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Dies while driving !

 
  #1  
Old 04-07-2018, 02:09 AM
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Dies while driving ! SOLVED

Hi guy's, I've got a 2002 F-350 drw 4 x4 supercrew, v-10 auto, 71,000 miles on the clock. It has a K&N air filter, super chip, Gibson dual exhaust minus the muffler when it rusted out. So I'm just running the cats and sounds great ! It's my secondary vehicle to my explorer so it's not driven daily. About a year ago I had loaned my exp to a friend and was driving my truck for close to a year with no issues. I change fuel filter once a year, run synthetic oil changed every 3,000 miles and had put plugs in it at 65,000 miles.
Periodically after really getting on it whether towing my boat or race car trailer and coming to a stop at a light, when I take off from the light you might get a surge like intermittent fuel or restriction but it always stayed running and never died. Well about 9 months ago I was going to work on the highway running about 70 mph and it just died like someone turned the key off.. I coasted to the shoulder tried to crank engine as it would crank but not start. I couldn't hear the fuel pump buzz because or the key chime and load traffic. After sitting there for about 15-20 mins it started right up, I drove on to work no problem for the next two weeks. Then leaving work one morning as I was going to get gas as I was getting close to E but fuel light hadn't come on yet. 4 blocks from work I'm sitting at a traffic light and it died. Cranks won't start, this time I can't hear the pump prime but just continues to crank. A friend tows me 4 blks to gas station I put gas in it it starts right up.I wasn't out of gas as I still had almost 3 gallons left in tank. And had been about 30-40 mins since it had died. Runs great, I checked for codes none, fuel pressure was 42 psi, I checked bad voltage cables, grounds etc. I've been in the automotive industry for over 30 yrs including running my own shop. Battery was approximately 2 yrs old and checked good ( which my motorcraft battery had lasted 12 yrs before replaced ). At any rate continued driving it to work no problems for another 2 weeks and went to a friends house came out about a half hour later and truck cranked no start. If I fogged it with carb cleaner it fired right up. But still cranked, so I unplugged the MAF and it fired right up? When I left his house I made it about 5 miles and it died again. Sitting on the side of the road and almost running battery down waiting on a tow truck after about 35 mins it started right up and I drove home..Never having the right tools with me I couldn't check for power through the inertia switch or any other items. Rechecked fuel pressure at worst it has been 38 psi but usually always 42 psi.
It sat in my shop for 6 months and although I only had 71,000 miles on truck I did realize that the truck is still 16 years old so I put a fuel pump in as it had died or not started a couple more times in that 6 months. About the time it took you to pull the kick panel for the switch or hook up a pressure gauge , scan tool etc it would start right back up. After installing a new pump I had finished getting everything back and was letting truck down off jacks withn it running and it died again. Hooked up scanner nothing, fuel pressure once I hooked up gauge 42 psi, and I noticed but couldn't verify but as I would cycle ign switch to energize the fuel pump that with key in run mode after turning on ign I would hear like a whooshing sound under the hood but could not see where it was other than from the air filter housing area. During all these issues my battery finally became questionable so I replaced it and the positive cable. Cranks great runs great as I have driven it off and on always wondering about reliability factor or not.
Last weekend I pulled a 34' travel trailer from the lake 40 miles south of me to 20 miles on the northside of my city and no problems. Today I started it and was pulling down to my shop and put it in gear drove 30 feet and it died. I had left the right kick panel off as well as fuse panel cover under dash to access aldl connecter. Ran to my shop checked power through inertia switch with key on had power through it and although key buzzer hampers hearing the fuel pump, I could clearly hear the faint buzz of it running. No codes in computer but when I had the key on checking that stuff after having the ignition on for 3-5 seconds I could hear that whoosh sound from under the hood. It sounded like taking the cap off a fuel jug that in the sun?. I'm sorry this is so long winded guy's but I'm trying to give you all the details and have read through almost every single one of these threads related to this type of issue.
I thought I ran across a issue 6-8 months ago about a guy that battled this same type of endless problem and it was his super chip he'd put in years before. Was that here on FTE or does anyone recall as I'm just grasping at straws now ????? Thanks in advance for any help.......Richmo
 

Last edited by Richmo; 05-18-2018 at 10:18 PM. Reason: Solved-Problem was bad JET Performance chip
  #2  
Old 04-07-2018, 05:30 AM
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Bunch of similar threads....hereís one...good luck

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...omly-dies.html
 
  #3  
Old 04-07-2018, 06:00 AM
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Donít have time to read your whole story but everyone here on FTE basically agrees that the air filter is a bad idea. The oil will mess with the MAF. Go get the special MAF cleaner spray and clean the MAF sensor. Change to paper filter.

Keep the tank above 3gallons (duh: thatís Empty) and see if the problem continues.

If all that doesnít eradicate your issue then itís likely the fuel pump and/or relay.

For the record; Iíve had Ford trucks for 6years and totaled 300,000 miles and Iíve had neither MAF nor fuel pump issues. Iím basing this post off of reading FTE almost daily for the last 5 years.
 
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Old 04-07-2018, 10:33 AM
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Thanks for the link Seville !

And Im50 dah if you bothered to read, I know short on time ! One time it died leaving work after driving about three miles on the way to get gas, but when I filled it there was still 3 gals in it, thus not out of gas ! I'm going to run through the electrical checks on the fuses. But I really need a wiring schematic for 02 F-350 4x4 crewcab from the fuel pump switch continuing as I have tested it to this point with power. And is 02 fuel pump relay behind the radio or the integrated one in the underdash fuse panel ? Thanks again guy's !
 
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Old 04-07-2018, 12:47 PM
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You have a Superchip that plugs into the side of the PCM? Remove it. The contacts can get dirty or corroded, and it'll just die on you. Even if it's not the culprit, better to start with a baseline.

It could be that the fuel pump relay is starting to go. When it dies on you, get out of the truck fast and feel the fuel pump relay and see if it's hot. If it is, whack it with a screwdriver or your keys and see if it starts.


And one thing, but probably not related, at idle, the fuel pressure should be 28-30, not 42.
 
  #6  
Old 04-07-2018, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Richmo View Post
And Im50 dah if you bothered to read, I know short on time ! One time it died leaving work after driving about three miles on the way to get gas, but when I filled it there was still 3 gals in it, thus not out of gas ! I'm going to run through the electrical checks on the fuses. But I really need a wiring schematic for 02 F-350 4x4 crewcab from the fuel pump switch continuing as I have tested it to this point with power. And is 02 fuel pump relay behind the radio or the integrated one in the underdash fuse panel ? Thanks again guy's !
if you run your 35+ gallon tank down to only having 3 gallons, that is empty.
Iím not saying that is definitely the reason for your truck dying. Iím Saying it could lead to it or maybe become the last straw. Iíve run my van completely out of gas and it still had gas in it. It was a couple years ago so I donít remember the exact numbers. But you never run gas tank actually empty. There will always be some. With the large size of the tank, 1 gallon could be barely a quarter inch coverage on the entire bottom. Which could be low enough that the fuel pump will not suck it up.
 
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Old 04-07-2018, 03:51 PM
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And no sense checking fuses because they wonít cause intermittent failure. Theyíre either good or bad.
Krewat offers good advice regarding the fuel relay. Iíve seen a success story or two on this forum about replacing that.
 
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Old 04-07-2018, 04:22 PM
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Not your main issue but 42 psi at idle is a tad high.

I suspect a bad fuel pressure regulator or vacuum line issue to it.

a good battery does not mean a good alternator. Make sure alternator is operating within specs, it'S voltage makes fuel pump run within specs.

I suspect your main issue will be relay.
 
  #9  
Old 04-09-2018, 12:00 AM
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Well Im50fast, I think after owning the truck since new I know where the fuel is and isn't. But I'm also aware that it overheats some of the pumps as the fuel is what cools them. I think what I failed to say was that that was a isolated incident as I've usually got bet 1/4-3/4s tank in it as we all know how thirsty they are !
And thank you for the information Krewat as I just purchased a new fuel pressure guage cuz my 15 yr old one is slow and stiff and I wasn't getting a good seal at the Schrader valve. And was going to run the elec tests mentioned in Seville's post so I will update on new info. I'm carrying my scanner, pressure tester, test light with me incase ! lol
And Rock2610d I appreciate any logical input and have checked the regulator a while back but it never has the symptom of running out of gas when it dies, as it's like someone shut the key off. And a vacuum leak wouldn't generally take up to 2 weeks to reproduce ? Rather than a sputter or bog. And I wish I remembered where I read that post about that guy's truck with same symptoms and he chased it for I want to say years until a guy that did a lot of programs for custom tunes looked at it or talked to him and said to pull he chip and as far as I know it fixed it ! I just wanted to run across any updated info he may have had. Probably another Truck club, not sure .
At any rate guy's thank you a bunch as this will give me some things to check, and I'm gonna beat this, lol.
 
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Old 04-09-2018, 07:21 AM
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Hi richmo
i read your initial post and I saw a few key details and now I realize I was wrong to jump in like I did. I didnít realize your experience nor that youíve had the truck for 16 years. On this forum its very common to get noobs that need the basics.

Anyway I donít have much to offer except the idea that (I think) there might be multiple fuel pump relays. I might be mixing this up with battery/aux battery/starter/towing harness situation I recently dealt with, but itís worth checking out.

But we all agree thereís at least one. Have you changed that? If itís under the hood plugged into a fuse box next to other similar-looking fuses; you can just swap it with the horn relay (or whatever).
Test drive and see if the problem disappears.
 
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Old 04-09-2018, 09:22 AM
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Lending to previous mentions. Does it, or has it, died and then only started after several minutes? Like maybe an electrical component cooled and then made good contact again? I've seen relays in various vehicles do this, they'll fail once they get too hot (especially during the Texas summers I live in) but work fine once the vehicle sits for a period of time.
 
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Old 04-10-2018, 12:25 AM
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Well Im50fast it's great to hear from you and ur pleasant remark about the parts swappers, that of which I'm not a throw parts at it until it goes away type of guy ! As I've already had the fuel tank out of four times, two of which my own carelessness creating havic ! Note to self be careful of the plastic disconnects at the tank. Break one and the repair splice kit is a pain in the rear ! But if I could ask, on a 02 crew cab Drw 4x4 does anyone know the exact location ? Because I'm going to be running down basics first tonight with new FI pressure tester, vac leaks, fuses and relays. I'm looking at it through a new pair of eyes !
 
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Old 04-10-2018, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Richmo View Post
Well Im50fast it's great to hear from you and ur pleasant remark about the parts swappers, that of which I'm not a throw parts at it until it goes away type of guy ! As I've already had the fuel tank out of four times, two of which my own carelessness creating havic ! Note to self be careful of the plastic disconnects at the tank. Break one and the repair splice kit is a pain in the rear ! But if I could ask, on a 02 crew cab Drw 4x4 does anyone know the exact location ? Because I'm going to be running down basics first tonight with new FI pressure tester, vac leaks, fuses and relays. I'm looking at it through a new pair of eyes !
I canít tell if youíre being sarcastic or something (ďpleasant remark about the parts swappersĒ)

i was suggesting swapping the relay with another one thats already in the truck. Not buying parts as a guess.
My van uses the same relay for the PCM and the horn and the fuel pump and the trailer harness. It literally has 4 of the same relay. Easy to swap.
I was suggesting that your truck probably does also, and that would be an easy (and free) manner of progressing your diagnosis.

 
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Old 04-11-2018, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Krewat View Post
You have a Superchip that plugs into the side of the PCM? Remove it.
This. I experienced identical symptoms to yours. After throwing a bunch of parts at the problem I finally pulled the ECM and found a Jet performance chip installed. When the previous owner had installed the chip he had damaged the circuit board and it was causing the computer to randomly lose power. Purchased a refurbished ECM and the problem has been gone for months! I did not reinstall the chip, I'll just buy a tuner with my next overtime check.
 
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Old 04-18-2018, 03:46 PM
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A little update

Well hopefully this wI'll help but I've been busy with work and litile time to check my truck. When I went to start it last it cranked no start. If I fogged with carb cleaner fired right up. My relay is located L/F fender so swapped with the one next to it, still nothing. Now I have test light tied direct into fp side of inertia switcH and when I turn ignition to run the light is solid, does not pulse. After checkING fuses, all ok, scanning pcm no codes I was done for the night. And it seemed I could hear a slight fuel pump nois but again door/key chime is too load.
. A couple days later I reached in truck turned to run, 12v test light pulsed off so I cycled it 2 more times it fired right up. Drove to the store fired after and drove home fine. So I didn't resume any further tests. 3 days later I came out to drive it to my shop turned key to run, solid 12v light wouldn't start. Called it a night. Following evening turned key on 12v puse fired up drove to my shop and started sputtering as I was pullung in and died when I let off the gas. I briefly tried to cycle switch and I couldn't get anything but a solid 12v light and no fire.
. So tonight I'm tying into fuel pressure, checking voltage on both sides of inertia switch and all the fuses again. My question, not having a wiring diagram for it is where does the power go after the inertia switch ? And does the F-350 have that fuel control module that generally up above the spare tire or is that more F-150 type trucks. Thanks again for all your input.
 

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