Guys - I need a reality check to see if I'm crazy or if a vendor is crazy. I'm interested in http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hot-Rat-Street-Rod-Block-Hugger-Tight-Tuck-Header-DOUGS-Ford-351C-400M-Cleveland-/281577934683?rmvSB=true, like Raleigh1 is using. (In fact, this is his pic.)



But, if you go to Doug's web site they say their headers won't fit my '81 F150 w/a M/400. Although they say they will fit an '81 F150 w/a 351W. Huh? First, the F's didn't come with W's until '82. Second, don't shorties fit exactly where the exhaust manifolds fit? And, don't the 70's M/400's use the same exhaust manifolds that mine uses? So, if the shorties fit Raleigh1's truck won't they fit mine?

Given that, I sent the following to Doug's:And I got this response:So, I wrote:And Carl said:So, I said:And, Carl replied:So, guys, am I crazy? If the headers replace the manifolds wont they fit my truck?

 

You're logic seems to make sense to me. The vendor is clearly not reading what you emailed to them. It almost looks like your talking to a robot, or some one who is not very knowledgeable and is just using a reference book.


I am assuming the 351M and 400 manifolds for the 79 older trucks the same as the 81-82 trucks? Did they confirm these headers exit at the same spot as the stock manifolds? If this is the case, then I would think that these headers should work in your application. I am curious how close they are to my stock 1972 400 manifolds, maybe they would work in my car too.

 

Thanks for the reply. Maybe I'm not crazy?

Ok, let's clear this up. From the Bubba's web site:




So, all trucks with the M/400 ran the same passenger's side exhaust manifold, which could bear casting number of D7TE-9430-A or D7TE-9430-AB. Here's a pic of my exhaust manifolds from Dad's 1981 F150. The passenger's side manifold is 20" long and bears the casting number D7TE-9430-AB. The driver's side manifold bears casting number D5AE-9431-AB.



So, if the Doug's shorty headers work on Raleigh1's truck they'll work on mine. However, Pertronix/Doug's/Patriot don't know or understand that. You've seen my conversation with Carl from there. Well, today I called them and drew someone who knows more than Carl, but is still less than fully aware of what they have. Here are my notes:

• The part number of D6512-R, for headers with a raw finish, or D6512-1, for a ceramic finish, are shorty headers for a street rod with a 1927-1948 Ford chassis and running a 351C/M/400.
• They were discontinued by Doug's from manufacturing on 1/16/14 but are available from Patriot under part number H8435-R or -1.
• A footnote in the catalog says "Passenger side opens back, not down"
• Shorty headers are intended to replace the factory exhaust manifolds

And, if you put the Patriot # into Google you'll find that sells them at $302.99. HOWEVER, Amazon's page doesn't say if that price gets you the raw headers, chrome ones, or ceramic-coated ones. And the page says is "Available in three finishes; uncoated for individual customizing, chrome finish for that show quality shine or with Patriot's very popular metallic ceramic coating." I just talked to Michelle at Amazon and they don't know what they have. However, she's contacting the right people to sort this out, so hopefully in a couple of days there will be clarification.

 

Have you seen this thread:


https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...ring-gear.html


It looks like he gets the Sanderson FC4's to work on his truck. Sanderson has the dimensions on there website, maybe you can get the ones from Doug's to see how they compare. I checked my car (Torino), the rights side has TONS of room. My stock manifold angles down on the right. The left manifold gets pretty close to the steering box though for my application.


If they worked on the older truck, then they may be worth trying on your truck. I'd just want to check on the return policy before laid out the cash. I am in the same boat, trying to find headers for my car. It looks like the Sanderson FC4's would work, but I don't want take a chance and order them to find out they don't fit.

 

Hadn't seen that thread, but have now. Thanks. Will check out Sanderson.

 

Hey Gary, if you have a welder and a chop saw, make your own. Theres al kinds of places to buy tubing,kits,flanges, etc. From your other post ive seen of yours,you have the know how and talent,use them my friend. Ive made a few sets for drag cars, when the 400 goes in im building my own again.

 

Hadn't thought of that. Will check into it. Thanks for the idea.

 

if i can help in any way, let me know. In making headers,ideally you want all tubes the same length to optimize HP and TQ, but lets face it, some shorty's you cant. If you build a set that all go strait to the center of the block down by the oil pan rail you can get close, the ones shown above clearly you cant.

 

Hey Gary, the issue is that the flange exits rear and not down, that was very easy to resolve:


BTW these are awesome headers, you won't be disappointed if you decide to go with them.

 

Thanks. But do both sides exit rear? I assumed only the passenger's side did. Also, is your pic upside down? And what is the header bolted to? I am lost looking at it.

 

Just the passenger exits back, driver side is pointed down.

That is a pic looking between the frame rail and the inner fender at the header flange.
It shows how I cut the discharge flange and angled it down to clear the cab floor.

 

Ok, thanks. I think I understand.

 

I can take more pics if you need, just let me know what you have questions about.

 

Hey Raleigh1, are you planning to use the Doug's headers when you go Turbo? Also, how severe did you have to angle that exhaust where it turns down to clear the dash panel/firewall? Looks pretty tight from that pic. (I grabbed a set of the Doug's after seeing your build. Wasn't sure if they would become scarce.)

 

I planned to use them for the turbo set up, but this motor has plenty of top end power so I am not sure I will even go that route at this point.

I had to turn it down about 50 degrees, doesn't seem to affect flow.