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As we all know these diesels chew up a set of batteries really quick. I saw a video of a guy running his 4 cylinder car on a set of ultracapacitors and thought that was a really cool idea, then thought about how to apply the concept to my own truck.
The result is six Maxwell UltraCapacitors 2.7v 3000f connected in serries to simulate a battery for the truck. As the alternator controls the charging system of the truck, the system balances out at 14.2v with the motor running just like having two good batteries.
In my field testing, I was able to start my 6.0L with a 6.4L starter and dedicated cables from the ultracapacitor bank to the starter - four good starts with no charging in between.
Now I have replaced the passenger side battery with the ultracapacitor bank connected to the OEM cabling with no modifications - the system rests at 13.5v because I have a brand new Optima Red on the drivers side. Starting draws all the amps from the ultracapacitor down to 13.0v and then the alternator brings everything up to 14.2v in less than a minute.
I'm hoping that this breaks the cycle of having to replace the two batteries every two years.
This is the ultracapacitor bank sitting inside a 1U battery box.
Not raining on your parade and thanks for posting....
i am am surprised this works mainly because the 6 3000 uf capacitors in series results in 500 uf. Compare this to the 20v audio caps that are 1,000,000,000 uf . I guess if I step back and rethink this ..perhaps ..six 2.7 3000 uf caps in series provide some voltage and six 20v 3000 uf caps in parallel would provide some current.
Not raining on your parade and thanks for posting....
i am am surprised this works mainly because the 6 3000 uf capacitors in series results in 500 uf. Compare this to the 20v audio caps that are 1,000,000,000 uf . I guess if I step back and rethink this ..perhaps ..six 2.7 3000 uf caps in series provide some voltage and six 20v 3000 uf caps in parallel would provide some current.
interesting product to say the least.
It has been quite the science experiment and I've learned a lot which is always fun. Just have to keep in mind that the ultra-capacitor bank can discharge as fast as a bolt of lightning, charges significantly faster than a battery, holds that charge well, no chemicals, not much weight either. This allows the starter to take all the amperage it needs a fast as it wants since there is little to no resistance from the ultra-capacitor bank. After the motor is running the charging system brings the battery/ultracapacitor back up to normal in less than a minute.
My objective here is to break the cycle of having to replace the passenger side battery.
If my understanding is correct:
Audio capacitor at 14v within 1f is = 98 joules of energy
Ultra-capacitors at 14v within 3000f / 6 in series = 49000 joules of energy
So you would need 500 audio capacitors to store the same amount of energy at 14v, that might fit in the bed but not under the hood.
I'm hoping that this breaks the cycle of having to replace the two batteries every two years.
The experiment was initiated on a 6.0L which has the starter and the glow plugs hooked to the passenger side battery. The 6.0L is also challenged with unbalanced battery cabling so there are far more amps pulled from the passenger battery than the drivers battery - due to the draw down the passenger battery takes a beating and eventually both batteries need to be replaced.
I've sold that truck so I moved the experiment over to the 6.4L - different glow plug implementation and also different battery cabling. Though same significant draw of amps to start the motor.
So the six 2.7v 3000uf caps are in series so that you can have 16.2v capability....but...when you put capacitors in series the capacitance is reduced so in this case there's only 500uf effective capacitance
an audio capacitor is a million uf's not 1 uf and the audio cap is rated at 20v so you only need 1.
basically we are comparing a 500uf 16.2v capacitor to a 1,00,000,000uf 20v one.
So the six 2.7v 3000uf caps are in series so that you can have 16.2v capability....but...when you put capacitors in series the capacitance is reduced so in this case there's only 500uf effective capacitance
an audio capacitor is a million uf's not 1 uf and the audio cap is rated at 20v so you only need 1.
basically we are comparing a 500uf 16.2v capacitor to a 1,00,000,000uf 20v one.
just trying to understand.
I hope this helps to frame things. Remove all of the uf references and don't add in any zeros.
Most audio capacitors have a storage rating of 1 farad and a maximum voltage of 20v.
One of these ultracapacitors has a storage rating of 3000 farads and a maximum voltage of 2.7v. Connecting six ultracapacitors together in series will divide/decrease the storage rating by the number of ultracapacitors and multiply/increase the maximum voltage by the number of ultracapacitors = So the bank of six in series has an effective storage rating of 500 farads and a maximum voltage of 16.2v.
The energy stored in a capacitor is measured in Joules which is an equation of farads and voltage. As a capacitor is charged with electrons, the voltage increases as the farads are filled with electrons. To accurately compare the two solutions you need to compare at the same voltage.
Most vehicles are designed for 12v and governed at a maximum of 14.2v.
So if we pick an arbitrary number of 14v:
= Audio capacitor at 14v within 1f is = 98 joules of energy
= Ultracapacitors at 14v within 3000f / 6 in series = 49000 joules of energy
Calculators are available to convert Joules into Watts over Time measured in seconds. That can provide an interpolation of how much work can be accomplished over time.
If you think of a capacitor as a holding tank, measured by HxWxD, if we assume that D=1
Audio capacitor would be maximum H of 20, with W of 1 and assumed D of 1.
UltraCapacitor bank of six in series is maximum H of 16.2, with W of 500 and assumed D of 1.
For comparison - this ultracapacitor bank is equivalent to about 900 CCA battery, though the charge and dis-charge characteristics are completely different and the capacitors do not wear out like a battery.
Interesting concept. Another way to look at this setup is that you are using the energy from the capacitors to get the engine spinning over, and the energy from the single battery to keep it spinning over.
Interesting concept. Another way to look at this setup is that you are using the energy from the capacitors to get the engine spinning over, and the energy from the single battery to keep it spinning over.
True, though there is enough energy stored in the ultracapacitor bank to fully start the motor and have it running, at least four times in a row without any recharge.
So with no isolation, the charging amperage of the cap's is only limited by the internal resistance. Is there any concern about overloading the alternator?
Also, is there any concern about large voltage spikes when the cap's start charging. I wonder about whether there are disturbances on the 12V positive line that feeds the electronic devices in the truck. Maybe there is enough buffering built into the various power supplies, that there is no problem
.
Excellent question.
As I watch the charging after starting the motor, the alternator reaches its maximum voltage within a minute at 14.2v. The amperage was consumed to start the motor, so it has to be replaced, the difference is how fast the amperage can flow into the ultracapacitor vs into a battery based upon resistance. I don't see anything being overworked and no heat being generated any place.
What I do see is buffering. In that the ultracapacitor can charge significantly faster than the battery, I see amperage flow into the ultracapacitor first and then kind of trickle into the battery. This is noticeable at motor shut down, as the system and the ultracapacitor have reached 14.2v, alternator is no longer producing, the Optima Red Top is now being trickle charged from the 14.2v stored on the ultracapacitor until the battery can absorb and the two devices balance on voltage. So taking a voltage reading changes after motor shut down, from 14.2v down to 12.7v within an hour of the alternator not producing amperage.
No voltage spikes as the alternator governs the circuit. That is actually the beauty, is no significant voltage drop at startup and system reaches maximum voltage at 14.2v sooner than two batteries. So yes, the two devices buffer draw down events like starting as well as the charging event.
The alternator produces amperage based upon RPM, it governs the circuit at 14.2v - so it can't be overworked as it can only release as much amperage as it can produce based upon rpm and release based upon governance. Since the ultracapacitor does have less resistance, it absorbs amperage as fast as the alternator can produce and release, then alternator goes into its govern just like with two batteries.
In the truck, one battery on the drivers side providing resistance for the alternator, one ultracapacitor bank on the passenger side to,support fast amps to the starter.
02-13-2017, 08:07 PM
