I'm getting ready to rebuild my Hick-em-up truck...

It's got a 460 w/650 holley, BW T-18, & Dana 60 w/ 3.73 gears
Block-(D1VE-6015-A2B) heads-(D3VE-A2A) Intake-(D6VE-8425-A3A)

I want to get at least 600hp out of the engine when I'm done.

I'm just having a hard time coming up with a good combination of parts. I found the cam I want was too extreme for my stock heads (Could this be taken care of with head work?), and wouldn't work well with a tunnel ram...Do I want a tunnel ram on a set up like this? What would be the best intake?

Also I don't know if I could get the heads worked over enough to handle that kind of HP or do I need to get new ones? I don't want Aluminum

I'm building this strictly for dragracing

I want to build the compression to at least 10.5 to 1
Bore it out (But not sure how much is safe)

Where would be some good places to find dependable parts for this?

I've got the Ignition system figured out..I think...
I'm going with a complete MSD setup.
The Pro Billet dist.
Blaster 2 coil
and the 6AL box with a three step module selector

As far as the air intake I want to get ahold of the K&N 14" with the breathable top...the bottom will sit just about flush with the top of the hood (hopefully)

I'm also getting the 1 piece F/G GT500 style front end that rolls foward. But the body's not important at this point....


If anyone has some good suggestions on what will get me into my HP goal please feel free to enlighten me!! I'm still kinda new to the "Old car" thing....

Thanks
Darrell

 

Why no aluminum??? Anyway, a lot of power can be made with the old iron stuff. Contrary to popular belief old iron CJ/SCJ's can make a ton of hp and torque. For the money though, you are probably looking at a set of C9VE's, or D0VE's. You'd want to get them P&P'd as well as get some larger valves installed. All that work won't be cheap, but a good breathing set of heads is your foundation.
I don't think you will want a tunnel ram. No need for that. Heck you can make 600 hp with a dual plane Stealth and still have tons of torque.
BTW, what cam were you wanting to run?

JJ

 

I'll have to dig it up again...I think it was a CRANE cam.

The reason I'd like to stay away from aluminum: I dunno, I've heard the aluminum heads warp quickly and easier, just don't last as long...

Which would be the better of the two between the C9VE or D0VE?

I do want to get oversized valves, but I don't know how big yet....

How big can you safely bore these out? I've heard people taking about boring it to a 504 up to a 514 but I think that sounds a little extreme?? I dunno

 

C9's and D0VE's are the same for all practical purposes. Most people go with 2.19 and 1.75, some go with 2.25 intake, although I have heard some people have gone with 2.19 and 1.88 to help exhaust that much more.

Most 514's that you hear of are actually stock bore. They have been stroke to 4.3 inches from the 3.85 stock. That stroke with 0.030 overbore gives a 521 which is also common.

I don't think aluminum heads are less durable. But nobody is making you use them. Anyway, let us know on the cam if you get a chance.

JJ

 

Well, I'm not sure about the heads...That's why I ask on here

I found a set of alum. CobraJet heads for the 460 with oversized valves (2.200" intake, 1.76" exaust) and springs, but I don't really like the price...they're proud of those things

The original cam I was looking at is a Comp cam. Magnum cam. PT#249-CL34-331-4
280* adv. dur., 530" lift, RPM range 2000-6000

I'm also looking at a Lunati cam PT#638-41605
300/310 adv. dur., 559/572" gross lift 3000-6500rpm

Lunati also has another PT#638-41607
305/314* adv. dur., 603/609 gross lift 4000-7400RPM

 

Yeah, the intial price of the aluminum's may give you a bit of sticker shock, but, you gotta keep in mind that if you go buy a set of old iron heads then have all the work done to them that you will need, you're talking about having $1000 set of iron heads that will get outperformed by the aluminum. I'd say to get to 600 hp with a 460 you're best bet would be a set of ported aluminum. No need to go too big on the porting. You can make that much power and more with old iron, but it's easier and maybe cheaper with aluminum.

Those cams you are talking about, those don't look like roller specs, at least not the lift. I think you'd be much happier with a roller. When you're trying to get that much hp, a roller is a much better choice. More aggressive ramps allow the overall duration to be less which gives you a much milder mannered motor but still more hp/torque when you need it.

JJ

 

I will definately keep that in mind!

I think those cams were rocker style....

So rollers are better? Where can I find a good "kit" with the springs, lifters, cam, and chain?

All the cams I have found so far are rockers

What do you think would be an ideal dur. and lift?

And I'm also not sure about the RPM ranges...I do know that mine raps real tight at 4500rpm. Will a new cam make it rap higher, or just faster? did that make sense?

 

When talking about cam types, you are actually talking about the lifters. There are three basic types, hydraulic, solid, and roller. There are also hydraulic rollers which are kind of the best of both worlds. Hydraulics use oil pressure to take up any slack in the valve train. Solids and solid rollers are just that, solid. Hydaulics and solid lifters are just sort of flat on the bottom and they glide over the bumps on a cam. Rollers as the name implies have a roller that rolls over the bump on the cam. Rollers allow the bumps to be much more aggressive. The slope up and down can be more steep. This allow for more lift with less duration.

Rockers on the other hand are the fulcrums which translate lifters going up and down on the cam into valves opening and closing. They rock back and forth on their pedestal. They come in different varieties as well. Most stock rockers are just stamped steel. They have no bearing, they just slide on a fulcrum more like a bushing. Higher end rockers have roller tips, where the end of the rocker has a roller that rolls on top of the valve which reduces friction. Even higher end rockers are aluminum or forged steel and have roller bearings at the fulcrum and a roller at the tip. These substantially reduce friction.

If you get a new cam like the ones mentioned above the engine's power will be made around 2500-6000 RPM's. The reason your engine feels like it is rapped out at such a low RPM is probably two fold. First it's probably not balanced very well. They don't take the time from the factory to do a great job at that. And for the most part it doesn't matter that much at lower RPM's. Second, your engine combo is actually running out of power at those higher RPM's. An engine doesn't necessarily make more power at higher RPM's. The combination of components making up that engine determine it's best operating range. The effects of friction combined with the fact that the heads/cam etc are not allowing enough air in for your engine to turn more RPM's limits your engine's effective RPM range. After a certain RPM any engine will actually start to make less power. Those new cams, if matched to other components properly will make the most power in the range of 2500-6000 RPM's. Since your engine will also be making more hp it will also allow it to rev up quicker, especially under a load, i.e. accelerating while in the truck. I hope this helps.

JJ

BTW there are several books available that talk about engine basics as well as camshaft basics. You might want to check those out, too.

 

You're such a help! Thank you!

I do have alot of learning about this before it acually goes together....

Do you have any titles to specific books? I'm gonna try to make it to a bookstore this weekend...

Again..thaks for your help, and input!!

 

Another quick question, when trying to get this much power, which would be the better set up? A timing chain and wheel, or a complete timing gear set up? I've heard the gears might be a little noisy, but would be less likely to slip or break, also I was told I'd have to plumb a oil line and catch to it? Is this correct?

 

I'd go with a good double roller. Gears are a pain. You also get a lot more harmonics from your crank into your cam and valve train with a gear setup. That is not good.

JJ

 

Again, Thanks

You sound like you know a lil' somethin bout these things? Wanna build mine, or at least have a hand in it

I appreciate your quick responses...
darrell

 

I know a little. I'm not the only one, though. There's a lot of guys on here that probably know more than me. I seriously would help you but my work takes up allof my time right now. I will answer any questions you have from planning the build to the actual build itself. Just LMK.

JJ

 

Hey, I hear ya, that's one of my problems...NO TIME! Well that just gives me more time to sack away $$$ to get this done!!

I'm lookin' for a second job as we speak...Just trying to get er' done faster..

Thanks for all the help! I'm sure I will be asking more from you!!

 

Have you thought about a centrifical supercharger? I used a piece of software called DYNO 2000 to build the 460 for my `79 F-250 4x4 and I came up with a 700+HP engine running on pump gas.