Ticking 400
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Tuned
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 351
Likes: 57
Ticking 400
Started a thread for my crew awhile back. Can’t find it now. Have recently started driving it again and the engines been making a heavy ticking noise.
Noise doesn’t occur to bad when the oils thick but when the truck warms up it really starts. Can be heard at idle, gets louder up through 3000 rpm. Louder with the pedal down than it is while engine braking at the same rpm. But still audible while engine braking.
Finished a timing chain install before I started driving it. About a year and a half ago I did a cylinder leak down test. The drivers side bank all held 120+ pounds but the pasenger side were all 80-100.
What are you guys thoughts on it? I don’t really have any experience diagnosing engine sounds. I’d like to pull the pass valve cover off and see if anything in there needs adjusted or replaced. I’ve heard that valve guides could cause the leak down but they wouldn’t tick would they?
FTE Legend
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 30,912
Likes: 4,123
From: Angier, NC
The tick I see can be 2 things, a lifter or 2 or an exh manifold leak.
What weight oil you running and what is the oil PSI cold & hot? You do have an aftermarket gauge and not the factory to tell right?
Check around the exh manifolds more so the under side for leaks. Maybe have someone start the motor and you look the motor over to see if you can se any smoke from them.
Did this start before or after the chain change out?
Dave ----
What weight oil you running and what is the oil PSI cold & hot? You do have an aftermarket gauge and not the factory to tell right?
Check around the exh manifolds more so the under side for leaks. Maybe have someone start the motor and you look the motor over to see if you can se any smoke from them.
Did this start before or after the chain change out?
Dave ----
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 351
Likes: 57
The tick I see can be 2 things, a lifter or 2 or an exh manifold leak.
What weight oil you running and what is the oil PSI cold & hot? You do have an aftermarket gauge and not the factory to tell right?
Check around the exh manifolds more so the under side for leaks. Maybe have someone start the motor and you look the motor over to see if you can se any smoke from them.
Did this start before or after the chain change out?
Dave ----
What weight oil you running and what is the oil PSI cold & hot? You do have an aftermarket gauge and not the factory to tell right?
Check around the exh manifolds more so the under side for leaks. Maybe have someone start the motor and you look the motor over to see if you can se any smoke from them.
Did this start before or after the chain change out?
Dave ----
I think I’ve replaced the manifold gasket within the last two years. Ticking has kinda been there for the last 3-4 years I think. Truck had loud leaky exhaust, many holes in floor, destroyed transmission. I’ve fixed all the things now but the sound still persists. It used to not bother me but I think it might be louder since the timing chain.
Cargo Master
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,600
Likes: 64
From: Billings, MT
Agreed, exhaust leak or lifter eating a cam lube. You can use a heater hose to your ear and probe around the exhaust like a stethoscope. On the lifter side you can pull the valve covers and check for loose pushrod or use a dial indicator to check lift at the rocker arms.
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,436
Likes: 19
From: Regina, Saskatchewan
Do you add anything to the oil to bring up the ZDDP content? I believe you might be whiping out your cam if the oil you're using does not have very high ZDDP content as these old school truck's need zinc to protect the cam whereas modern oils have more detergents nowadays. I could be wrong though, so don't panic. It's just a question for now because I don't know anything about high mileage oils.
Also, I had what I thought was an exhaust tick when I rebuilt my motor, but it turned out to be that a push rod was too long (I had my block decked and heads shaved) which was causing the lifter to stay fully collapsed (lowest possible position) when running. If you have a bad lifter, or a rebuilt motor with too long of push rods, it could be the source of your ticking problem.
The 351M and 400 have non-adjustable rocker arms (unlike all the other motors of this era) so keep that in mind when you're looking over stuff.
Also, I had what I thought was an exhaust tick when I rebuilt my motor, but it turned out to be that a push rod was too long (I had my block decked and heads shaved) which was causing the lifter to stay fully collapsed (lowest possible position) when running. If you have a bad lifter, or a rebuilt motor with too long of push rods, it could be the source of your ticking problem.
The 351M and 400 have non-adjustable rocker arms (unlike all the other motors of this era) so keep that in mind when you're looking over stuff.
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More Turbo
Joined: Feb 2018
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From: Oregon
I researched the ZDDP thing quite a bit and I think it's all hogwash..the only time you need higher ZDDP is when you are breaking in a new Cam. Found lots of posts on either side of the fence and also found a couple long posts by an oil engineer showing how it's not needed.
Anyway, I always use a high mileage oil in my vehicles
Anyway, I always use a high mileage oil in my vehicles
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Tuned
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 474
Likes: 11
Might just need to be driven more. My '77 F250 w/ 351M sat for a while without much use and starting ticking on me and was marking the driveway with oil spots. I drove it maybe 200 miles in 2 years before the tick started. I didn't change the oil or anything, just started driving it more and within 200 miles or so it went away and hasn't been back since. The oil leaks have gone away too. These old trucks don't like to sit. I drive mine MUCH more frequently and it seems to keep "breaking in" and running better and better (motor was rebuilt in 2013 and only had about 500 miles on it between then and 2018, when I started driving it weekly). Not really applicable, but I like to ramble...
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 351
Likes: 57
I don’t know about oil and I dang sure ain’t a scientist but the way I see it there’s a whole bunch of old cars out there not getting additive.
Rained all Saturday and most of sunday. Changed oil to a gallon of 10w30 rotella t4 conventional and 2 quarts 15w40 rotella t5 with a fl1-a filter. Ticking has gone down drastically but it’s still there.
so if it’s not an exhaust leak we are leaning towards a lifter? If it is a lifter how would I check it? I’m assuming not with just the valve cover off.
Rained all Saturday and most of sunday. Changed oil to a gallon of 10w30 rotella t4 conventional and 2 quarts 15w40 rotella t5 with a fl1-a filter. Ticking has gone down drastically but it’s still there.
so if it’s not an exhaust leak we are leaning towards a lifter? If it is a lifter how would I check it? I’m assuming not with just the valve cover off.
Tuned
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 474
Likes: 11
One of these will go a long way to finding the source of your various noises...or just a long screw driver will work too.
Tuned
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 474
Likes: 11
You can manipulate the throttle at the carb. Just grab the linkage and twist, very simple. Put the screwdriver/stethoscope on the valve cover - if it's a lifter/valve you'll hear it clearly. Put it on the header and you'll also hear it clearly if you have a leak - at least I have. You'll be surprised what type and how clear the noises are using a stethoscope. I assume a screwdriver is similar, but I've always had a stethoscope so....
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,831
Likes: 121
From: St Albert, Alberta
Lifter tick is very common on the 351M/400's. Usually the culprit is worn rockers/fulcrums/push rods. In most cases if the rockers are worn the cam and lifters are as well. The quickest thing to do is pull a valve cover and check the rocker on the fulcrum seat and see how much wear is on it. If it is grooved it time to replace the valve train (cam,lifters,push rods,rockers,) Oils back in the day were not great at shear protection and the 335 series were know for rapid valve train wear and will be the first bits that wear out on the engine. Roller rockers are one of the best upgrades (short of a double roller cam chain) you can do on 335 series engines even stock ones.
I strongly advise pulling a valve cover and a rocker and inspecting it. If you are unsure post a pic once you pull one and we can tell you if it is shot...
I strongly advise pulling a valve cover and a rocker and inspecting it. If you are unsure post a pic once you pull one and we can tell you if it is shot...