bumper pull its not even close. Its like night and day difference. It is so much more comfortable towing it than the bumper pull and all we did to my father's truck was install Stableloads. And yes, my father had a weight distribution hitch for that bumper pull toy hauler...
My 2 cents...
This is a real life response. Many will advocate for bumper pull trailers over fifth wheels for F250 owners. This is solely based on the payload sticker and I believe it is a disservice. The choice is mush more nuanced than that. I can assure you that you will be more comfortable (and safer) with a fifth wheel that puts you over the payload sticker than you will be with a bumper pull that leaves you just under. I have towed numerous bumper pull trailers with many different trucks. This is my first fifth wheel (relatively light at 11,995 GVWR) and I am over the payload sticker capacity of my truck. I now get to enjoy the most stable and composed ride of any of any combination I have owned. Instead of focusing on a payload sticker, I recommend you focus on the actual components of your particular truck. Within the F250 line, there are significant variables in the suspension components that impact load carrying (tires, wheels, rear axles, front coils, rear overloads). In spite of these variables, GVWR and the rear axle rating are going to be 10,000 lbs. (higher for certain MY 20 configurations) and 6340 lbs. (still the same for MY 20 despite the increase in GVWR) respectively. Look at the actual rating of the components of your specific truck. The tires (or possibly just the level that they are inflated to) are often the limiting factor. If you are within the tire, wheel and to axle ratings, you are golden from a practical standpoint.
So long as I was under the axle weight limits, I too would rather pull a fiver than an equivalent size and weight bumper pull. I don't agree with choosing bumper pull just to stay under the truck's gvwr.
15,000 lb fiver is likely on the long side. My preference is to go a little lighter and shorter. Can get a lot of camper 12,000ish lbs and under.
Just for numbers sake, my 5th toy hauler pin weight drops 600#s with a can am X3 loaded in the garage.
Originally Posted by Tom in PGH
20% of GVW of the trailer is probably a minimum number to use. Depending on how it was built, and how it is loaded, pin weight could be up to 25%. I was reading a post by a full-timer on a forum yesterday. They have been on the road for about 5 years, and he said that his pin weight has been at 23% pretty consistently.
If you have a toy hauler model, the pin weight can be much higher, as they are often built to hit about 20% when loaded. That means that they are pin heavy when not loaded, so that loading a heavy “toy” doesn’t take too much weight off the pin.
If you find that your 250 doesn’t have enough payload capacity, you might look at a similar floor plan in a bumper pull. You’ll normally run out of payload capacity long before you run out of towing capacity. By their nature, bumper pulls have less weight on the nose, so they don’t hit you as hard on your available payload.
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