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Strange No Start/Rough Start Behvavior

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Old Mar 30, 2015 | 11:52 AM
  #1  
sunuvabug's Avatar
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From: SW ON, Canada
Strange No Start/Rough Start Behvavior

Truck has been sitting for about 3 days. Temps around freezing give or take. Not plugged in. No new fuel ... has about 5/8 in current tank.

Cranked strong for about 10 seconds but would not catch. I stopped cranking. Waited about 10 seconds to try again. Usually cranks for less than a second with last year's new batteries.

Tried starting a second time. After cranking for about 10 seconds, engine is trying to catch ... sounds weak ... but doesn't catch. I stopped cranking. Waited about 20 seconds this time.

Third time works like a charm. Drove 5 miles to destination, parked, and 2 hours later started right away.

FWIW - I have noticed what I think may be more than usual blue smoke coming from tailpipe on start-up. Could be my imagination or the change in air temperature but I don't think so.

This "no start/rough start" stuff has never happened before. Should I be worried? ... anything I need to check out?
 
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Old Mar 30, 2015 | 05:45 PM
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If it was colder than usual and you are running dino oil, I'd suspect the oil was a wee bit too thick and the engine didn't like it. If you have synthetic oil in a light weight we can rule that out.

Freezing is cold enough to reduce the available amps from the batteries too. Fairly new so you'd hope they are not the issue, but maybe they did not get a full charge from a bad connection or weak alt. Or there is a parasitic power drain. A cheapo voltmeter stuck in the cigar lighter would show some useful voltages. Normal would be 12 or so just sitting there, 11 when GPs on, 10-11 when cranking. According to the book it requires 10.5v to start, but I've seen mine start at 9.8v.

If I lived in a cold place I'd put the GPs thru 2 cycles, watching the voltage to see when they turn off. Then key it over the rest of the way to start. That way the GPs did their job and are out of the loop, and the starter gets all the voltage.

Might as well check the ICP sensor connection for oil too. If it was bad and defaulting to set value it will not build up normal pressure and could contribute to a hard start cold. I think. I have no experience to back that up.
 
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Old Mar 30, 2015 | 05:54 PM
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Thanks for replying David. Oil is synthetic 10-40. It cranked strong all three times ... just wouldn't catch. On the second try, it tried to catch but sounded like it was "running on/missing or dieseling" ... no pun intended.

I just tried it again after a few hours. Cranked strong and started quickly ... like it usually does. No excessive smoke blowing out the exhaust this time.

Could it possibly have something to do with the quality of the fuel or perhaps condensation in the fuel mix? Perhaps a clogging fuel filter?
 
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Old Mar 30, 2015 | 06:55 PM
  #4  
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Originally Posted by sunuvabug
Thanks for replying David. Oil is synthetic 10-40. It cranked strong all three times ... just wouldn't catch. On the second try, it tried to catch but sounded like it was "running on/missing or dieseling" ... no pun intended.

I just tried it again after a few hours. Cranked strong and started quickly ... like it usually does. No excessive smoke blowing out the exhaust this time.

Could it possibly have something to do with the quality of the fuel or perhaps condensation in the fuel mix? Perhaps a clogging fuel filter?
Here is a basic list for Hard Starts. Maybe it will help you identify the problem?

echo=on
HARD START/NO START DIAGNOSTICS

**NOTE: A hard start/ No start concern with EOT Temp. Below 60F perform step 10 first.

Tools: Fuel Filter Cap Removal Tool / Flash Light / Tools Flash Light /
White Bond Paper / Stop or Wrist Watch w/Secong Hand Sweep / DVOM

Step #1: Visual Engine/Chassis Inspection

Tools: Flash Light

Fuel Oil Coolant Electrical Hoses Leaks Check

Tools: White Bond Paper

Step #2 Check for contaminates Correct Grade and Viscosity Miles/Hours on oil, correct level.

Step #3 Intake/Exhaust Restriction

Tools: Flash Light

Inspect air filter and ducts -exhaust system / Inspect exhaust back pressure device

Step #4 Sufficient Clean Fuel

Tools: Fuel Filter Cap Removal Tool

a. Check if the WATER IN FUEL lamp has been illuminated.
b. After verifying that there is fuel in the tank, drain a sample from fuel filter housing at
key on.
c. NOTE: Fuel pump will run for 20 sec. at key on

Step #5 Electric Fuel Pump Pressure

Tools: DVOM / Fuel Port Adaptor and Pressure Gauge 0-160 PSIG

a. Verify that the fuel pump has voltage and gnd. present at key on.
b. Measure fuel pressure at the Fuel Bowl Test Port key on.
c. Instrument Spec. 45 PSIG min. / WOT Under Load =/> 42 PSIG.
* If pressure fails low, go to step 8c on the Performance side of this sheet to identify cause

Step #6 Perform KOEO On Demand Test

Tools: OBD-II On-Board Diagnostics, Phase 2 Vehicle Media Communications Unit (Scanner)

DTCs set during this test are current faults.

Note: IDM DTCs displayed here could be current or historical faults

Step #7 Retrieve Continuous Trouble Codes

Tools: OBD-II On-Board Diagnostics, Phase 2 Vehicle Media Communications Unit (Scanner)

DTCs retrieved during this test are historical faults. Note: IDM DTCs are cleared when codes are cleared.

Step #8 KOEO Injector Electrical Self-Test

Tools: Bi-Directional Scan Tool.

a. All injectors will momentarily buzz, then individual injectors will buzz in sequence 1 through 8. IDM DTCs may be transmitted after test is completed.
b. Note: IDM DTCs may be historical if not cleared above.

Step #9 Data List Monitoring

Tools: OBD-II On-Board Diagnostics, Phase 2 Vehicle Media Communications Unit (Scanner)

1. Select the parameters indicated from the NGS parameter list and monitor while cranking engine.

Parameter/Spec:
a. V PWR / 10.5 volt min.
b. RPM / 100-150 RPM minimum
c. ICP / 500 PSI or 3.4mPa min.
d. ICPv / 0.25v – 0.30v
e. FUEL PW / 1 mS to 6mS
* V PWR -If indicating a low voltage condition, check battery voltage, charging system or power and ground circuits to the PCM. GO TO PINPOINT TEST A

* RPM -Low RPM could be an indication of starting/ charging system problems, RPM indicated with the engine cranking -could be CMP circuit fault, check for Diagnostic Trouble Codes. GO TO PINPOINT TEST DG

*ICP -A minimum of 500 PSI (3.4 mPa) is required before the injectors are enabled. No or low oil in the reservoir, system leakage, injector O-Rings or faulty IPR could cause pressure loss.

*Go to section 4 step 9c in the PC/ED Manual for a detailed description on how to perform this test. Note: If no RPM signal is received, IPR duty cycle will default to 14%

*FUEL PW -Even though a 1 to 6 mS FUEL PW is shown, it’s possible the IDM did not receive the signal due to a CI or FDCS circuit fault or internal IDM failure.

Step #10 Glow Plug System Operation

Tools: DVOM / Stop or Wrist Watch w/Secong Hand Sweep

a. Glow Plug ON time is dependent on oil temperature and altitude. The Glow Plug relay comes on between 1 and 120 sec. and does not come on at all if oil temp is above 131 F.
b. Verify that B+ is being supplied on the large BK/W wire going to the Glow Plug relay.
c. Install a voltmeter to the glow plug feed terminal (two brown wires or center terminal on the shunt).
d. Using a Bi-Directional Scan Tool and EOT PID’s, verify glow plug "on" time.
e. Turn key to run position, measure voltage ("on “time) (Dependent on oil temperature and altitude) Relay on time Spec. Measurement 1 to 120 seconds B +
f. Note: Wait to Start Lamp "on" time (1 -10 sec.) is independent from Glow Plug "on" time
g. Glow Plug Resistance
h. Remove both 9 pin connectors from valve covers • Measure each Glow Plug resistance to Bat. Ground. Measure engine harness resistance to relay. .1 to 2 ohms
i. Glow Plug Connector to relay 0 to 1 ohms
FRONT
#2 #1
#4 #3
#6 #5
#8 #7

*Add 5 seconds to glow plug on time when above 7000 feet in altitude, but not to exceed 120 seconds.
echo=off
 
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