i need a confirmation
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i need a confirmation
Been having hard start issues lately, just slow spinning then a bang faster spins bang and then she fires. New gp system and new 925cca batteries. Block heater plugged in and the thing slowly spun today then got slower hooked up the battery charger and then it stopped spinning after another attempt. AT lunch today I went home and nothing but a click at the solenoid. Wts works and everything. Bad starter right? Is there a pmgr starter for these guys?
Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 8,476
Likes: 37
From: Madison, WI
May also be a bad main power connection, bad main battery ground. Or maybe one or both of those new batteries is no good. LOAD test them before pulling the starter.
Does your charger have a high-current (50-200 amp) "start" mode?
PMGR is Planetary (something) Gear Reduction, I believe.
Does your charger have a high-current (50-200 amp) "start" mode?
PMGR is Planetary (something) Gear Reduction, I believe.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 10,121
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From: Orrville, Ohio
There are plenty of gear reduction starters out there for these trucks. Get any starter for a 99 up (SD) 7.3 and you'll be getting a gear reduction starter that bolts right up. Note that they only have 2 bolts as opposed to our three, but they work just great.
And I would concur with everything that Madpogue said about checking all your connections. That sounds like a bad connection may be a good possibility.
And I would concur with everything that Madpogue said about checking all your connections. That sounds like a bad connection may be a good possibility.
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I'd think it was a bad connection if something had changed. Nothing has though.
So a standard starter out of a 2003 psd 7.3 f code will bolt right in? No issues no changing wires?
And it faded to not turning. It went from usual with a little longer to okay maybe I'll cycle the glow plugs again, it's cold. And then it went to okay come on now the batteries ain't weak. And then each time got less and less. And my battery gauge climbed because the charger was on it.
So a standard starter out of a 2003 psd 7.3 f code will bolt right in? No issues no changing wires?
And it faded to not turning. It went from usual with a little longer to okay maybe I'll cycle the glow plugs again, it's cold. And then it went to okay come on now the batteries ain't weak. And then each time got less and less. And my battery gauge climbed because the charger was on it.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 10,121
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From: Orrville, Ohio
The only thing you may have to do is to enlarge one of the holes in the wiring lugs that bolt to the starter. I didn't have to do that but some do. Other than that, yes it bolts right in.
I'd still look closely at the wiring before I spent a couple hundo on a new starter. I understand not wanting to go on a wild goose chase, but with the way the wiring is in these trucks, and with multiple batteries it's still a possibility that there could be another wiring issue.
It could also be a bad starter relay (on the inside of the passenger side fender). Make sure the truck is in park (or neutral with the e-brake set if it's a 5 speed) turn the key to the "Run" Position and let the GPs glow, then jump the two big terminals on that relay with a big screw driver. It may spark a little, but if it cranks, then you just need a $30 relay and not a $200 starter.
I'd still look closely at the wiring before I spent a couple hundo on a new starter. I understand not wanting to go on a wild goose chase, but with the way the wiring is in these trucks, and with multiple batteries it's still a possibility that there could be another wiring issue.
It could also be a bad starter relay (on the inside of the passenger side fender). Make sure the truck is in park (or neutral with the e-brake set if it's a 5 speed) turn the key to the "Run" Position and let the GPs glow, then jump the two big terminals on that relay with a big screw driver. It may spark a little, but if it cranks, then you just need a $30 relay and not a $200 starter.
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The relay is clicking so I doubt it's that.
There's also 312k miles on everything but the gp system and batteries and water pump.
A weak alternator or dead starter will not surprise me at all.
The battery cable are a little corroded, but I never had this issue before.
I got the new batteries after a4hr drive that ended in the middle(turned the truck off to order and nothing. Wouldn't crank. Batteries wouldn't charge that night after I bought new ones so I just turned them in for a core charge. Now i would have thought it was heat soak on my starter, but the one new battery cranked it right up.
There's also 312k miles on everything but the gp system and batteries and water pump.
A weak alternator or dead starter will not surprise me at all.
The battery cable are a little corroded, but I never had this issue before.
I got the new batteries after a4hr drive that ended in the middle(turned the truck off to order and nothing. Wouldn't crank. Batteries wouldn't charge that night after I bought new ones so I just turned them in for a core charge. Now i would have thought it was heat soak on my starter, but the one new battery cranked it right up.
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,952
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From: Knoxville, TN
Corrosion is a b!tch... my 92 460 got weaker and weaker until engine ground wire had rotted all the way through where it passed through the frame braket...didn't know until i had to have it towed...and was like doh!
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 10,121
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From: Orrville, Ohio
Clean the battery terminals.
An alternator won't have anything to do with it not starting if the batteries are charged.
Just because the relay is clicking doesn't mean it's working, just that it is pulling in the solenoid. If the contacts inside are in bad shape, it could still be bad. A simple 2 minute test rules that out.
It's your money man. If you want to start by replacing the starter, that's not an illogical thing to do, I'm just telling you how to eliminate a lot of other stuff for FREE. The batteries and starter are the two most expensive parts of the starting equation. I'm just hesitant to guess and throw parts at it when you can pretty easily test things out and determine exactly what the issue is.
An alternator won't have anything to do with it not starting if the batteries are charged.
Just because the relay is clicking doesn't mean it's working, just that it is pulling in the solenoid. If the contacts inside are in bad shape, it could still be bad. A simple 2 minute test rules that out.
It's your money man. If you want to start by replacing the starter, that's not an illogical thing to do, I'm just telling you how to eliminate a lot of other stuff for FREE. The batteries and starter are the two most expensive parts of the starting equation. I'm just hesitant to guess and throw parts at it when you can pretty easily test things out and determine exactly what the issue is.
Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 8,476
Likes: 37
From: Madison, WI
And there's no such thing as "nothing changed". TIME changes things. WEATHER changes things. If you have "a little" corrosion, it may have ZERO impact in temperate weather, and when you first see it, but as the corrosion progresses (and corrosion, like rust, never sleeps), and dropping temperatures gang up with it, you can go from smooth starting to click-click with very little _apparent_ change.
And if you're seeing corrosion up at the battery connections, you may have as much, or more, down where the "big wire" feeds the starter. And/or where the battery negatives bolt to the engine block.
Lots of free tests / cleanup procedures to try, before making an armchair decision about a starter. Just an effing lousy time weather-wise to go do it.
And if you're seeing corrosion up at the battery connections, you may have as much, or more, down where the "big wire" feeds the starter. And/or where the battery negatives bolt to the engine block.
Lots of free tests / cleanup procedures to try, before making an armchair decision about a starter. Just an effing lousy time weather-wise to go do it.
Postmaster
Joined: Mar 2004
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Earlier you posted that "one new battery cranked it right up", did you replace both batteries. One bad or faded battery will drag down the good one resulting in premature battery failure I'm not saying it's a problem now but in a years time or so the old battery could take the new one out with it.