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Thanks for your help Pirate. Maybe the 4th times a charm.... It now has 16” 300 lbs springs per your recommendation and it’s much better. Sitting at 28” (still would have preferred 27”) and the ride is nice. Although, passenger side has almost no preload and the driver side has an 1” or more. It’s sitting level. What’s wrong? Driver’s side with at least 1” of preload. Passenger side with no preload.
1. how much shock shaft is showing at ride height ?
2. I can see the spring code ( cant tell if it is a 16 or 18 ) on 1 spring but not the other. *** confirm both springs have 2 16 300 painted on them*****
i suspect the driver side spring is either not a 16” or not a 300
did you purchase the shocks from the place doing the install ? any chance they will swap out those 8” shocks for a 6” ?
my calculations are your upsprung weight is 3000 pounds. 8” shock with a 300 spring should net you 3” of up travel and 5” of down travel. and a 28” ride height.
a good goal is 50/50 up/down travel
with a 6” shock you could run a 500 pound 14” spring and still only have 3” of up travel but achieve your 27” ride height goal.
personally I prefer 4” of up travel but that is based on driving style. have you driven your around ? have you bottomed out the front suspension during your normal driving ?
1. how much shock shaft is showing at ride height ? They only have about 2" of shock showing.
2. I can see the spring code on 1 spring but not the other. confirm both springs have 2 16 300 painted on them. They are both 3 16 300, one is upside down.
i suspect the driver side spring is either not a 16” or not a 300. Both shocks came directly from King and are the same length.
did you purchase the shocks from the place doing the install ? any chance they will swap out those 8” shocks for a 6” ? Shocks were purchased directly from Full Traction as part of their kit (not through the install shop), supposedly specifically made and valved for the Excursion diesel. Full Traction has been incredibly difficult to deal with. I purchased their 4.5" lift, and got 8", which were the wrong shocks, then they sent new ones that put me about 7" high, thus why I keep trying different springs to get it lower. Bottom line is that I don't know, but highly doubt they will switch them out.
my calculations are your upsprung weight is 3000 pounds. 8” shock with a 300 spring should net you 3” of up travel and 5” of down travel. and a 28” ride height. I think you're accurate.
a good goal is 50/50 up/down travel
with a 6” shock you could run a 500 pound 14” spring and still only have 3” of up travel but achieve your 27” ride height goal.
personally I prefer 4” of up travel but that is based on driving style. have you driven your around ? have you bottomed out the front suspension during your normal driving ? I have taken it for a test drive, but no big dips, so didn't bottom out. I'm going to pick it up today. It will be used 95% on street and 5% on fire roads.
Thanks for your help, wish Full Traction and the shop were more knowledgeable about their business.
Drew the engineer who designed that kit is a old friend of mine, he no longer works for FT and now owns https://goatbuilt.com/
my opinion it is still the best 4 link kit on the market however the shocks and valving is not his work, this kit was designed back in 05-06 and at the time Drew had just joined FT after being the engineer at Sway Away race shock company.
the reason I bring all this up, as you have found out FT lacks a helpful after sale support system, suspensions are complicated and FT has not had a technical staff that understands what they are selling for many years. it is up to the shop or person doing the suspension build to know how to setup a suspension that meets the customers desire.
The FT link suspension is flexible enough to accommodate many different ride heights but FT sells a one size fits all shock. you are calling it a 8” lift kit” but in reality it can be whatever you want it to be if you use the correct shock and spring.
I am going to call Drew and spit ball some ideas with him. in the mean time, go test drive your Ex and see how hard you can hit a dip to bottom it out. but don't get those shocks dirty just yet. me think you are going to want to trade them in.
3600/2=1600 pounds unsprung each front corner weight
8” shock - 2” shaft showing = 6” compressed
300 pound per inch spring x 6” of compression = 1800 pounds corner weight.
1800 pounds x 2 corners = 3600 pounds front unsprung weight.
damn that 6.0 is heavy
So, are you saying that 300 lbs spring is ok? I talked to Full Traction this morning and they are saying that stock Excursion had a 500 lbs spring and that's what I should be using, although I have no confidence in them.
3600/2=1600 pounds unsprung each front corner weight
8” shock - 2” shaft showing = 6” compressed
300 pound per inch spring x 6” of compression = 1800 pounds corner weight.
1800 pounds x 2 corners = 3600 pounds front unsprung weight.
damn that 6.0 is heavy
Pirate - I got the Ex back and it's fine for ride and not bottoming out, but still at 28", which is too high for me. Hate to throw good money after bad, but what you suggested having a 6" shock, 500 lbs 14" springs is probably what I really need. Would that get me to 27"? Maybe 26.5" with more preload? Also, lesson learned - never go with a suspension shop where the guy says, "I'm not really a math guy".
your 8” shock has 2” of shaft showing and a ride height of 28”. using a 16” 300 lb spring.
a 6” shock with 2” of shaft showing would result in s 26” ride height.
however 2” of shaft showing is not enough up travel in my opinion. so to get at least 3” of shaft showing you need a stiffer spring. more shaft showing equals more up travel available. to get to 3” of shaft showing you need a stiffer spring to keep it from sagging the current 6”.
a shorter travel shock ( shaft length ) requires a shorter body which results in shorter overall shock length. but for your purposes a shorter body means the axle can move further up without bottoming out on the shock body. so by going from a 8” shock to a 6” shock the axle can move 2” closer to the frame in its up travel.
put those 2 things together, a shorter body so the axle can move closer to the frame at full stuff and a stiffer spring to the shock from compressing at ride height and you get ?
do the math, all the variables are.
1600 lbs unsprung corner weight
current ride height is 28”
current shock has 8” of travel
uptravel is 2”
current spring is 300 lbs
caveat, you need to figure out why one the adjustment collars are not equal in the last pics you posted. if it is because as i suspect the track bar loading one side then my unsprung weight calculation is off. you must resolve the uneven adjustment before you do anything else.
for all we know your ride height may be 27” once the adjusters are even. right now you have a unbalanced weight distribution that needs to be resolved.
to check if your axle is centered, measure from the inside edge of the tire to the frame.
make sure the tires are pointed straight ahead snd measure from the same spot on each tire to the same spot on the frame. take your time and get a accurate measurement within a 1/16”
this will tell us it the track bar is the culprit.
or, take it to an alignment shop and have the alignment done which you should do anyhow.
I have experimented with many alignment setups and personally find
toe +.03*
steer ahead 0*
camber -.5*
caster +5*
split .5 *
axle centered at ride height +/- 1/16”
to be my favorite. whatever you decide on alignment wise make sure to get a before and after print out.
then jot down driving impressions with that setup on the paper. great way to learn and find your preferred setup.
also, be sure to have proper psi in the tires. stock size tires the proper psi is on your door label. for 35s or 37s it is LOWER. ( that is for another thread but if those are your sizes I will get up the correct psi )
to check if your axle is centered, measure from the inside edge of the tire to the frame.
make sure the tires are pointed straight ahead snd measure from the same spot on each tire to the same spot on the frame. take your time and get a accurate measurement within a 1/16”
this will tell us it the track bar is the culprit.
or, take it to an alignment shop and have the alignment done which you should do anyhow.
I have experimented with many alignment setups and personally find
toe +.03*
steer ahead 0*
camber -.5*
caster +5*
split .5 *
axle centered at ride height +/- 1/16”
Looks like my axel is 0.5" off.
Alignment:
toe +.125
steer ahead Don't know
camber -.5
caster Left +4.5, Right +5.5
split Don't know
Need to figure out if a 6" shocks and 14" spring will work. Just went to 4WheelParts and they thought some of the components could hit.
4wp ? what happened to the shop that did the install ?
anyhow is the concern the sway bar arm hitting ? if do that is a easy fix, use a shorter link.
the track bar bolt may hit the diff cover that way it is installed, but that is also an easy fix. install the bolt from the other direction.
I do not think the axle off center 1/2” explains the whole story, but it might. center it up and find out.
be sure to drive it a little bit to cycle the suspension before measuring hub center to fender. adjust spring collar up accordingly. drive and check again. repeat as needed.
split is the difference left to right caster. this keeps the vehicle tracking straight on crowned roads.
if yours pulls on flat and level highways then have it adjusted down from the current 1*
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