I'm at a loss and could use some experienced input. I bought a 2011 Expedition EL about 3 months ago that had just under 111K miles on it (one owner bought it from a dealer that had taken it on trade in). About 3 weeks ago I noticed a ticking noise then last weekend it had gotten worse and it seemed like my vehicle had lost some power. I took it to the local Ford dealer and 2 days later they came back with bad news and a $4900 estimate to repair it (diagnostic report attached) The vehicle doesn't have an extended warranty and no coverage from the dealer I purchased it from.

I paid $14K for the vehicle so a $4900 repair on a vehicle I've owned 3 months is pretty hard to swallow. It has been a few days since I got the estimate and I think I've decided to get it repaired vs. trading it in and getting something else (made that decision pretty quickly when my wife kept showing me $40K used options with lower mileage).

The estimate doesn't have an hourly total or a labor charge per hour. I have a trusted local shop that said they can do the repair and provide a comparable warranty to Ford however they said they can't give me an estimate without visually inspecting the issue. He said he could "probably save me some money" but doesn't want to commit to a price.

Can anyone with experience look at the attached estimate and give me an idea on what it should cost if done at a reputable local show or give me an idea of labor hours required? I'm leaning towards taking it to the local shop but hard to make that decision not knowing how much it will save me. Merry Christmas!

 

Don't have time to get into detail, but it looks like you've a fairly expensive problem regardless of who fixes it.

Chilton labor guide quotes 9.6 hours to replace both camshaft, with extra time for the tensioner assemblies as well as parts. Ask the dealer what their hourly labor rate years, and compare it with your local shop. Usually they seem about 20% higher, so you would certainly have a savings going with the independent shop.

But you also may be better off going with a used engine from a salvage yard, which can often be had for around $1000. Labor to swap the engine may place that significantly cheaper than preparing the one you have under the hood. A remanufactured option might also be a good choice, because you have fresh power with a warranty for not much more than your have been quoted already.

 

So they found one failed rocker and they want to replace both cams and all rockers and lash adjusters? Sounds very overkill to me. I normally only sell the one cam and failed rocker plus check all of the others on that side. But the catch 22 is is another rocker fails on the same side at a later point then there would be no warranty coverage on the previous repair. So damned if you do, damned if you don't. Either repair would be valid they are covering their butt and yours by recommending everything to be replaced. These ain't cheap engines to repair properly and have them last. I would probably have them do just the one side cam, rockers, and lash adjusters if I had to pay the bill.

 

eldrima,

This is the best video I have seen for your problem. Makuloco is very good on Fords and makes first class videos. If you need to replace the cam phasers he says always use the Ford ones.
Good luck,
Richard
2007 Navigator

 

The price is high, especially for the spark plug replacement, since they are already in there. But, they are recommending the exact repair I would with the problems you have. You have a bad cam and a bad roller/follower. All the others are the same age and mileage. If the cam looks worn on the non-failed lobes, then it means some of the other rollers may not be far behind, plus if the cam shows wear on other lobes, so does the other side.

You hear a cold start up rattle. Need to change all timing components including the VCTs. The only thing I didn't see was a new high volume oil pump, which I would add while in there. That's lots of money to put into a engine with over 100k on it. The alternatives are to get a used engine that may have the same problem as yours very soon, or a Ford reman, that had been rebuilt by who knows, using Ford timing parts, or maybe not.

Ford contracts out the remans to whoever gives the cheapest price, so who knows. I feel your pain. I don't know what I would do in your case. Most likely I would repair it myself with all Ford parts. Many people are not able to do that, so it's back to what to do.

I have wanted an Expedition since I sold my '03 years ago. I don't trust the 3 valve engines, not do I trust the eco-boost engines, especially the first gen with no dual injection to keep the intake valves clean. The way we use a vehicle, an eco-boost would rarely get hot enough to keep the fuel burnt out of the engine oil.

I truly hope you can come up with a solution and not be stuck with an expensive piece of yard art. Please keep us informed as what you do.

 

How much is the Ford reman 5.4l 3v engine? The benefit with those are the factory warranty that comes with them. Repairing your own at $4900 seems a little high for repairing a used engine. If you have time ask FordTechMakuLoco of Youtube fame. He is the 5.4L guru and has many videos about them. I have used him twice and would prefer him to dealers if he was closer. Or as others have said for much less you could find a take out low mileage 5.4l and just replace yours albeit with no guarantee but who knows what your $4900 repaired engine will be doing soon? I second the high volume oil pump suggestion for the repaired engine if you believe of what is in the below videos:

 

This is the same tech I take advice from , he is to the point and straight forward.

 

I have the same ticking noise on the right side. What did you finally end up doing?

 

It’s likely a rocker arm, pull off the valve cover and inspect for a seizing one. Replace the bad one if you are tight on dough or preferably replace all of them. Any startup rattle? If so a tensioner is bleeding pressure off and you’ll want to address that.

 

No startup rattle yet, thank goodness. I ordered 3 replacement roller rockers with plans to just replace the bad one(s) for now. I plan on doing the complete replacement, timing chain, and oil pump replacement when I have the money. I'm kinda nervous about doing it myself but Ford Tech Makuloco makes it look doable. Also, knowing that there are others here who can help me out if I run into trouble makes me feel a little more confident.

 

I’m 21 and on a budget with this covid-19 slowdown so I did the work myself (I had the startup rattle). It was doable but difficult at times. I replaced the timing chain tensioners, guides, arms, and oil pump. I re-used the timing chains and replaced one rocker arm because it fell somewhere in the suspension area and I couldn’t find it. I found no damage and no cam cap scoring in my engine just one blown out chain tensioner gasket. I’m an OEM guy, I skipped the Melling hype as my original oil pump did a good job keeping everything tip top. Used all OEM components from Tasca Ford. Ford made some changes to the oil pump. Here is the old 2007 pump removed and cleaned up vs the brand new 2020 one I installed. Runs great and no more rattle!

Old:

New:

 

My biggest piece of advice to offer you is when you do it get a 8mm swivel head ratcheting box wrench. That bottom oil pickup tube bolt was the hardest part of the job. The new tensioners have a white O-ring now, my old one’s were brown gaskets. Hopefully the new O-ring Ford came up with is better. It feels like a silicone material now vs rubber on the old:

 

Thanks so much for the advice. That's the kind of information I need to build my confidence!!!