Hey, no, all I did was tune it up when it would not crank up like it did, then I noticed the timing mark being off ALOT.

 

Which spark plug wire are you connecting the inductor of your timing light?

 

No. 1 wire which is located on the passengers side front.
Seems like to me if I am off 1 tooth with my distributor, it will not be firing like it should on the No 1 cylinder right? Even if I move the distributor for timing to make up for being off one tooth, it still isnt going to cause the rotor button to line up exactly on No 1 cylinder right? Maybe I need to line up the distributor correctly and go from there.........

 

You're doing what many folks do when they get frustrated- you're thinking yourself into a hole. Pretty soon you will talk yourself into making all kinds of adjustments and rework that will actually negatively effect your engine's performance.

It does not matter if you are a tooth off on your distributor. The only effect that has on your engine is that when timing is set, the distributor cap will be rotated farther to compensate for it. You can have your distributor stabbed 180* out and still run right as long as the cap is 180* out also.

If your truck is running right and has good power, leave it alone. I'm speaking from experience and trying to save you the trouble I've gone through. My truck is running at 24* base timing. I have a super-smooth idle and a launch that will snap your neck. I used Crane's electronic ignition. In my journey to try to correct the problem, I've tried different timing sets, distributor kits, plug gappings, reset distributor at least 1000 times- my truck still runs the same.

So if you like to work on your truck and obsess about how something is not set to "book" or "Ford" standards, thet knock yourself out. But if it's running right, I'd leave it alone.

I don't mean to sound as if I'm chastising you- I hope someone can figure this out for you as the solution will probably be the same for my engine. Just don't miss out on the other things in life just because your timing isn't reading 8*.

Joe

 

Hi,

Just a quick comment about your Vac. advance questions.

The way I understand it, if you have your Vac advance line connected to the ported connector on the carb, you will get the results you mentioned. ie none or very little effect to dissy advance at idle.

On the other hand, if you have the Vac advance line connected to manifold vacuum you will see a fair amount of advance at idle.

The ported vacuum should be near 0 at idle and then increase as soon as the throttle is opened. Kind of the opposite of manifold vacuum.

Good luck,

 

Bingo, Lee. You don't want any advance at idle. And it does sound to me like your distrib. is one tooth off. If it runs fine and does not overheat or pre-ignite(ping), I would say leave it alone. Did you pull the distrib. out at all? There wouldn't be a reason to if you only upgraded to the pertronix. Did it run fine with the timing where it was before you moved it? I didn't get a chance to set mine when I swaped over, and she ran fine for about a month. Also, you said "all new ignition system" - does that include a coil? I am running a accel super stock (some people don't like them, but it works for me), and I can run a .55 gap all day long.

 

I have to disagree with the "one tooth off" theory, it will not affect timing in the way described.

You can install the distributor rotated any way you like, it just means you'll have the vacuum port pointing in a different direction. If you crank the engine by hand so that the valves on number 1 are closed, and the timing mark indicates TDC, you can now insert the distrbutor so that the vacuum port points any direction you like - so long as the points are closed, ideally just starting to open. There's no "one place" where you must install the distributor, it's just most convenient if the port faces forward.

Once the distrbutor is installed the advance at idle is established by changing where the points open. The shaft with lobes and rotor is now fixed, because it's engaged with the toothed drive, so the only way of changing when the points open is by rotating them relative to the lobes - since they're fixed to the distributor this means rotating the whole distributor body. It doesn't matter where the distributor was oriented when installed, you're just interested in rotating the points opening point relative to the rotor arm.

What was the idle advance setting before the Pertronix unit was installed? I can't see how the change from points to Pertronix would have any bearing on the timing observed with a strobe light, vacuum advance disconnected. The spark plug doesn't know what it was that caused the coil to fire, the engine doesn't either. If the spark occurred at 10 BTDC with points and runs fine, it should run fine at 10 BTDC with pertronix. Even if the Pertronix unit was flakiy, and introduced a delay, that wouldn't make any difference to the dynamic timing observed, it would just mean that the distributor body would have to be rotated further to achieve the timing.

I'm confused!

Kevin

 

I didnt check the timing prior to tuning up the truck. I only checked the timing AFTER I tuned it up, so I dont know where it was sitting at prior to the tune up. But I do know that when I set the engine at 0* TDC and removed the distributor cap, the rotor button wasnt pointing exactly at the number 1 plug wire, it was actually in between the number 1 and number 5. Shouldnt the rotor button be pointing exactly at the number one plug wire under the cap??

 

Here's a thought- take a very close look at the condition of your harmonic balancer. If the rubber looks dry rotted there is a very good chance the weight has rotated on you giving a false TDC.

To answer your question- YES, the rotor should be pointing directly to #1 when the engine is sitting at 0* (TDC).

Joe

 

I must admit I was wondering about the timing marks being off. The harmonic balancer is aligned by a square metal peg that sits in two slots - one in the balancer and one on the side of the crank. If the metal peg was missing I think you'd end up with it just spinning on the end of the crank, since it drives all the belts. I don't think it could wear such that it slipped by 20 degrees or so.

I wonder if perhaps the metal bracket bolted to your timing chain cover is either the wrong one, or incorrectly installed? That would tend to agree with your observations regarding the alignment of the rotor - your timing marks would be wrong.

Try this: pull all your plugs, pop a wooden dowl (wooden spoon handle?) in the #1 plug hole. You should now be able to see if TDC agrees with the piston being at its highest point. If it doesn't you could consider putting some tape on the balancer with a mark to indicate where TDC really is.

Good luck!

Kevin

 

OK guys, I will give it a try later this week and give you guys an update on what happens! Thanks for all your replys, this is really a great truck sight! Stay tuned..........

 

I must admit I was wondering about the timing marks being off. The harmonic balancer is aligned by a square metal peg that sits in two slots - one in the balancer and one on the side of the crank. If the metal peg was missing I think you'd end up with it just spinning on the end of the crank,

Kevin, I'm pretty sure he was meaning the *Imbedded Rubber in the harmonic balancer that joins the metal parts* ,that has deteriorated not the metal parts where keyway in the crankshaft and balancer is.

This problem happens way too much and leave people baffled.

The outside part of the balancer actually slightly turns away from the inside part of the H/balancer making the parks end up in a different position than when it was manufactured.

 

Wow, that's a good piece of knowledge to store away. When I refitted my balancer I'm not sure I even noticed that there was a rubber component, I'm assuming that it's a ring concentric with the center hole, joining the keyed hole with the outer "wheel" portion?

Thanks!

Kevin

 

Two things to think about (and I mention these from experience):

You don't have a dial in timing light that isn't set to zero, do you?

And you are not assuming that all V-8s much less all V-8s from a single company put their No. 1 cylinder in the same place, right?

(I don't recall whether it was even mentioned what type of engine that you had.)

 

Well I assumed it is the 360 that he mentions in his gallery album.