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As I was getting ready to leave town with the tractor loaded up, I was accelerating with the turbo spooling up when I heard a bit of a pop and lost power (engine still running and all, just very low power like you get when the turbo fails). I wasn't far from the shop so I came back and started getting a lot of white smoke out of the exhaust, it doesn't smell like diesel, probably more like oil. Definitely smoke, not coolant. I pulled it around back and shut it down to go grab AE and scan it and it shows a P0475, starting it back up has light smoke at idle and it idles fine but as soon as you give it any throttle it starts smoking pretty badly. Needless to say, this cancelled my trip to South Texas.
Researching it looks like the most likely cause for this is the EBPV itself but before tearing it down that far, I'd appreciate any input you guys can offer. This is the only code it's showing.
Truck has 272k on it, turbo was rebuilt a couple of years ago but we didn't do anything with the pedestal at that time. I guess in retrospect, I probably should have done the EBPV delete and the resistor fix then but I didn't think about it at the time.
On another note, my AE is not showing any of the system test for some reason, the drop down is blank. I have version 7.0.1, so it's an old version but I'm working on an old truck, so... Anybody have any idea why that might be?
I've got the truck pulled into the shop now to let it cool down. I'll probably let it sit overnight and take the turbo and EBPV out tomorrow unless someone has a better suggestion...
Well, I got it all put back together yesterday and the P0475 is gone but...it looks like the oil leak is actually coming from the turbo. I think the pop I heard was probably the turbo oil seal going out, I still have lots of white smoke in the exhaust, oil running down from the turbo casing to the exhaust outlet housing joint and the turbo is making a very bad noise. So, I've ordered a new turbo cartridge (Garrett 99-03 GTP-38 Turbo Center Cartridge Ford 7.3L) and will pop that in once it arrives. I had this turbo rebuilt a couple of years ago and it only lasted about 20k miles so I don't want to do that again.
Hopefully this clears it up, I'm missing opening weekend of dove season because of this, so I'm not very happy.
Honestly, I don't think it was the parts, I think it was the guy I had do it. I used him for about 10 years on different vehicles and he is a good mechanic but he hired some shop help that I think was not doing very good work and he wasn't supervising them as well as they needed to be. I changed mechanics this year because of some other issues, like not being able to fully correct an oil leak in 18 months, every time I took it in it was somewhere else. It's an old truck and things are going to leak but when I say fix the leak, I mean all of them, not the most obvious. Anyway, at the new shop (Powerstroke Magic) we've discovered things like not putting the rear washer in when replacing the hubs and other bonehead mistakes like that. Based on the stuff we've come across, I'm pretty sure that something got left out or not done correctly when the turbo was rebuilt. Maybe he didn't balance it, maybe all the thrust washers weren't replaced, I don't know.
At any rate, with the new cartridge and a Wicked Wheel 2 (never pass up an opportunity to improve something if you have to do the labor anyway), I should be in good shape for 200k. I hope so anyway.
Honestly, I don't think it was the parts, I think it was the guy I had do it. I used him for about 10 years on different vehicles and he is a good mechanic but he hired some shop help that I think was not doing very good work and he wasn't supervising them as well as they needed to be. I changed mechanics this year because of some other issues, like not being able to fully correct an oil leak in 18 months, every time I took it in it was somewhere else. It's an old truck and things are going to leak but when I say fix the leak, I mean all of them, not the most obvious. Anyway, at the new shop (Powerstroke Magic) we've discovered things like not putting the rear washer in when replacing the hubs and other bonehead mistakes like that. Based on the stuff we've come across, I'm pretty sure that something got left out or not done correctly when the turbo was rebuilt. Maybe he didn't balance it, maybe all the thrust washers weren't replaced, I don't know.
At any rate, with the new cartridge and a Wicked Wheel 2 (never pass up an opportunity to improve something if you have to do the labor anyway), I should be in good shape for 200k. I hope so anyway.
Just an FYI, there is no balancing needed when doing a routine rebuild on these GTP38 turbos. The turbine wheel/shaft, and the compressor wheel are each individually balanced at time of manufacture. There is no need to balance the complete assembly. This is why we can easily just drop in new wheels, such as the WW2. Also, the only way either of those pieces goes out of balance is if is bent, or is missing pieces (even small amounts of material - such as in dusting). If either a turbine or compressor wheel is out of balance, then it is physically damaged, and you should replace it
I just recently rebuilt mine, and I can tell you that despite a fairly rugged/simple appearance, the tolerances are extremely tight. If the shop left out a piece, it probably would have not even gone together right, or worked at all. Not to say they didn't screw up in some other way...
When I first went to reassemble mine, the compressor wheel would lock up tight as soon as I tried to even hand snug it down. I took everything apart again , only to find the TINIEST little flake of carbon under the thrust bearing. Seriously, it was so thin it was nearly translucent. A gust of wind blew it off my finger. Once removed everything went back together perfect.
The things you describe above are exactly why I try to stay away from mechanics. There is no accountability, or attention to detail any more. Its not just with mechanics. Its a symptom of the wider decline of the excellence that use to be what America was about. Watch the movie "Idiocracy". Yeas, its a bit over the top (it is entertainment after all), but the overall sentiment is spot on. That's where we're headed. Ok,mini-manifesto done.
Wait until you see the exhaust/turbine wheel...... I hate to break it to you, but I would cancel/return that new "cartridge". You need a whole 'nother turbo, since the outer compressor housing is also damaged. (your bottom pic) It may not look like much, but that gouged out material will greatly increase the gap between the new wheel and the housing, and you will lose a ton of intake efficiency.
Wait, that's not your NEW WW2 is it? I hope not. Also, what's that piece of greenish tape on one blade of the wheel? I think that would cause a huge imbalance at speed.
I don't think it's gouged, it feels like it's the material off the compressor wheel built up on the housing, the wheel is definitely the softer material. I hit it with some 220 and cleaned it up with a scotch brite and it looks good.
The cartridge is coming today, the WW2 won't be here until Tuesday so I'm going to put it together and see how it runs, if boost is about what it was before it came apart I'll call it good and just replace the wheel when it comes in. If not, I'll order a replacement housing and do both. Right now, I'm just wanting to get it running well enough to head to South Texas and shoot some dove. A man has got to have priorities...
The exhaust wheel actually looks fine to me. I think what happened is the oil seal blew out on the exhaust side and the whole thing got some play in it. I can move the wheels back and forth some and actually can't get the intake wheel off, it just free wheels when I clamp the other side.
Originally Posted by bcg;15655208..........
The exhaust wheel actually looks fine to me. I think what happened is the oil seal blew out on the exhaust side and the whole thing got some play in it. I can move the wheels back and forth some ...[/quote
Nope. That exhaust wheel is TRASHED. See how the outer tips are actually little "hooks", or claw-like? They are not supposed to be like that. They shouldn't "wrap" around the center housing, like yours are. The back face of the wheel should be flat, and with a small gap between it and the cartridge.
If you can manage to get it apart, you will find the heat shield and the back face of the wheel have "matching" gall marks/gouging, with chunks appearing to have been "peeled" out of each. ANY amount of in/out play is very bad, and will quickly lead to the carnage you are seeing.
Here's pics of my old turbine and center section:
Your turbo has swallowed a crap-ton of metal shavings, so I would make sure you thoroughly flush out the oil passages in the pedestal and any other parts you are reusing ,as well as changing your engine oil.
and actually can't get the intake wheel off, it just free wheels when I clamp the other side.
You may have broken the shaft. Actually, I wonder if the previous "mechanic" may have used an impact gun on the wheel? That will do it. Never, ever use an impact gun to remove/install a turbo wheel. (Except maybe to get your old one apart for a post mortem, since its already junk anyway). Which is why you may want to wait until your WW2 arrives, so you can install it once and be done. Otherwise, you'll probably need to pull the turbo again to install the WW2 correctly.
I replaced the pedestal to do the EBPV delete. I do see all the shavings in there, an oil change is a good idea, I lost about 2 quarts through the turbo anyway.
The engine only ran a total of about 15 minutes from the time it happened until now so hopefully the damage is isolated to just the turbo.
I agree, I should wait for the WW2 and only do it once but I want to go shoot dove so I'm going to do it twice. It's OK, I'm getting pretty fast at the R&R of the turbo. Unfortunately...
First time I got it put together I got about 20 pounds of boost like I was before the turbo failed but the accumulator wasn't fully mated to the turbo so I fixed that problem and now she's bellowing black smoke and will barely make 10 pounds and even then it's at high RPMs.
Disconnecting the MAP sensor helps a little but not much.
Disconnecting the vacuum line for the wastegate makes no difference.
I've visually inspected all my boots and connections for the intercooler, intake, exhaust, up pipes (I have the bellowed up pipes), etc. and everything is tight. This is driving me crazy...
