Timing Cover Seal Issue
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
Timing Cover Seal Issue
Just got the 351W running and found that I had some issues with the mods I had done on the oil pan. I opted to go with an aftermarket pan that has a larger oil capacity. So I lift the engine and remove the old pan in prep for the new pan install. The engine has only run for maybe 15 minutes so I was interested to see what the oil residue looked like in the bottom of the pan. Good news is that the oil was pristine, the bad news is that there was a long (6 inches), thin spring in the pan. The ends of the spring fit together but for some reason the "weld" did not hold and the spring came off. The only place that this spring could have come from is the front timing cover seal. I have yet to pull the pulley and harmonic balancer and seal but I was wondering if anyone has ever seen the spring on a seal break free? This seal came in the Front Runner kit from Vintage Air, their tech guy was stumped...he had never heard of a spring failing in a seal before either.
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Joined: Apr 2015
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From: Buffalo NY
I've had those springs fall out of that type of seal on install before. What helps keep them in the seal is to pack the channel the spring sets in with bearing grease, then install it. Maybe it popped out and got chewed in half?
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
That's a good theory but the spring itself is pristine...only problem with it is that it is no longer a "ring". I think that if it had just that it popped off then it would more than likely still be on the crankshaft. I installed the V/A Front Runner kit on this engine after I got it back from my engine builder. The engine came to me with a stock Ford timing cover so I was hoping that the spring came out of the seal on THAT cover and not the V/A unit...no such luck. I have a new seal on order, when it arrives I will pull the old one and replace it. I am just glad that I have the whole front end tore down to do the oil pan work anyway.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
I have the spring in hand Ross. One end is tapered and the other square. I can insert the tapered end into the other end and it will form a nice smooth ring but the joint comes apart when I let go of the spring. I assumed that it was supposed to have been electro-welded but it may be wound as you suggest. The seal came with the V/A FrontRunner kit, I would think that for the $2,500 price tag on this setup that the seals would be high quality. Yes I did touch the seal...I pressed it into the timing cover housing prior to installing the cover on the block. Since I am the owner I guess that I feel lucky. I don't think that the engine would have been damaged but I am sure that I would have been cussin' up a storm if I had to tear into it after all the sheet metal was in place!
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
I just had one of those sinking feelings...the reason that I am changing the oil pan is because it started leaking. I made some mods on the pan to gain some clearance over the suspension crossmember and to move the drain plug. I filled the pan sump with lacquer thinner after I modified it to ensure that even the smallest of leaks would have been detected prior to installing it back on the engine...no leaks were found. After initial start-up and running the engine up to temp, I saw an oil leak over the crossmember. Not a big leak, more of a seaping which stopped when the engine was shut down. I thought that the mods to the pan were the cause but now I think that the pan was OK and my leak was coming from this seal. On one hand I am happy to find that the pan was probably not my problem but now I am even more unhappy about the seal failure.
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From: NM
Yep, the tapered end into the square end is the wound type, I'd wager. It's pretty common, even on National/Chicago Rawhide seals, but the tapered end needs to be solidly into the other end, obviously.
I didn't realize this was on your truck. That's a pretty pricey system!
I didn't realize this was on your truck. That's a pretty pricey system!
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
Yeah Ross, this is one of mine...I don't twist wrenches on anybody else's vehicles if I can help it. I am actually working on my 40 Ford coupe right now although the 56 F100 has the same setup...looks like I may have to do some PM on the truck engine as well before reassembly. I knew that there was a good reason to order TWO seals today.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
Yep, that will be the first thing I check. I ordered Timken replacement seals today. I think that I will bring this up with the tech support folks at V/A as well.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Brentwood, TN
Just pulled the seal out and sure enough, no spring! Seal is made by National, pn 2692, MEXICO. I am running a brand new Performance Products dampener so I slid the seal over the dampener collar just to see if the fit was correct and it slid on perfectly. I can see no reason for this spring to fail other than poor materials/workmanship on the part of National. I guess that I have answered another question I had in mind...will a seal function WITHOUT a spring, NO.
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Joined: Jul 2004
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From: NM
I'm surprised it leaked much, if it was a new seal, even without the spring. National is as "brand name" as they come, Mexico or not. I'd have to believe it's just an unfortunate fluke.
Do you have PCV on this engine? Could be a sign you had pressure in the crankcase.
Do you have PCV on this engine? Could be a sign you had pressure in the crankcase.