1978 F150 XLT Ranger Short Cab/Bed 351M/C6 4x4 102k miles

Truck is all factory with the 351M/C6 combo. I have acquired an NP435 with the bellhousing and an extra 205 transfer case. All of the parts should be in tomorrow to convert the cab from the C6 to the 435. All I should need is a flywheel and clutch kit. What I thought was going to be "text book simple" as far as the flywheel and clutch is concerned has turned into more research.

No local parts store can get a 351M flywheel. I started calling local pull yards -- no go there, either. I turned to an online yard search and found many options, but they list different clutch specs.

Let's see if I have this clear -- from the factory, a 351M had an 11" clutch and a 400 had a 12" clutch. Right?

Secondly, if there are no balance differences between a 351M and 400 flywheel, I would opt for a 12" 400 clutch if my aforementioned data is correct.

I have yet to ask a parts house for a 400 flywheel, but I will start if they are completely interchangeable.

I plan on always having this truck, so the tranny is off to the shop Monday to ensure its condition and fix any issues before it's installed. Considering that, I only want to hoist this beast up and bolt it in one time. With that being said, what is a highly recommended clutch kit these days? I'm assuming at least something from Napa.

I did some searches and found older data -- so I wanted to ask you guys and make sure before I went any further in case time has changed anything.

Thanks for any advice! =)

 

I don't know about your flywheel issues (try L&L?), but I've had great luck with LUK brand clutches, most decent parts stores carry them.

 

Thanks for your input! =)

After cross-referencing and double checking my data, I finally found and hit the order button on a new Pioneer FW-166 180 tooth flywheel. It shows it fits both the 351M and the 400. Once it gets here, I'll check into clutches over the counter, but it seems I can use either one. If so, I will use the 12" set.

Now, I'm not sure about my current starter -- it's for the 351M/C6 combo I have, but my cross-referencing shows no difference between an automatic and manual application. Is it true I can use the same starter?

 

So I have been told....The 400 uses a 12" clutch and the 351m uses a 11"

D7TZ-6375-D .. 400 Flywheel-Use with 12" clutch.
D7TZ-6375-E .. 351M Flywheel-Use with 11" clutch.

Starters are different I do believe? In the way they mount to the auto trans housing versus the standard/manual trans bell housing.

If you have a 351M I would get a 351M clutch.

351M guru http://www.tmeyerinc.com/

Other 351M info for ya.

History of the Ford 351M
Rumors & Myths
351M/400 Performance Build Up
M-Block 351M/400 Parts Reference
Bubba's M-Block Ford V8 Workshop

 

Thanks!

I will continue to research the starters. =)

Using the part numbers you provided, I began another search -- starting with the D7TZ-6375-E (351M flywheel). It brought me to this thread:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...confusion.html

Reading all of the information provided showed a serial # break in a certain part, according to Number Dummy's post. I wasn't sure if that was the engine itself, the clutch fork, starter, or flywheel. There was also a comment from JB78f150 about his 390 flywheel working with both clutches, where then Number Dummy mentioned it wasn't OE equipment, but an auto store chain "works-for-all" unit.

That got me to thinking ---

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/7...-flywheel.html

^^ shows an older post from Number Dummy mentioning an updated E5TZ-6375-H flywheel part number for both the 351M and 400.

With all of that being said, the flywheel I ordered matches Number Dummy's updated E5TZ-6375-H p/n. Maybe it's got a bigger surface on it to work with either clutch, since all of the bolt holes, splines, and input shaft diameters are the same, no matter how you look up a 351M/400 clutch -- other than disc diameter (11" or 12").

I guess I have researched all I can to this point, and will just have to wait until it's here in front of me to make my clutch decision. This is a Pioneer p/n FW-166, which matches the E5TZ-6375-H updated Ford p/n, and is listed to fit the following:

FORD COUNTRY SEDAN (1965 - 1970)
FORD COUNTRY SQUIRE (1965 - 1967)
FORD CUSTOM (1968 - 1971)
FORD E-100 (1976 - 1979)
FORD E-250 (1976 - 1979)
FORD E-350 (1976 - 1979)
FORD F-100 (1965 - 1981)
FORD F-150 (1975 - 1981)
FORD F-250 (1965 - 1982)
FORD F-350 (1965 - 1982)
FORD GALAXIE (1965 - 1971)
FORD RANCH WAGON (1965 - 1969)

That list covers a whole myriad of engines.

Thanks again! =)

 

Update ::

I got an e-mail this morning saying their inventories were incorrect on p/n FW-166. I called the Ford dealer for an OEM, and naturally -- no one has one. Now, I'm back to calling out-of-state salvage yards. Lol.

Waiting on a call now to verify stock on an OE 400 (12" clutch) flywheel.

 

Maybe I can lend some assistance on the starter. First, did you get the manual block plate? I made the mistake of assuming auto and manual were the same the first time around. See picture. As for starter, most listings show only one for auto and manual. However I did find info on Lester#s 3225 (manual) and 3226 (auto). I had the old auto, and two new starters (1 auto, 1 manual) due to another painful lesson I learned. Regardless, I installed the #3225, and it works fine. Everyplace i looked listed the 351M/400/429/460 starter as all the same. Ignore the pmgr aspect of the starter. The auto and manual starters appeared to have a slight difference on nose angle/depth but I could have imagined it.

2nd Edit: I didn't find any info stating you COULDN'T use the auto starter, but I found just enough info to spook me into buying one specifically listed for a manual.

 

^^ Thank you so much! Great information!

I should have a flywheel on its way tomorrow from Colorado. They split the engine/trans in a '79 400 powered Bronco, but I didn't confirm whether it's an 11" or 12" clutch. Either way, it will work, and I'll be happy. Along with the flywheel, they're sending the block plate and all of the bolts.

I asked the salvage guy about the starters, as he said he knew "alot" about those engines -- he said they were the same, and confirmed what you said on his computer; same part number.

Regardless, I will take what you said into consideration, and obtain a manual starter at the time of conversion.

 

Good luck. I did the same swap with a truck with 460. Similar issues. Most of it is bolt in. That said there are some challenging problems. As you will see number dummy post there are around 380 combinations of pedals for 73-79. You can find a set on ebay/junkyard usually, but rarely will it be what you need. I got a decent pedal set. Dont be tempted to drill out the brake pedal hole on the auto column support. Find a decent manual/brake/clutch pedal set and swap it in. There are 2 bolts holding the column and 5 screws on the bottom seal and then the column can lay down on the seat. No big deal. Now, the set I got located the hole for the pedals 2 inches forward. So, I got a new, appropriate booster to.my vehicle (#of pistons, cruise, and serial #). I cut the rod and threaded it. Used coupling nuts to lengthen. See pictures. Also you may have.high hump or low hump trans tunnel. I had low and had to cut it, then buy and use a cover. See pictures. I have completed the truck and its running. I plan on doing a formal write up similar to what you would see in a magazine because there is a lot of disjointed info and I wasn't able to find a single good source. Let me.know if either questions. I feel like I could write a book on this swap because I have made all of the mistakes.



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Great photos, and thanks for the info!

I have already ordered all of my cab conversion parts. My truck is a high-hump -- I got lucky and found a tunnel cover from a twin-stick, but even if I hadn't found it, I wasn't cutting mine.

I wanted to convert the cab as much as I could prior to the NP435 going in to minimize downtime, so I thought of what would be the hardest pre-tranny thing to install, and I chose the brake/clutch pedal unit. I put it in a few weeks ago, and it was completely bolt-in as far as to the steering column, firewall, and brake booster actuator. I just have to find some pictures or another truck to examine and see where the hole goes for the clutch rod.

I have a non-column shift steering column, along with (supposedly) all of the clutch/brake pedal hardware, and the trans hump cover w/ boots already here. I found a complete '79 F150 twin stick in Broken Bow, NE that I was able to get all of the aforementioned from. I should've asked them about the flywheel, but never dreamed it would be so hard to get one. And, at the time, I wasn't thinking about the block plate. I just hope I'm not forgetting anything else! Lol. Hopefully, a good flywheel and block plate is coming from Colorado. They were going to ship Monday, but forgot to pack the block plate, and I didn't hear from them yesterday. I will try and find something out about that stuff today.

Thanks again, everyone!

 

Update:

Junk yard called yesterday in reference to the flywheel and dust cover/block plate. He asked if I had the 1/8" thick spacer for the NP435 that went between the block and the bellhousing to basically "shim" the starter. I told him no, and agreed to go ahead and have him send that, too.

Now, I'm curious ... I just thought there was a thin piece of plate, similar to the one now on the truck between the block and the C6. But, I'm guessing there's something a little different, maybe thicker? Maybe this explains why only one starter will "work". I'm kind-of scratching my head now. Lol.

All should ship today.

 

Shim? There shouldn't be one. Unless he means the block plate: aka dust shield, aka engine plate. I guess wait and see what you get, but you shouldn't need a shim or spacer of any sort other than the block plate. With knowing what you have coming, I'd say use the Lester #3225 starter, block plate, and that's it. For reference, the block plate in my picture above is from bronco graveyard and about 1/8" in depth. Wait and see I suppose.

 

It's hard to discuss parts over the phone sometimes! Lol. He did say it was about 1/8" thick, so I think he's talking about the block plate. I initially told him I needed the block plate since he had to tear the Bronco down any way for the flywheel, and he asked what I was talking about. I finally said dust cover, and he had a "duh" moment. He ended up calling it a spacer, such as to shim the starter, and I was a little confused -- but, when he said it was the diameter of the bell housing, about 1/8" thick, and had the starter hole in it, I knew he meant the block plate. I just wanted to run it by y'all to make sure, since I am piecing all of this together without actually "seeing" a factory setup by converting from a complete donor. Thanks again!

 

I may have missed it but what did you do for drive shafts. Did C6 drive shafts work. I found a NP 435 that was connected to a 460 it has bell housing, trans, clutch petal assy. and a 205 transfer case. I have a C6 with a 203 transfer case and want go to part time four wheel drive and a manual. The guy wants 300 dollars for all of it.

 

The E5TZ-6375-H flywheel was the 1985 FoMoCo service part replacement for 1977/82 351M & 400 flywheels. Originally 351M flywheels used an 11" clutch, while 400's used a 12" clutch.

This flywheel wasn't used on a 1983/85 anything, nor was it used on any car! It's unbelievable that someone could come up with this BS! It's also obsolete, no Ford dealer or obsolete parts vendor has any.

The above applications are hideously wrong! I corrected the ones that were close.

1975/79 Econolines only came with 300 I-6/351W/460, excepting the 302 that was first available in 1979 E100's. None were available with 351M/400.

400's installed in 1971/79 Passenger Cars & 351M's installed in 1975/79 Passenger Cars were only available with A/T's.

351M/400 = 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350.

The largest available V8 in 1980/83 F100's was the 302 2V

And btw: Some of the clutch related linkage parts used in 1977 are different than 1978. Some of the 1979 related parts are different than 1977 & 1978. And, there are two different bellhousings.

So you better get all the linkage parts and bellhousing from a one year only truck. If you piecemeal the parts from different years, you'll be up **** creek without a paddle!

And, be aware that LMC's catalog applications inre to 1977/79 351M/400 clutch linkage parts is WRONG!