Considering a 6.0
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Cross-Country
Joined: Sep 2015
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Considering a 6.0
Hi all, I'm considering going from my 250cc v10 to a 350 dually 6.0. Other than then known possible issues with a 6l, is there any reason not to do it? Gas has been killing me, and it seems the diesel would be better for my current camper, and the one I'm looking at getting. I've been looking at some higher mileage diesel, so my hopes are to get one that has had the issues ironed out. Thoughts?
Posting Guru
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,348
Likes: 6
From: Edmonton, AB
As a former 6.0 owner the 6.0 diesels trucks can be good if they were maintained and if whoever had it didnt beat the hell out of it. The problem your going to face is finding a decent 6.0 for a good price that your not going to have sink a ton of cash into and that will be the trick.
My first question is do you have a budget in mind for what you want to spend on a truck? And with that said do you have a reserve set aside for anything that may pop up after purchase? I would seriously consider having a budget in mind of what you want to spend and a reserve in case anything comes up suddenly that needs attention. I dont know if your really mechanically handy , there are guys here who know the 6.0 and can out one together and others that know this and that but the truck goes to a shop that knows the 6.0 for repairs if it is anything out of their ability, that is something you will have to factor in as well.
The problem with some high mile truck is that some guys are selling because they have moved up to a different diesel or down cause they dont need one any further and others that know their truck has issues but want to get as much as they can and dump it on the next guy and other who will straight up tell you it has issues. Trying to find one out of the group will be a test of patience and due diligence.
Some high mile trucks might be ok, but others just might be to the point where they are tired or in need of repair that the owner isnt prepared to go and do. The chore for you will be to find out which is which. If your going to be buying a truck privately ask the current owner how long they have had it and if they are a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 10th owner, ask if they have maintenance records, those will be very very important to seeing how well the truck was maintained. Did the owner do a lot of his own maintenance or did he have a shop do it? whats all been done to the truck, how often did he do oil changes, filter changes? Is it deleted? is it stock? was it tuned? What kind of tuning and by who? Why are they getting rid of it? etc
Dont just take the persons word for it that they were the only owner, run a carfax or car proof and verify the trucks history, lots of shady guys will buy truck at auction and song you a song and dance to get you to buy it so they can flip it for a profit, now thats not inductive of everyone but you need to check the trucks history out.
When your going to go loook at a truck make sure you take some coveralls and a good strong flashlight crawl all over the engine of that truck and look for leaks etc, then crawl under the truck and do the same, get right under that engine and use that light to look for any leaks from the front of the engine to the back and side to side. the 6.0's love to leak from the bedplates so you need to look really well follow it all the way to the transmission and look for leaks. while your there check the steering components, tie rods, ball joins control arms etc... and work your way to the back of the truck. Start that truck up and let it run and look for leaks, check the coolant bottle and see what the coolant is like and make sure it isnt puking diesel, let that engine get hot, take it for a good drive on a fwy or highway and keep an eye on those temps etc, check that exhaust and see if it is belching oil or yellowish white smoke. check if there are any CEL's on etc.
Dont punk your cash down just yet If you like the truck just cause it looks good on the inside and outside, tell the seller you would like to arrange for a Ford dealer to inspect the truck ( see below )
Maybe a truck your looking at is at a Ford Dealer, or another dealer or the guy on the corner selling trucks? Ask the dealer where this truck came from? It is important to know the trucks history. Used car dealers only get their trucks via trades or at the auction. You need to know the history. Get them to show you a car proof or a carfax and see where they got it from
I would ask the dealer to see a car proof on the truck and see what it say's. If things look okay on the car proof then I would ask the place selling it to allow you to take the truck to a Ford dealer if it is at any other dealer from a big dealership to Al's auto lot on the corner selling trucks
Still need to check if the truck is at a dealer if the truck has been tuned or deleted? That is another thing important to know. Some guys that have invested time and money into a tuned truck that has been deleted arent usually selling them with some mileage, because once tuned and deleted these trucks can go along way if they were taken care of and if they were maintained right. If some guy beat the hell out of it and dumped it because it was a problem child then thats something to be wary of. But that is why I suggest taking it to a Ford dealer and having them look it over with IDS.
It may cost you a couple hundred dollars to have a Ford dealer look at it, but You can get the Ford dealer to use their IDS to check the compression in the cylinders, the FICM, ICP AND IPR readings and the injectors not to mention the Ford dealer can look at the breaks and suspension and front end components and most of all check for any leaks etc. A couple hundred bucks spent now could save you from having to spend thousands later in repairs.
Even if this dealer says they had it inspected, still take this to a Ford dealer and get them to check the truck before you enter into an agreement to purchase it The Ford dealer should know what the problem areas of the 6.0's are and they can tell you straight up what the scoop is . I would not enter into any purchase agreement until you see what the Ford dealer or a shop that knows 6.0 diesels tells you what they found after they tested things with IDS and they looked over the rest of the truck.
You could always buy a truck that has a blown head gasket or problems, but you'd have to a good size budget to get it fixed right by the right shop using the right parts, Chinese cheap parts in a SD diesel will be nothing but you going in again to re do the work you just paid for or did. Doing something like buying a diesel with issues has risk and you would need a good size budget to get it straight because you just wouldnt know what your getting into until your in there.
I know a neighbour of mine does this, but he does most of the work himself and farms out what he cant do, but those are trucks he flips for profit and he has the resources to do that. I would advise you to take that route because of the unknowns but you could do it if you have the budget for it and got a truck at the right price
You have to remember that 6.0 parts are not cheap, remember that Navistar still has there hand in the pocket of 6.0 and 6.4 owners when it comes to parts. I would advise you not to go to a 6.4 just because the curve on those truck is steep and repairs can be pricey and there are a lot of guys dumping 6.4 problem child onto someone else because they just dont want to fix the issues they are having, are there good 6.4's out there sure, but the upkeep and repairs can be really steep if you dont have the wallet for it.
Do your homework on all the trucks you look at, take your time finding a truck and then do the due diligence on it, if it looks good then take some of the steps I gave you and go thru them, last thing you want to do is spend thousand of dollars on a truck only to find out it need thousands more to get it on the road or keep it there.
My first question is do you have a budget in mind for what you want to spend on a truck? And with that said do you have a reserve set aside for anything that may pop up after purchase? I would seriously consider having a budget in mind of what you want to spend and a reserve in case anything comes up suddenly that needs attention. I dont know if your really mechanically handy , there are guys here who know the 6.0 and can out one together and others that know this and that but the truck goes to a shop that knows the 6.0 for repairs if it is anything out of their ability, that is something you will have to factor in as well.
The problem with some high mile truck is that some guys are selling because they have moved up to a different diesel or down cause they dont need one any further and others that know their truck has issues but want to get as much as they can and dump it on the next guy and other who will straight up tell you it has issues. Trying to find one out of the group will be a test of patience and due diligence.
Some high mile trucks might be ok, but others just might be to the point where they are tired or in need of repair that the owner isnt prepared to go and do. The chore for you will be to find out which is which. If your going to be buying a truck privately ask the current owner how long they have had it and if they are a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 10th owner, ask if they have maintenance records, those will be very very important to seeing how well the truck was maintained. Did the owner do a lot of his own maintenance or did he have a shop do it? whats all been done to the truck, how often did he do oil changes, filter changes? Is it deleted? is it stock? was it tuned? What kind of tuning and by who? Why are they getting rid of it? etc
Dont just take the persons word for it that they were the only owner, run a carfax or car proof and verify the trucks history, lots of shady guys will buy truck at auction and song you a song and dance to get you to buy it so they can flip it for a profit, now thats not inductive of everyone but you need to check the trucks history out.
When your going to go loook at a truck make sure you take some coveralls and a good strong flashlight crawl all over the engine of that truck and look for leaks etc, then crawl under the truck and do the same, get right under that engine and use that light to look for any leaks from the front of the engine to the back and side to side. the 6.0's love to leak from the bedplates so you need to look really well follow it all the way to the transmission and look for leaks. while your there check the steering components, tie rods, ball joins control arms etc... and work your way to the back of the truck. Start that truck up and let it run and look for leaks, check the coolant bottle and see what the coolant is like and make sure it isnt puking diesel, let that engine get hot, take it for a good drive on a fwy or highway and keep an eye on those temps etc, check that exhaust and see if it is belching oil or yellowish white smoke. check if there are any CEL's on etc.
Dont punk your cash down just yet If you like the truck just cause it looks good on the inside and outside, tell the seller you would like to arrange for a Ford dealer to inspect the truck ( see below )
Maybe a truck your looking at is at a Ford Dealer, or another dealer or the guy on the corner selling trucks? Ask the dealer where this truck came from? It is important to know the trucks history. Used car dealers only get their trucks via trades or at the auction. You need to know the history. Get them to show you a car proof or a carfax and see where they got it from
I would ask the dealer to see a car proof on the truck and see what it say's. If things look okay on the car proof then I would ask the place selling it to allow you to take the truck to a Ford dealer if it is at any other dealer from a big dealership to Al's auto lot on the corner selling trucks
Still need to check if the truck is at a dealer if the truck has been tuned or deleted? That is another thing important to know. Some guys that have invested time and money into a tuned truck that has been deleted arent usually selling them with some mileage, because once tuned and deleted these trucks can go along way if they were taken care of and if they were maintained right. If some guy beat the hell out of it and dumped it because it was a problem child then thats something to be wary of. But that is why I suggest taking it to a Ford dealer and having them look it over with IDS.
It may cost you a couple hundred dollars to have a Ford dealer look at it, but You can get the Ford dealer to use their IDS to check the compression in the cylinders, the FICM, ICP AND IPR readings and the injectors not to mention the Ford dealer can look at the breaks and suspension and front end components and most of all check for any leaks etc. A couple hundred bucks spent now could save you from having to spend thousands later in repairs.
Even if this dealer says they had it inspected, still take this to a Ford dealer and get them to check the truck before you enter into an agreement to purchase it The Ford dealer should know what the problem areas of the 6.0's are and they can tell you straight up what the scoop is . I would not enter into any purchase agreement until you see what the Ford dealer or a shop that knows 6.0 diesels tells you what they found after they tested things with IDS and they looked over the rest of the truck.
You could always buy a truck that has a blown head gasket or problems, but you'd have to a good size budget to get it fixed right by the right shop using the right parts, Chinese cheap parts in a SD diesel will be nothing but you going in again to re do the work you just paid for or did. Doing something like buying a diesel with issues has risk and you would need a good size budget to get it straight because you just wouldnt know what your getting into until your in there.
I know a neighbour of mine does this, but he does most of the work himself and farms out what he cant do, but those are trucks he flips for profit and he has the resources to do that. I would advise you to take that route because of the unknowns but you could do it if you have the budget for it and got a truck at the right price
You have to remember that 6.0 parts are not cheap, remember that Navistar still has there hand in the pocket of 6.0 and 6.4 owners when it comes to parts. I would advise you not to go to a 6.4 just because the curve on those truck is steep and repairs can be pricey and there are a lot of guys dumping 6.4 problem child onto someone else because they just dont want to fix the issues they are having, are there good 6.4's out there sure, but the upkeep and repairs can be really steep if you dont have the wallet for it.
Do your homework on all the trucks you look at, take your time finding a truck and then do the due diligence on it, if it looks good then take some of the steps I gave you and go thru them, last thing you want to do is spend thousand of dollars on a truck only to find out it need thousands more to get it on the road or keep it there.
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 14,255
Likes: 2,180
Hi all, I'm considering going from my 250cc v10 to a 350 dually 6.0. Other than then known possible issues with a 6l, is there any reason not to do it? Gas has been killing me, and it seems the diesel would be better for my current camper, and the one I'm looking at getting. I've been looking at some higher mileage diesel, so my hopes are to get one that has had the issues ironed out. Thoughts?
BUT, if you factor in the cost of ownership for maint , repairs, services, mods to prevent maint, and add that to the per mile cost, it does not make sense to switch to a diesel just to save gas....you are not going to save money and you certainly are not gaining reliability.
if you need to haul 18k to 24k loads...then it makes sense. But the average Joe is hauling a 7K to 12K trailer and a v-10 will do that just fine.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,866
Likes: 84
From: Rainier OR
If you are going to finance your purchase you might want to look at some of the 6.7s.
I needed a dually and was looking at a 6.0.
All I could find was rough $10k to $15k trucks and nice $20k to $25k trucks.
I was going to finance the purchase and after checking i found that because of the better interest and terms on a newer truck the 2011 f450 king Ranch (paid $33,000) was only about $50 more a month.
I am very happy o went this way. I have a newer truck with a lot of nice options, and don't have to continually watch all the gages to make sure the 6.0 keeps running.
I needed a dually and was looking at a 6.0.
All I could find was rough $10k to $15k trucks and nice $20k to $25k trucks.
I was going to finance the purchase and after checking i found that because of the better interest and terms on a newer truck the 2011 f450 king Ranch (paid $33,000) was only about $50 more a month.
I am very happy o went this way. I have a newer truck with a lot of nice options, and don't have to continually watch all the gages to make sure the 6.0 keeps running.
Posting Guru
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,348
Likes: 6
From: Edmonton, AB
Your talking about quite the gap in trucks years and engines vs cost to purchase a 6.7 vs the 6.0. There is a lot of difference in price variance btwn a 6.0 with 200k on the OD and a 6.7 with 200k on the OD and I wouldnt advise the OP to go for an 11 6.7 due to some of the engine and turbo issues.
The Op hasnt remarked what his budget is for a truck yet, but the gap from what he stated he is looking for mileage wise in a 6.0 in price is going to be no where near a 6.7 with high miles unless it's really really high on the OD.
If the OP had a budget I would say go for a 6.7 but I would think he is looking higher mileage with a lower purchase cost.
The Op hasnt remarked what his budget is for a truck yet, but the gap from what he stated he is looking for mileage wise in a 6.0 in price is going to be no where near a 6.7 with high miles unless it's really really high on the OD.
If the OP had a budget I would say go for a 6.7 but I would think he is looking higher mileage with a lower purchase cost.
Posting Guru
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,348
Likes: 6
From: Edmonton, AB
I just responded to another thread and comparing a 1000 mile trip the difference in fuel usage is about 167 dollars.
BUT, if you factor in the cost of ownership for maint , repairs, services, mods to prevent maint, and add that to the per mile cost, it does not make sense to switch to a diesel just to save gas....you are not going to save money and you certainly are not gaining reliability.
if you need to haul 18k to 24k loads...then it makes sense. But the average Joe is hauling a 7K to 12K trailer and a v-10 will do that just fine.
BUT, if you factor in the cost of ownership for maint , repairs, services, mods to prevent maint, and add that to the per mile cost, it does not make sense to switch to a diesel just to save gas....you are not going to save money and you certainly are not gaining reliability.
if you need to haul 18k to 24k loads...then it makes sense. But the average Joe is hauling a 7K to 12K trailer and a v-10 will do that just fine.
That's some very good points, the OP hasnt really stated if he tows etc or long commutes just that he'd like to save on gas. Hopefully they will fill in the blanks better and he can get some better responses with a little more information.
One thing the OP hasnt stated is why he believes a diesel will work better fuel consumption wise versus the gasser. Guess we will have to wait n see
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Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,279
Likes: 12
The very real chance of downtime repairs and all of the other 6.0 BS that he'll have to deal with will significantly increase the operating cost of a truck that is at least 10 years old or older. But I guess sometimes you have to live and learn.
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Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 14,255
Likes: 2,180
If you are going to finance your purchase you might want to look at some of the 6.7s.
I needed a dually and was looking at a 6.0.
All I could find was rough $10k to $15k trucks and nice $20k to $25k trucks.
I was going to finance the purchase and after checking i found that because of the better interest and terms on a newer truck the 2011 f450 king Ranch (paid $33,000) was only about $50 more a month.
I am very happy o went this way. I have a newer truck with a lot of nice options, and don't have to continually watch all the gages to make sure the 6.0 keeps running.
I needed a dually and was looking at a 6.0.
All I could find was rough $10k to $15k trucks and nice $20k to $25k trucks.
I was going to finance the purchase and after checking i found that because of the better interest and terms on a newer truck the 2011 f450 king Ranch (paid $33,000) was only about $50 more a month.
I am very happy o went this way. I have a newer truck with a lot of nice options, and don't have to continually watch all the gages to make sure the 6.0 keeps running.
in the case of the 6.7, a lot of design enhancements took place on that engine based on lessons learned on the 6.0 and 6.x
a. more and larger bolts per cylinder vs the 6.0
b. larger lifters vs 6.0 and 6.4
c. a bar lies across the rockers and lubes the rockers vs none on the 6.0 and 6.4
d. the coolant pump is no longer integral to the engine so if it were to cavitate, it would leak to the out side air and not to the crank case.
e. the turbo is directly mounted to the engine...there are no CAC or exhaust piping....more reliable and less to burst or get filled with crancase vent oil
f. the biodesel rating is better b20 vs b5. b20 is an excelent fuel system lube and has less emmissions
I bought a 2010 6.4 not understanding the change to 6.7 in 2011. I would be a different personality on this forum if I would have bought a 6.7.
kudos to you.
Token Redneck
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 9,335
Likes: 344
From: Breckenridge, TX
What are the weights on the current and future trailer? If they're inside the range of the SRW I wouldn't let an '06 V10 walk away for at best one year newer (worst three years older) truck with a questionable drive train. High miles plus minimum ten years old... even if it were the best engine ever designed a lot of stupid things can happen in a decade.
3.73s or 4.30s on the current truck?
3.73s or 4.30s on the current truck?
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