No power after cold start
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Junior User
Joined: Dec 2009
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I had the truck in the workshop and the result is that 2 injectors stick when cold, the injector module has not enough voltage and the egr exhaust return valve is stuck in a slightley open position. The cost to fix this all would be around $2500.
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,246
Likes: 761
From: Houston, Texas
So, none of you smarty-pantses has an answer? Or did I turn you away with my comments about Bill Hewitt's endorsed product?
Here's another related question: Is it possible to hear an injector as it's going south? My truck just developed a vibrating sound that I only hear at around 3k rpms right before the tranny shifts gears. It sounds like its coming from the front right, but it could also be a vibration in the dashboard. Just wondering...
Here's another related question: Is it possible to hear an injector as it's going south? My truck just developed a vibrating sound that I only hear at around 3k rpms right before the tranny shifts gears. It sounds like its coming from the front right, but it could also be a vibration in the dashboard. Just wondering...
If your truck has the latest calibration on the PCM and FICM, it may just be doing what it was programmed to do.
My Buddy called me about his 2007 and said the same thing. The truck was laggy and felt like a 5.4 V8. I went over with my IDS in-hand and come to find out didn't need it...
3 years ago, I spoke with the person who wrote the programming for these trucks and he gave me some intricate details on how and why they did what they did.
Ford had warranty claims for people who just got in their truck and took off, foot to the floor sometimes with no regard for letting the truck gradually warm up. He went on to say that people often did this with the heaviest of trailers in tow. So to prevent this type of engine damage, they limit the power until the EOT reaches 170 degrees.
When I drove my Buddy's '07, it drove normally and didn't fully wake up until it reached 170-190 degrees. He swore up and down it wouldn't drive normally at all, but he's used to gas trucks and just taking off right after you fire it up.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,246
Likes: 761
From: Houston, Texas
I had the truck in the workshop and the result is that 2 injectors stick when cold, the injector module has not enough voltage and the egr exhaust return valve is stuck in a slightley open position. The cost to fix this all would be around $2500.
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
Injectors are easy on the 6.0, the FICM is accessible once you move the degas bottle, the FICM can easily be repaired, the EGR valve may just need to be cleaned. If after cleaning with carb cleaner it STILL hangs open, just replace it.
If you were close to me, I'd have to fixed up for $900 parts and labor. This would include resealing all the other injectors.
Bottom line: Do the work yourself, it's not hard and there are plenty of video on Youtube.
Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,422
Likes: 938
From: Fort Worth, TX
Thanks for your input, and best wishes to you too!
Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,422
Likes: 938
From: Fort Worth, TX
I'll take that...
If your truck has the latest calibration on the PCM and FICM, it may just be doing what it was programmed to do.
My Buddy called me about his 2007 and said the same thing. The truck was laggy and felt like a 5.4 V8. I went over with my IDS in-hand and come to find out didn't need it...
3 years ago, I spoke with the person who wrote the programming for these trucks and he gave me some intricate details on how and why they did what they did.
Ford had warranty claims for people who just got in their truck and took off, foot to the floor sometimes with no regard for letting the truck gradually warm up. He went on to say that people often did this with the heaviest of trailers in tow. So to prevent this type of engine damage, they limit the power until the EOT reaches 170 degrees.
When I drove my Buddy's '07, it drove normally and didn't fully wake up until it reached 170-190 degrees. He swore up and down it wouldn't drive normally at all, but he's used to gas trucks and just taking off right after you fire it up.
If your truck has the latest calibration on the PCM and FICM, it may just be doing what it was programmed to do.
My Buddy called me about his 2007 and said the same thing. The truck was laggy and felt like a 5.4 V8. I went over with my IDS in-hand and come to find out didn't need it...
3 years ago, I spoke with the person who wrote the programming for these trucks and he gave me some intricate details on how and why they did what they did.
Ford had warranty claims for people who just got in their truck and took off, foot to the floor sometimes with no regard for letting the truck gradually warm up. He went on to say that people often did this with the heaviest of trailers in tow. So to prevent this type of engine damage, they limit the power until the EOT reaches 170 degrees.
When I drove my Buddy's '07, it drove normally and didn't fully wake up until it reached 170-190 degrees. He swore up and down it wouldn't drive normally at all, but he's used to gas trucks and just taking off right after you fire it up.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,246
Likes: 761
From: Houston, Texas
Thanks TD for that explanation, but can you give me a little more detail about how your friend's truck performed when cold. Mine has absolutely not guts. It can be a road hazard turning right on red if oncoming traffic isn't WAY up the road at this corner by the house where cars are going 50-60mph. Even if that's the deal, I still need to find the source of my occasional hard start issue. And now an annoying vibrating noise, apparently...
I connected the IDS, ran a relative compression test, and it showed me that two injectors on each side were bad due to damage from low fuel pressure. I replaced the 4 bad ones with new, resealed the other 4, and it runs beautifully now. Between the intake manifold I cleaned while servicing the EGR cooler, new injectors, and a mild tune, his truck sips fuel and runs like a scalded ape.
Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,422
Likes: 938
From: Fort Worth, TX
If only I had IDS. AE is useless for testing individual injectors.
Do you have any input on the white-capped injectors vs black-capped injectors thing? As in, is one more desirable than the other? And if I want to move up to the black-capped ones, do I have to replace them all at the same time? It would be much easier for me financially if I could do one bank at a time.
Scalded ape, LOL! I would love a mild tune, but still working with original head gaskets and studs I'm a bit weary.
Do you have any input on the white-capped injectors vs black-capped injectors thing? As in, is one more desirable than the other? And if I want to move up to the black-capped ones, do I have to replace them all at the same time? It would be much easier for me financially if I could do one bank at a time.
Scalded ape, LOL! I would love a mild tune, but still working with original head gaskets and studs I'm a bit weary.
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FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,246
Likes: 761
From: Houston, Texas
If only I had IDS. AE is useless for testing individual injectors.
Do you have any input on the white-capped injectors vs black-capped injectors thing? As in, is one more desirable than the other? And if I want to move up to the black-capped ones, do I have to replace them all at the same time? It would be much easier for me financially if I could do one bank at a time.
Scalded ape, LOL! I would love a mild tune, but still working with original head gaskets and studs I'm a bit weary.
Do you have any input on the white-capped injectors vs black-capped injectors thing? As in, is one more desirable than the other? And if I want to move up to the black-capped ones, do I have to replace them all at the same time? It would be much easier for me financially if I could do one bank at a time.
Scalded ape, LOL! I would love a mild tune, but still working with original head gaskets and studs I'm a bit weary.
More Turbo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 695
Likes: 78
From: Almost Heaven
I had the truck in the workshop and the result is that 2 injectors stick when cold, the injector module has not enough voltage and the egr exhaust return valve is stuck in a slightley open position. The cost to fix this all would be around $2500.
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
I could live with low power till motor has warmed up but I would hate to be stranded if the motor does not start in the cold.
What is your advise?
FICMRepair.com - FORD Powerstroke 6.0 FICM Repair, PHP Tuning and Truck Parts
Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,422
Likes: 938
From: Fort Worth, TX
I'm not familiar with the white capped injectors Vs. black capped injectors, however if they're bad, I replace them with Motorcraft Remans or Pure Power Diesel Injectors. He's running the 40 HP tow tune on my SCT X3. If your truck is bone stock or close to it, the Atlas 40 runs good and gives better power and fuel economy without increasing cylinder pressures. It's the same was going to an earlier FICM calibration.
Early Injectors: (White Top)
Ford Part Number: 3C3Z-9E527-AE
Fits 2002.5 - 2003 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1843089C91, 1845879C91, 1843481C94, 1843481C95
Fits 2003 - 2004 International VT365 6.0L
Late Injectors: (Black Top)
Ford Part Number: 4C3Z-9E527-AA
Fits 2004 - 2006 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1844751C2, 1846692C92
Fits 2004 - 2006 International VT365 6.0L and VT275 4.5L
I'll be sending Mark (Bismic) a pm about it and hopefully he can enlighten us.
I've been considering the Atlas 40 tune, as I've only read positive things about it. The last thing I read was that it makes the truck feel like a gasser. An exaggeration I"m sure, but maybe the better cold start power is what they were trying to convey.
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 74
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You could give archoil/hotshots or rev-x a try before replacing the injectors. I am having good results with hotshots so far. I second cleaning the egr valve. If your FICM voltage is low are your batteries and alternator ok? If the ficm voltage is low with good batteries and alternator then send it to Ed at:
FICMRepair.com - FORD Powerstroke 6.0 FICM Repair, PHP Tuning and Truck Parts
More Turbo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 695
Likes: 78
From: Almost Heaven
no worries. Im goin to give em all a try.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,901
Likes: 3,617
From the tech folder:
Early Injectors: (White Top)
Ford Part Number: 3C3Z-9E527-AE
Fits 2002.5 - 2003 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1843089C91, 1845879C91, 1843481C94, 1843481C95
Fits 2003 - 2004 International VT365 6.0L
Late Injectors: (Black Top)
Ford Part Number: 4C3Z-9E527-AA
Fits 2004 - 2006 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1844751C2, 1846692C92
Fits 2004 - 2006 International VT365 6.0L and VT275 4.5L
I'll be sending Mark (Bismic) a pm about it and hopefully he can enlighten us.
I've been considering the Atlas 40 tune, as I've only read positive things about it. The last thing I read was that it makes the truck feel like a gasser. An exaggeration I"m sure, but maybe the better cold start power is what they were trying to convey.
Early Injectors: (White Top)
Ford Part Number: 3C3Z-9E527-AE
Fits 2002.5 - 2003 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1843089C91, 1845879C91, 1843481C94, 1843481C95
Fits 2003 - 2004 International VT365 6.0L
Late Injectors: (Black Top)
Ford Part Number: 4C3Z-9E527-AA
Fits 2004 - 2006 Ford Powerstroke 6.0L
International Part Numbers: 1844751C2, 1846692C92
Fits 2004 - 2006 International VT365 6.0L and VT275 4.5L
I'll be sending Mark (Bismic) a pm about it and hopefully he can enlighten us.
I've been considering the Atlas 40 tune, as I've only read positive things about it. The last thing I read was that it makes the truck feel like a gasser. An exaggeration I"m sure, but maybe the better cold start power is what they were trying to convey.
The difference is a "diamond like coating"on the plunger.
I have always wondered if the updated pump design for the wavy oil rails (supposedly had a higher rated discharge pressure) had anything to do with Ford's recommendation/position.
IIRC npccpartsman mixed them w/ no issue (but my memory is sketchy on this).
I think the consensus is that the newer injectors are better.
