Deleting the DPF advantages or not
Posting Guru
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,216
Likes: 7
On a Ford I'm in the delete camp. The 6.7 doesn't have a 9th injector down in the down pipe to clean the DPF. The way it does regens is to inject fuel into cyls 7&8 during the exhaust stroke resulting in a few bad things.
1. Raises EGTs in the turbo increasing the heat load and decreasing turbo life.
2. Results in some fuel coating the cylinder walls and ending up in the crank case reducing oil lubricity and reducing engine life.
3. Wastes fuel. My 2015 went through regens about every 400 miles when unloaded before I deleted it and used about a gallon of fuel each time. That results in about a 5% decrease overall fuel economy. I'd guess the 17 is about the same.
4. Requires the use of EGR resulting in "dirty" air coming through the intake.
All of these result in a lower overall life of the truck which is completely unnecessary. Even without the dpf these engines(assuming you don't tune them stupidly) make far less emmsions than diesels of yesteryear or even gas engines of today.
1. Raises EGTs in the turbo increasing the heat load and decreasing turbo life.
2. Results in some fuel coating the cylinder walls and ending up in the crank case reducing oil lubricity and reducing engine life.
3. Wastes fuel. My 2015 went through regens about every 400 miles when unloaded before I deleted it and used about a gallon of fuel each time. That results in about a 5% decrease overall fuel economy. I'd guess the 17 is about the same.
4. Requires the use of EGR resulting in "dirty" air coming through the intake.
All of these result in a lower overall life of the truck which is completely unnecessary. Even without the dpf these engines(assuming you don't tune them stupidly) make far less emmsions than diesels of yesteryear or even gas engines of today.
I believe the newer trucks may use both banks.
Senior User
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 320
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Ricohman
The 6.7 uses a complete bank for regen. Not 7 and 8.
I believe the newer trucks may use both banks.
I believe the newer trucks may use both banks.
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,663
Likes: 162
From: Cartersville, Ga
The reason for the two-sided story is because of performance. You really feel the raised RPMs that Ford gave the 2017s for peak torque. It was moved from 1600RPM to 1800-2000RPM. Couple that with the low boost fueling that is programmed into the export file that EVERYONE is selling, and you get a laggy truck off the line. Only custom tuning currently available is to take your PCM out, ship it to the tuner, wait on them to bench flash it, then wait for it to come back.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,674
Likes: 51
From: SoCal
To be honest, at the heart of it I feel the same way you do. But I'm more happy that the retards rolling coal are about to get shut down.
Thread Starter
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Elder User
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 575
Likes: 1
I don't wanna roll coal or whatever I just want my engine to be healthy and stay alive. I'm keeping this truck for a long time. From what I understand the DPF or DEF fluid goes no where near the engine it's just annoying that you have to go into Regen mode or spend extra money for DEF
Logistics Pro
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,674
Likes: 51
From: SoCal
I don't wanna roll coal or whatever I just want my engine to be healthy and stay alive. I'm keeping this truck for a long time. From what I understand the DPF or DEF fluid goes no where near the engine it's just annoying that you have to go into Regen mode or spend extra money for DEF
Elder User
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 566
Likes: 3
From: Florence SC
Its like $7 every oil change. Its not a lot of extra money. And it does nothing to the longevity of the engine. In fact, the way a Ford tech explained it to me was that their stock tunes are actually better on the DEF/DPF trucks because they don't have to care as much about diesel exhaust coming straight out of the motor anymore. The DPF will take care of the "less-clean" exhaust now coming out. Before they had to de-tune them to meet emissions. Now they don't.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,216
Likes: 7
Dodge and Ford uses the exhaust stroke to introduce the fuel needed for a regen.
My 2015 has never made oil and the regen process is seamless.
An extra injector pumping fuel is another complete system. I don't know if I want any more complexity in an already complex truck.
My 2015 has never made oil and the regen process is seamless.
An extra injector pumping fuel is another complete system. I don't know if I want any more complexity in an already complex truck.
Laughing Gas
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,117
Likes: 2
From: Hatfield's side of river
My nephew bought a new 2014 King Ranch new. He debated about deleting it and spoke to our local dealership about the warranty. They assured him that they had no problem with the warranty if he did, but would only replace the turbo once. He still wasn't sure. By 10,000 miles he had been to the shop twice with check engine lights due to emissions, so he went ahead and deleted.
He now has 150,000 miles on the truck. It's never been back to the dealership once since deleting. He said his biggest mistake was not deleting sooner.
He loves the truck. He always runs a high horsepower tune and runs the snot out of it daily as his fuel is free at work. The boy could tear up an anvil with a rubber hammer and hasn't killed it yet.
It's a matter of choice. Personally, I'm not a gambler. I don't even spend a buck for a lottery ticket, so its not for me.
He now has 150,000 miles on the truck. It's never been back to the dealership once since deleting. He said his biggest mistake was not deleting sooner.
He loves the truck. He always runs a high horsepower tune and runs the snot out of it daily as his fuel is free at work. The boy could tear up an anvil with a rubber hammer and hasn't killed it yet.
It's a matter of choice. Personally, I'm not a gambler. I don't even spend a buck for a lottery ticket, so its not for me.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,529
Likes: 390
From: SEVA
Recently joined the diesel community ... actually, my 2017 King Ranch won't be delivered until September ... so please tolerate my ignorance because my question is only somewhat related to this topic. If the goal of deleting the DPF is to eliminate regen cycles, and long distance driving gets the regen performed without issue, how short of a daily commute is considered too short and creates frequent regens? I ask because my daily commute is 9 miles one way.
Laughing Gas
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,117
Likes: 2
From: Hatfield's side of river
Recently joined the diesel community ... actually, my 2017 King Ranch won't be delivered until September ... so please tolerate my ignorance because my question is only somewhat related to this topic. If the goal of deleting the DPF is to eliminate regen cycles, and long distance driving gets the regen performed without issue, how short of a daily commute is considered too short and creates frequent regens? I ask because my daily commute is 9 miles one way.
Your commute is very short and regens will not complete themselves with that short of a drive. You'll have to take it for a walk once in a while so it can "do it's business".
Wife: Honey, where are you at?
You: Walking the truck dear.
The 2017's do not tell one when the regen is happening, thus you'll never be able to tell when and where its going on unless you learn to watch your instant fuel economy gauge. You can see the fuel economy drop during a regen. On my last 6.7, I had a Edge CTS2 which had a light that lit up while a regen was happening. (The Edge doesn't have this feature for the 2017s) Most of the time it lasted about 10 minutes, sometimes a little longer.
Senior User
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 320
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Ricohman
Dodge and Ford uses the exhaust stroke to introduce the fuel needed for a regen.
My 2015 has never made oil and the regen process is seamless.
An extra injector pumping fuel is another complete system. I don't know if I want any more complexity in an already complex truck.
My 2015 has never made oil and the regen process is seamless.
An extra injector pumping fuel is another complete system. I don't know if I want any more complexity in an already complex truck.
Originally Posted by cficare
Recently joined the diesel community ... actually, my 2017 King Ranch won't be delivered until September ... so please tolerate my ignorance because my question is only somewhat related to this topic. If the goal of deleting the DPF is to eliminate regen cycles, and long distance driving gets the regen performed without issue, how short of a daily commute is considered too short and creates frequent regens? I ask because my daily commute is 9 miles one way.
Laughing Gas
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,117
Likes: 2
From: Hatfield's side of river
How do you know you're not making oil? Have you sent samples to Blacstone for testing. Others who have often note diesel present in the samples.
9 miles is never going to get everything warmed up enough to do a passive regen. Even an active regen (which will need to occur about every 400 miles) will take at least 15 minutes. I don't know if this is still true but on my 15 it wouldn't even start an active regen until the truck was up to temperature which takes a few miles at least.
9 miles is never going to get everything warmed up enough to do a passive regen. Even an active regen (which will need to occur about every 400 miles) will take at least 15 minutes. I don't know if this is still true but on my 15 it wouldn't even start an active regen until the truck was up to temperature which takes a few miles at least.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 326
Likes: 1
On a Ford I'm in the delete camp. The 6.7 doesn't have a 9th injector down in the down pipe to clean the DPF. The way it does regens is to inject fuel into cyls 7&8 during the exhaust stroke resulting in a few bad things.
1. Raises EGTs in the turbo increasing the heat load and decreasing turbo life.
Seems to me that the raw fuel would lower the temperature of the Turbo, NOT raise it.
2. Results in some fuel coating the cylinder walls and ending up in the crank case reducing oil lubricity and reducing engine life.
Why would it end up in the crankcase on an exhaust stroke? There's no compression on it. It's just passing through. Old wives tale.
3. Wastes fuel. My 2015 went through regens about every 400 miles when unloaded before I deleted it and used about a gallon of fuel each time. That results in about a 5% decrease overall fuel economy. I'd guess the 17 is about the same.
Yeah, it does use fuel.
4. Requires the use of EGR resulting in "dirty" air coming through the intake.
Say what?
All of these result in a lower overall life of the truck which is completely unnecessary. Even without the dpf these engines(assuming you don't tune them stupidly) make far less emmsions than diesels of yesteryear or even gas engines of today.
1. Raises EGTs in the turbo increasing the heat load and decreasing turbo life.
Seems to me that the raw fuel would lower the temperature of the Turbo, NOT raise it.
2. Results in some fuel coating the cylinder walls and ending up in the crank case reducing oil lubricity and reducing engine life.
Why would it end up in the crankcase on an exhaust stroke? There's no compression on it. It's just passing through. Old wives tale.
3. Wastes fuel. My 2015 went through regens about every 400 miles when unloaded before I deleted it and used about a gallon of fuel each time. That results in about a 5% decrease overall fuel economy. I'd guess the 17 is about the same.
Yeah, it does use fuel.
4. Requires the use of EGR resulting in "dirty" air coming through the intake.
Say what?
All of these result in a lower overall life of the truck which is completely unnecessary. Even without the dpf these engines(assuming you don't tune them stupidly) make far less emmsions than diesels of yesteryear or even gas engines of today.
But the shade-trees get hold of them and think they're better engineers than the guys at Ford. Then, they push the engines up to 1,000 HP and can't figure out why they're blowing them up left and right. Everybody's got a Chip.
Leave your engine alone.
You wanna play Boy-Racer? Go get a small block Chevy. Dime-a-dozen
end rant