Another suspension thread
Thread Starter
|
Cross-Country
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 90
Likes: 3
Another suspension thread
Looking to upgrade my suspension. 2001 7.3 243000 miles
Current stock
fl:22.25 fr: 22
rl:24 rr:24
goals are ride quality with minor lift no more than 3 inches. I don’t want to go higher than a stock f250/350.
V/c or procomp?
thanks
Current stock
fl:22.25 fr: 22
rl:24 rr:24
goals are ride quality with minor lift no more than 3 inches. I don’t want to go higher than a stock f250/350.
V/c or procomp?
thanks
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,259
Likes: 346
From: Northern California
Procomp 22210/22415 will increase your ride height to 27”
one FTE member reports pulling 1 leaf from each pack and achieving 25 front 26 rear however I have not done a calculation
on the spring rates with a leaf removed, my gut says the front would be fine since the procomp is a tad stiffer (420 lbs in. ) then it needs to be, the rear however the procomp is right on the money and I think pulling a leaf would then require a airbag for any towing.
the X/Mod C setup as i have most frequently seen it puts you at 26-27 the problem with that is the front similar to the procomps is a tad to high spring rate but manageable, The rear however is ridiculous when you run it as a C or B without the mod part. Basically you are riding around on the overload spring with a spring rate of 1000 lbs in when you target spring rate should be about 380 lbs in ( Procomp 22415 is 380 lbs in. )
for the record stock your Ex had 380 lbs in. Front and 410 lbs in. Rear.
In summary, procomp 22210-22415 If you can’t live with 27” then pull a spring from the pack and add air bags to the rear.
Should be noted that by removing the block from the rear with the procomps at 27” not only does it change the ride height but the corner weights and balance of the vehicle, you don’t need sway bars or at least don’t need to add a rear one, removing g the block minimizes axle wrap so you do t need a traction bar and with the 4.5 to 5* of caster it handle much better then stock, especially towing. The ride quality , dependings on your choice of shocks of course but at least it sorts out corner weights, body roll and axle wrap.
one FTE member reports pulling 1 leaf from each pack and achieving 25 front 26 rear however I have not done a calculation
on the spring rates with a leaf removed, my gut says the front would be fine since the procomp is a tad stiffer (420 lbs in. ) then it needs to be, the rear however the procomp is right on the money and I think pulling a leaf would then require a airbag for any towing.
the X/Mod C setup as i have most frequently seen it puts you at 26-27 the problem with that is the front similar to the procomps is a tad to high spring rate but manageable, The rear however is ridiculous when you run it as a C or B without the mod part. Basically you are riding around on the overload spring with a spring rate of 1000 lbs in when you target spring rate should be about 380 lbs in ( Procomp 22415 is 380 lbs in. )
for the record stock your Ex had 380 lbs in. Front and 410 lbs in. Rear.
In summary, procomp 22210-22415 If you can’t live with 27” then pull a spring from the pack and add air bags to the rear.
Should be noted that by removing the block from the rear with the procomps at 27” not only does it change the ride height but the corner weights and balance of the vehicle, you don’t need sway bars or at least don’t need to add a rear one, removing g the block minimizes axle wrap so you do t need a traction bar and with the 4.5 to 5* of caster it handle much better then stock, especially towing. The ride quality , dependings on your choice of shocks of course but at least it sorts out corner weights, body roll and axle wrap.
Thread Starter
|
Cross-Country
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 90
Likes: 3
Procomp 22210/22415 will increase your ride height to 27”
one FTE member reports pulling 1 leaf from each pack and achieving 25 front 26 rear however I have not done a calculation
on the spring rates with a leaf removed, my gut says the front would be fine since the procomp is a tad stiffer (420 lbs in. ) then it needs to be, the rear however the procomp is right on the money and I think pulling a leaf would then require a airbag for any towing.
the X/Mod C setup as i have most frequently seen it puts you at 26-27 the problem with that is the front similar to the procomps is a tad to high spring rate but manageable, The rear however is ridiculous when you run it as a C or B without the mod part. Basically you are riding around on the overload spring with a spring rate of 1000 lbs in when you target spring rate should be about 380 lbs in ( Procomp 22415 is 380 lbs in. )
for the record stock your Ex had 380 lbs in. Front and 410 lbs in. Rear.
In summary, procomp 22210-22415 If you can’t live with 27” then pull a spring from the pack and add air bags to the rear.
Should be noted that by removing the block from the rear with the procomps at 27” not only does it change the ride height but the corner weights and balance of the vehicle, you don’t need sway bars or at least don’t need to add a rear one, removing g the block minimizes axle wrap so you do t need a traction bar and with the 4.5 to 5* of caster it handle much better then stock, especially towing. The ride quality , dependings on your choice of shocks of course but at least it sorts out corner weights, body roll and axle wrap.
one FTE member reports pulling 1 leaf from each pack and achieving 25 front 26 rear however I have not done a calculation
on the spring rates with a leaf removed, my gut says the front would be fine since the procomp is a tad stiffer (420 lbs in. ) then it needs to be, the rear however the procomp is right on the money and I think pulling a leaf would then require a airbag for any towing.
the X/Mod C setup as i have most frequently seen it puts you at 26-27 the problem with that is the front similar to the procomps is a tad to high spring rate but manageable, The rear however is ridiculous when you run it as a C or B without the mod part. Basically you are riding around on the overload spring with a spring rate of 1000 lbs in when you target spring rate should be about 380 lbs in ( Procomp 22415 is 380 lbs in. )
for the record stock your Ex had 380 lbs in. Front and 410 lbs in. Rear.
In summary, procomp 22210-22415 If you can’t live with 27” then pull a spring from the pack and add air bags to the rear.
Should be noted that by removing the block from the rear with the procomps at 27” not only does it change the ride height but the corner weights and balance of the vehicle, you don’t need sway bars or at least don’t need to add a rear one, removing g the block minimizes axle wrap so you do t need a traction bar and with the 4.5 to 5* of caster it handle much better then stock, especially towing. The ride quality , dependings on your choice of shocks of course but at least it sorts out corner weights, body roll and axle wrap.
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,259
Likes: 346
From: Northern California
some folks have done this setup without a drop pitman and drop track bar bracket but before I recommend that I need to measure and verify the angles myself.
Also, once he gets his setup I can measure the front caster and rear pinion angles myself to verify a 2* shim in the back corrects the pinion angle to within 1/2* , again I have calculated it and people have reported it is correct but I need to verify myself before I say yes, 2* is correct.
So my answer is maybe
pretty certain you will need an adjustable track bar to center the axle.
2* shim in the rear should correct your pinion if you have a single joint on each end ( non CV ) drive shaft
2* shim should give you 5.5* of caster in the front. But it may give you as much as 6*, not the end of the world. ( once I can Measure one I am going to have WFO make the exact shim and they will carry it )
go ahead and do it without a drop pitman arm or drop track bar but be prepared to add this if needed.
check amazon for prices on the springs, usually available for under $150 each with free freight
Thread Starter
|
Cross-Country
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 90
Likes: 3
I do not have the 22210 -22415 on my Ex currently as I have a 4 link front now so I do not have one handy that I can take measurements from at this moment. I am working with a local FTE member to measure some stuff on his so we can know exactly.
some folks have done this setup without a drop pitman and drop track bar bracket but before I recommend that I need to measure and verify the angles myself.
Also, once he gets his setup I can measure the front caster and rear pinion angles myself to verify a 2* shim in the back corrects the pinion angle to within 1/2* , again I have calculated it and people have reported it is correct but I need to verify myself before I say yes, 2* is correct.
So my answer is maybe
pretty certain you will need an adjustable track bar to center the axle.
2* shim in the rear should correct your pinion if you have a single joint on each end ( non CV ) drive shaft
2* shim should give you 5.5* of caster in the front. But it may give you as much as 6*, not the end of the world. ( once I can Measure one I am going to have WFO make the exact shim and they will carry it )
go ahead and do it without a drop pitman arm or drop track bar but be prepared to add this if needed.
check amazon for prices on the springs, usually available for under $150 each with free freight
some folks have done this setup without a drop pitman and drop track bar bracket but before I recommend that I need to measure and verify the angles myself.
Also, once he gets his setup I can measure the front caster and rear pinion angles myself to verify a 2* shim in the back corrects the pinion angle to within 1/2* , again I have calculated it and people have reported it is correct but I need to verify myself before I say yes, 2* is correct.
So my answer is maybe
pretty certain you will need an adjustable track bar to center the axle.
2* shim in the rear should correct your pinion if you have a single joint on each end ( non CV ) drive shaft
2* shim should give you 5.5* of caster in the front. But it may give you as much as 6*, not the end of the world. ( once I can Measure one I am going to have WFO make the exact shim and they will carry it )
go ahead and do it without a drop pitman arm or drop track bar but be prepared to add this if needed.
check amazon for prices on the springs, usually available for under $150 each with free freight
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,259
Likes: 346
From: Northern California
I can say definitively that at 8” of lift you need a longer shaft but at 4” I think you will be ok, I have never seen one come out at 4”. However when I can get the guinea pig Ex up in the air to do other measurements I will take the shaft apart and verify that as well.
Fwiw, they come apart due to axle wrap under panic braking so if you want to know if it is to short but are to lazy to take it apart and measure just find a back road and do a full fledge 65 mph panic stop. If it comes apart it is to short
if you are getting a new shaft anyhow you may as well give him the measurements between yokes and have it made to your new ride height, you would be silly not to.
Fwiw, they come apart due to axle wrap under panic braking so if you want to know if it is to short but are to lazy to take it apart and measure just find a back road and do a full fledge 65 mph panic stop. If it comes apart it is to short
if you are getting a new shaft anyhow you may as well give him the measurements between yokes and have it made to your new ride height, you would be silly not to.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,259
Likes: 346
From: Northern California
The rear brake line is long enough the fronts work or at least mine did if you relocate the mount down a little bit.
sway bar links, you can get longer ones but before you bother with that make sure you will even want to run them.
I know my Ex handles better And the ride is definitely better without sway bars but I have a good deal of time and effort invested in shock tuning, but even without that it is good to start a new suspension setup without them and add as required.
Remember you have dramatically changed corner weights, center of gravity, roll center and leverage points of your vehicle, do not assume it is going to be like it used to be or even like somebody else’s with a similar ride height but different spring, shock and tire package.
sway bar links, you can get longer ones but before you bother with that make sure you will even want to run them.
I know my Ex handles better And the ride is definitely better without sway bars but I have a good deal of time and effort invested in shock tuning, but even without that it is good to start a new suspension setup without them and add as required.
Remember you have dramatically changed corner weights, center of gravity, roll center and leverage points of your vehicle, do not assume it is going to be like it used to be or even like somebody else’s with a similar ride height but different spring, shock and tire package.
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 176
Likes: 0
From: Sunnyvale, CA.
Figured I would chime in here. I am about to do the Camo suspension mod (possible tech folder title? 
) I was originally talking with Junior at ats. And while they offer a solution, it ended up not being the one I want. I decided to go the pro comp route after reading through tons of threads and looking at pics. I concluded that I wanted an option that was more specific to the Excursion platform. Im not at all saying what ATS offers is bad, wrong, or whatever. Seems a solid route to go since they have made so many FTE members happy. And Junior is great to work with.
So far, I have about 90% of the parts to start the build, just waiting for the track bar to come and then one or two more paychecks to get some tuned shocks. Not to mention 3 boys keep me pretty busy... all in all im looking to spend about the same, maybe a little more, than the ATS setup.
When I get closer to starting this project I will open a build thread. It should be soon since I want to get it done before summer. I am currently nursing my 7 yr old back from a concussion so my other baby takes a back seat!
Cheers,
Pepper
) I was originally talking with Junior at ats. And while they offer a solution, it ended up not being the one I want. I decided to go the pro comp route after reading through tons of threads and looking at pics. I concluded that I wanted an option that was more specific to the Excursion platform. Im not at all saying what ATS offers is bad, wrong, or whatever. Seems a solid route to go since they have made so many FTE members happy. And Junior is great to work with.So far, I have about 90% of the parts to start the build, just waiting for the track bar to come and then one or two more paychecks to get some tuned shocks. Not to mention 3 boys keep me pretty busy... all in all im looking to spend about the same, maybe a little more, than the ATS setup.
When I get closer to starting this project I will open a build thread. It should be soon since I want to get it done before summer. I am currently nursing my 7 yr old back from a concussion so my other baby takes a back seat!
Cheers,
Pepper
Thread Starter
|
Cross-Country
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 90
Likes: 3
Figured I would chime in here. I am about to do the Camo suspension mod (possible tech folder title? ) I was originally talking with Junior at ats. And while they offer a solution, it ended up not being the one I want. I decided to go the pro comp route after reading through tons of threads and looking at pics. I concluded that I wanted an option that was more specific to the Excursion platform. Im not at all saying what ATS offers is bad, wrong, or whatever. Seems a solid route to go since they have made so many FTE members happy. And Junior is great to work with.
So far, I have about 90% of the parts to start the build, just waiting for the track bar to come and then one or two more paychecks to get some tuned shocks. Not to mention 3 boys keep me pretty busy... all in all im looking to spend about the same, maybe a little more, than the ATS setup.
When I get closer to starting this project I will open a build thread. It should be soon since I want to get it done before summer. I am currently nursing my 7 yr old back from a concussion so my other baby takes a back seat!
Cheers,
Pepper
) I was originally talking with Junior at ats. And while they offer a solution, it ended up not being the one I want. I decided to go the pro comp route after reading through tons of threads and looking at pics. I concluded that I wanted an option that was more specific to the Excursion platform. Im not at all saying what ATS offers is bad, wrong, or whatever. Seems a solid route to go since they have made so many FTE members happy. And Junior is great to work with.So far, I have about 90% of the parts to start the build, just waiting for the track bar to come and then one or two more paychecks to get some tuned shocks. Not to mention 3 boys keep me pretty busy... all in all im looking to spend about the same, maybe a little more, than the ATS setup.
When I get closer to starting this project I will open a build thread. It should be soon since I want to get it done before summer. I am currently nursing my 7 yr old back from a concussion so my other baby takes a back seat!
Cheers,
Pepper
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 816
Likes: 7
From: Prescott, AZ