Hello all.... I have an issue...

I have a 2002 F-250 7.3, 159k on it. I bought it in March, ran AWESOME up till now. I was driving to work last week, check engine light came on, truck lost power and started idling rough. I have a buddy who works for a Ford dealer as a diesel mechanic, he came over with his scanner and laptop. #2,#4,#8 cylinders kept coming up saying possible problems are injectors, harness, rings.. He also did an electrical check, that all checked out. He told me to get injectors, so I got 4 injectors (yes I got the correct #8 injector), valve cover gasket, injector harness and 4 glow plugs.

The parts came last Friday, we did the job and it ran great. Drove it Friday night, Saturday, Sunday morning, no issues. Sunday afternoon we were on our way to a birthday party, truck started doing the exact same thing... Check engine light, rough idle, loss of power. After I got home from the party, my buddy came back over, put it on the scanner again, getting the same codes again. Deleted the codes, ran the tests again, same codes, deleted the codes, rant the tests again, same codes.

He said he is going to come by tomorrow with the box to check each individual cylinder.

Anyone have any idea what this can be?? I'm going crazy..

I'm already $550 in and its still not fixed.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks, Mike

 

Sounds more like it is the connector under the valve cove coming loose. Have you heard of the 25 cent fix (50 cents if doing both sides)? Also check your wiring harness for bare spots, connections. I would be a little suspicious of your "ford diesel mechanic", sorry!

 

The valve cover gasket I bought has the harness built into it, no connector on the inside, just a connector on the outside of the cover.

We did the buzz test, all the injectors buzzed.

Why be suspicious of him? I've known him 10+ years, it's possible he isn't the #1 mechanic in the world but he isn't trying to screw me.

 

That can easily be taken the wrong way. The problem with these trucks is finding mechanics who 1) are honest (I expect that your buddy is honest with you) and 2) really know what they are doing (since you installed a bank of injectors and it's still not fixed I'd suggest misdiagnosis). However, how did you get four new injectors, glow plugs and VC gasket and keep your bill around $550? As you have experienced, trying different parts without knowing for sure is expensive.

 

injectorsdirect.com, refurb injectors $120 each (plus $100 core charge), Valve cover gasket/harness $60, glow plugs, $11 each..

I do agree that it was misdiagnosed but I was right there, I saw what the computer was telling him. I did find it odd that all of a sudden 3 injectors went bad but, I don't know, this is my first diesel, i'm just learning.

 

What doesn't make sense to me is, after we did the injectors, it ran fine for a day and a half then started running like crap again....

 

If it were fuel (as in dying fuel pump or otherwise restricted fuel flow, I don't believe you would have received a temporary reprieve from the symptoms. It sounds more like some sort of electrical or sensor issue to me with its "coming and going" characteristic.

That said, I believe that either a failing CPS or IPR can offer similar symptoms before they finally get too tired to play any more and just quit.

 

Thank you, i'll look into that.

 

Bring that it's on the same bank, my vote is the uvch connector. It can be making just enough of a connection for buzz test purpose, but up and running, it falls on is face

 

The valve cover gasket I bought doesn't have a connector on the inside of the valve cover, its a 1 piece design, only connector is on the outside of the cover.

 

Why don't you throw a fuel pressure gauge on it so you'll know? It is possible to have intermittant fuel delivery problems when the mixing chamber screens get plugged up. After sitting, some of the debris falls off the screens and it runs OK for a while. Read up on the "Hutch" mod.

 

Thank you! I'll check it out today.

 

Could also be a partially broken or rubbing wire somewhere between the 42 pin connector and the UVCH. ( commonly found where the wire bundle rubs on the valve cover) When you did the injectors, you "disturbed" a bunch of stuff, including bundles of wires. This could have temporarily "fixed" the problem, and then after a short period, said wires settled back into their normal position, and the problem is back.

Possible failing IDM?

Did you make sure to properly torque the injectors down (135 in/LBS, when everything is up to normal operating temps). Maybe they loosened up after install?

As for your buddy, while he may be your "buddy", maybe even a good friend, its clear he is a crappy diesel mechanic. He certainly does not seem to know the 7.3L/T444e engine specifically, nor does he seem be skilled at diagnostics in general. Its ok to make a mistake. It happens. But a good mechanic will know his limits, and will say "I don't know how to fix this", instead of spending someone else's money on expensive guesses. A good mechanic will know that just because a scanner is giving you a particular code does not mean its the real root cause. A scanner is not a "change this part dummy" magic crystal ball. It is more of a "clue producing machine". It can lead you in the right direction, but you have to use your brain and skills to find the true problem. Its like if you went to the doctor and said you have been coughing up mucus, and maybe a little bit of blood for a few days. Instead of doing a thorough exam and possibly more diagnostic tests to find out the real problem, the doctor just declares that your lungs are broken and need to be replaced. That might, by dumb luck, actually cure you, or it may only provide a temporary reprieve until your shiny new lungs are infected from your lingering respiratory infection, or are invaded by the cancer that was actually the root cause and was still in you. Either way, your back to the same problem shortly.
To give you a more 7.3L powerstroke related example: Lets say you have a P1211 code for ICP pressure higher or lower then desired. Well, first off there's a problem right there. The same code sets whether pressure is higher OR lower then desired. So, which one is your problem? Next, depending on which it is, there are a number of different possible causes ( and possibly more then one at the same time). Could be injector o-rings, failing IPR valve, bad ICP sensor, bad wiring or connectors on either of those, a leaking high pressure oil hose, HPO rail plug leaks, worn/sheared oil, wrong viscosity oil, foamed/contaminated oil, any number of problems with the HPOP ( leaks to physical wear/failure),etc...... Plus probably more things I'm not thinking of or aware of.
"Mechanics" who operate like your "buddy" ( perhaps influenced by the dealer/warranty nature of his work) would tend to jump right to you needing a new $500+ HPOP, and after spending your money, and it not fixing the problem, they tend to just shrug their shoulders and tell you about the next expensive guess they want to make.

As for your "new" injectors, you may have traded in good originals for garbage re-mans. There are a lot of poor quality "no name"injector "builders" out there. You should stick to known quality re-builders or new Alliant.

UCVH- What brand? OEMS are never 1-piece. Dormans are. Many people seem to have decent luck with the current Dorman valve cover gaskets. However, there are also many other copy-cat and low quality garbage ones out there. Again, stick to well known name brand parts here. Another thought: If your old UVCH was bad, it may have damaged the connectors on the engine harness, that plug into the valve cover. Unplug them and look closely at the terminals. You want to look for any signs of melting, discoloring or corrosion. Ford sells replacement pigtails.

Were those glow plugs you bought OEM Ford? If not, yank them out now, while you still can. Non-oem glow plugs are notorious for the tips swelling and getting stuck in the head, then when you try to wrestle them out, they break off, leaving you with a big problem. OEM glow plugs are cheap. Use them unless you want more headaches later.

I think you need to find a qualified diesel mechanic with extensive knowledge and experience working on 7.3L / T444e ( the International version of the engine commonly found in school buses, rollbacks, box trucks, etc..) engines.

 

Awesome, very informative reply, thank you!! I am new to diesels, I wanted one because I wanted to expand my knowledge. Gas engines I know like the back of my hand, diesels are a whole other animal, as you guys know.

 

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/9...-cent-mod.html

here is a good place to check out.
When you worked on the vc, you may have jiggled the connector. After you ran it a while, it jiggled loose again. Hence the reason to do the 50 cent mod. In your case jsut do the one side for 25 cents.