1978 400 vs 460
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1978 400 vs 460
Hey guys, I got a '78 F250 with the 400, C6, and the married transfer case and I got a '77 F250 with the 460 and C6, two wheeler. The plan is to restore the '78 but I can't decide which motor to go with. I'm going to keep the 4x4 and add an OD unit or look at my options for different transmissions so I can get an OD gear. Any thoughts about the motors and recommendations for transmission options appreciated.
Hotshot
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: The Shenandoah Valley
What is intended use to be?
I'd leave the 400 in the '78, restore it, …. and sell the '77 with 460.
If the '77 is for spares, I'd use '77 grille, etc maybe. If you add OD to 4x4, only on rear axle side. If looking for a highway only truck, the '77 makes better sense IMHO, easier to add aftermarket OD.
I'd leave the 400 in the '78, restore it, …. and sell the '77 with 460.
If the '77 is for spares, I'd use '77 grille, etc maybe. If you add OD to 4x4, only on rear axle side. If looking for a highway only truck, the '77 makes better sense IMHO, easier to add aftermarket OD.
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2010
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From: Regina, Saskatchewan
I like the question, but this is a can of worms when it comes to opinions on 460 vs. 400.
I'm with Tbear. Keep the 400 and restore/modify it. It's a hearty engine that's fully capable of doing whatever you need. It's also the longest stroke motor Ford created in this era so it has TONS of low end grunt which is perfect for a truck application.
Others will tell you to use the 460, but I think they're wrong
hahaha
I'm with Tbear. Keep the 400 and restore/modify it. It's a hearty engine that's fully capable of doing whatever you need. It's also the longest stroke motor Ford created in this era so it has TONS of low end grunt which is perfect for a truck application.
Others will tell you to use the 460, but I think they're wrong
hahaha
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460 is heavier, but will give you more power. Lots of little changes to make the switch. You have a donor, but how much of that stuff is really serviceable and worth transferring? Exhaust, radiator? Lots of time and miles on those.
You can nearly double the HP out of that 400 with pistons and a decent cam & intake.
You might be able to use the 400 trans behind the 460 as the bell patterns are the same. Flexplate and TC and input issues need to be checked.
OD options are slim. An OD trans would be a major rework, and GV unit would be possible. Neither is inexpensive.
I'd freshen up the 400 truck and spend money on power instead of on parts and labor to do a swap.
You can nearly double the HP out of that 400 with pistons and a decent cam & intake.
You might be able to use the 400 trans behind the 460 as the bell patterns are the same. Flexplate and TC and input issues need to be checked.
OD options are slim. An OD trans would be a major rework, and GV unit would be possible. Neither is inexpensive.
I'd freshen up the 400 truck and spend money on power instead of on parts and labor to do a swap.
More Turbo
Joined: Sep 2003
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It's an easy answer. Pick the 460. Period.
It's 60 cubic inches bigger meaning it should produce around 75 more lb-ft of torque, and the torque will surpass the 400 from idle as high as you want to spin it.
Your butt dyno will tell you it's much stronger.
It shouldn't be that much heavier. As a percentage of total vehicle weight it's miniscule.
You can buy all sorts of speed parts for a 460, you'll have many fewer choices with the 400. New or used. So there's more competition.
Uses the same valvetrain and distributor, those are a wash.
As for the transmission,/transfer case, an E4OD from a '90s truck should give you what you need. I'm not sure if you'll reed to rotate the transfer case but if so, I believe it can be clocked.
I used to believe that tale that longer stroke made more torque but that's just not so. Torque is influenced primarily by engine displacement. With dynamometers virtually on every street corner and Enginemasters magazine and contest well publicized, the information is out there. Some factors do exist. For example, if you increase the stroke and keep the same connecting rods, the R/S ratio decreases and the torque peak should shift lower in the rpm range. Also increasing stroke is the quickest way to increase displacement on an engine, so increasing stroke certainly will increase torque because of the displacement increase.
R.
It's 60 cubic inches bigger meaning it should produce around 75 more lb-ft of torque, and the torque will surpass the 400 from idle as high as you want to spin it.
Your butt dyno will tell you it's much stronger.
It shouldn't be that much heavier. As a percentage of total vehicle weight it's miniscule.
You can buy all sorts of speed parts for a 460, you'll have many fewer choices with the 400. New or used. So there's more competition.
Uses the same valvetrain and distributor, those are a wash.
As for the transmission,/transfer case, an E4OD from a '90s truck should give you what you need. I'm not sure if you'll reed to rotate the transfer case but if so, I believe it can be clocked.
I used to believe that tale that longer stroke made more torque but that's just not so. Torque is influenced primarily by engine displacement. With dynamometers virtually on every street corner and Enginemasters magazine and contest well publicized, the information is out there. Some factors do exist. For example, if you increase the stroke and keep the same connecting rods, the R/S ratio decreases and the torque peak should shift lower in the rpm range. Also increasing stroke is the quickest way to increase displacement on an engine, so increasing stroke certainly will increase torque because of the displacement increase.
R.
More Turbo
Joined: Jan 2009
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Hey guys, I got a '78 F250 with the 400, C6, and the married transfer case and I got a '77 F250 with the 460 and C6, two wheeler. The plan is to restore the '78 but I can't decide which motor to go with. I'm going to keep the 4x4 and add an OD unit or look at my options for different transmissions so I can get an OD gear. Any thoughts about the motors and recommendations for transmission options appreciated.
Dennis
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Albuquerque
The 460 is a LOT heavier and weight is anti horsepower in addition to more weight on the front end where you don't want it. I didn't have any trouble getting to 435hp with a 400. More than that on either engine witll start to cut into drivability.
That's all I intend to say about 460s
That's all I intend to say about 460s
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The 460 will on paper make more power due to the cubes. If you were building a high horse power engine then the cubes could matter in making it easier to make more power than a comparably built smaller engine but I don’t think that’s what you’re looking for. There are parts out there to make lots of power out of 400’s and I would guess enough for your application since you didn’t specify wanting a super powerful build. I’d stay with the 400 unless you decided you want a 450-500 hp motor. Then it would probably be easy to build a 460 especially if you were starting from scratch. But even then that 500hp 460 gonna take a lot of work and a good builder to make that power and still be a reliable/streetable truck engine.
as far as OD trans. Decide if you want an auto or a manual. Both have ups and downs. Manuals can take less to swap in. Some ford options work and use pretty much all off the shelf parts thst arent super expensive for what they are. Autos can be a little harder since you’re probably gonna need to setup a computer and various sensors. Ford E40d auto and zf5 manuals are common swaps. 4l80e and 4l60e chevy autos are also common. G56 and nv4500 manuals from chevy and dodge are also common.
I have a nv4500 5 speed behind a mainly stock 400 in my 79. OD trans is AWESOME!!! This truck will roll at 90 all day long drinking gas and 65-75 all day sippin it.
as far as OD trans. Decide if you want an auto or a manual. Both have ups and downs. Manuals can take less to swap in. Some ford options work and use pretty much all off the shelf parts thst arent super expensive for what they are. Autos can be a little harder since you’re probably gonna need to setup a computer and various sensors. Ford E40d auto and zf5 manuals are common swaps. 4l80e and 4l60e chevy autos are also common. G56 and nv4500 manuals from chevy and dodge are also common.
I have a nv4500 5 speed behind a mainly stock 400 in my 79. OD trans is AWESOME!!! This truck will roll at 90 all day long drinking gas and 65-75 all day sippin it.
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Whichever one you find in with a 4x4 tailhousing. Nv4500 is supposed to be pretty short so maybe that could help. But it’s probs my not a big deal in a truck. Make sure your transfer case will be on the correct side. Chevy and dodge put the front diff on the opposite side to ford.
Lead Driver
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From: San Jose, CA
575 vs 720 according to this old chart. Performance Unlimited 4-Wheel & Off Road Center - Hartford, Wisconsin - USA Technical Documents
Frankly 100lbs sounds more believable, but at only 145lbs for this chart, it's not exactly out of line either.
I linked to the main info page, but scroll down to the "engine weights" and click on the left button. They haven't notably updated the site in 15 years or more, but it's still full of fun info.
Paul
Frankly 100lbs sounds more believable, but at only 145lbs for this chart, it's not exactly out of line either.
I linked to the main info page, but scroll down to the "engine weights" and click on the left button. They haven't notably updated the site in 15 years or more, but it's still full of fun info.
Paul
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