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Bellhousing Question

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Old Aug 20, 2016 | 03:32 PM
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Bellhousing Question

I know this topic is probably beat to death on here but there seems to be some mixed info about it, as far as I can tell.

Anyways, I'm going to start compiling parts over the winter for a 302-460 swap on my '84 2WD with M/T (3 speed with (and) OD).

From what I've been reading, when hunting down bellhousings, 351M or 400 Bellhousings will work, BUT only if they are Cast Iron, not aluminum.

My question is (and it's probably a pretty obvious answer but I just want to check) what if I find an aluminum bellhousing already for a 460? This is the one I'm looking at and I think that it will work. I have hydraulic clutch, but are the bolt patterns for both transmission types the same? I don't know exactly which Transmission I have, but I think it's the Borg Warner type. The bellhousing pictured is said to be for a 460 so I have no reason to believe that it wouldn't just bolt up, but obviously I need to be concerned about the bolt patterns on the transmission itself.

 
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Old Aug 20, 2016 | 03:38 PM
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Butterfly tranny pattern is pretty universal in this Era.
So, yes it will fit.

You are much better off with the 460 bellhousing (only '83-'87) than trying to get a mechanical release bellhousing from a 335 series to work
 
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Old Aug 20, 2016 | 09:07 PM
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So I have a Clark Transmission and I believe the 460's used the T-18. They both have the same bolt pattern?

I'd just hate to drop the dough on this housing only to find out it doesn't bolt up!!
 
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Old Aug 20, 2016 | 09:15 PM
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Just like the transfer cases being the same, all the transmissions used the same bolt pattern, that part of it isn't a concern.

The 351M/400 housings were designed for a mechanical clutch.
 
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Old Aug 20, 2016 | 09:30 PM
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That bellhousing may be a 6.9 one, I don't see a hole for the upper starter bolt, and that looks like a diesel dust cover rather than a 460 spacer plate.
The transmission you have is a SROD or TOD, not a B-W or NP unit. Behind a healthy 460 its days may be numbered.
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by 82F100SWB
The transmission you have is a SROD or TOD, not a B-W or NP unit. Behind a healthy 460 its days may be numbered.
What would you recommend for a Transmission that would bolt right up without any bellhousing swaps, and of course set up for a hydraulic clutch
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:04 PM
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Also, will these "newer" bellhousing mate to an older (let's say mid to late '60's) engine?
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:08 PM
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Zf5 is always the go to for 460's. (And you don't need a bellhousing)

T18 or 19 is what they came with in these years
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
Zf5 is always the go to for 460's. (And you don't need a bellhousing)

T18 or 19 is what they came with in these years
With the ZF5's, are any modifications necessary to the driveshaft such as shortening or lengthening?
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by 82F100SWB
The transmission you have is a SROD or TOD, not a B-W or NP unit. Behind a healthy 460 its days may be numbered.
Actually turns out it is a Clark, I'm not sure if that is what you say is an SROD or TOD (I don't actually know what those are).

Also, that is a diesel dust shield. I planned on getting the correct spacer plate for the engine/transmission. But I guess I need to confirm if there is an upper starter bolt? Is that to say that diesel starters only had one bolt?
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:39 PM
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What do you have for a rear axle now?
I assume any 302 truck is going to need a custom shaft and maybe a conversion U-joint too.

with the zf you will also need to raise the transmission tunnel and move the tranny crossmember rearward.


Why do you think it is simple to do a engine swap?
You need a radiator, exhaust, front springs to hold it up, engine perches, a remote oil filter mount, just a lot of things to make it work if you don't have a complete donor truck.
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:44 PM
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Why would I need a remote oil filter mount. Is this because there is no clearance to fit a filter on the block with the engine in place?
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by dnkensinger
Why would I need a remote oil filter mount. Is this because there is no clearance to fit a filter on the block with the engine in place?
Exactly that; the front cross member blocks access.

Just to be clear, the engine perches Jim speaks of are NOT the motor mounts, but the apparatus the motor mounts attach to; these are typically bolted *and* riveted to the frame and cross member.
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 05:11 PM
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They are entirely riveted in my truck Chris....

There are *no* "mid '60s" 385 series engines.
They started in 1968.
385 & 335 series engines are the only ones to use this pattern

So, you have a 1950's gearbox bolted to an engine pattern that didn't start until the mid '60s?
'Cause it wasn't until late 1964 ('65 Model Year) that the 'Windsor' pattern came into being.
 
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Old Aug 21, 2016 | 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by dnkensinger
So I have a Clark RTS TS-OD (Top Shift 4 Speed Overdrive) Transmission and I believe the 460's used the T-19
RTS TS-OD = 1984/89 F150 2WD/4WD & Bronco 300/302/351W

Both the RTS and the RUG SR-OD (Single Rail 4 Speed O/D) that preceded it are "weak sisters."

One speed shift, you can kiss the little darlins' good bye.
 
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