302/C4 vs Flathead/T5
Welder User
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,269
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From: northwest MT
I added the T5 to my flatty powered truck and really like it. I retained the stock pedals so keeping part of the original cross member was necessary. I made a heavy duty bolt in cross member for the trans. Using the S10 trans puts the shifter about 6-8 inches rearward of the stock 4 speed location.
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 155
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From: Chino, CA
Ok, so I feel like a dumb @ss. It turns out the transmission crossmember is cut and there was enough of the crossmember left to support the pedal assembly and master. I posted pics on my album. Luckily I found someone here who has an original crossmember available... call me crazy but I am set on installing an original crossmember. Also found someone who installed a 302/C4 without cutting out the flatty motor mounts/arms. Just an update.
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Joined: Jun 2002
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From: Ft Lauderdale USA
Why not just change gears?
If you just want better highway speed the least expensive option is a ring and pinion change in the Dana 44, you may also have to change the carrier if you chose 3.73 gears or lower, like a 3.08. You can also convert it to a Posi why you are at it. Why it is apart you can repalce all your bearing and seals, it will be like new. Only $500 if you only do the ring, pinion and carrier assuming you do the work yourself. Then if you want to go the Flathead route, spend your money on one of those blown Flatheads from H&H! (my next truck!)
Randys Ring and Pinion is who I used, but there are others. I even found a local shop here who could get the ring, pinion and carrier parts.
There seems to be a big misconception that the Dana 44 gears can not be changed. I have a Ford Racing 302 (306 ci, 340hp and 350tq) with my orginal Dana 44 converted to a posi and beat on it occasionally with no issues. Originally I was going to spend 3.5K on a new complete Moser rear, I saved on the budget reusing my Dana 44 and am happy.
Randys Ring and Pinion is who I used, but there are others. I even found a local shop here who could get the ring, pinion and carrier parts.
There seems to be a big misconception that the Dana 44 gears can not be changed. I have a Ford Racing 302 (306 ci, 340hp and 350tq) with my orginal Dana 44 converted to a posi and beat on it occasionally with no issues. Originally I was going to spend 3.5K on a new complete Moser rear, I saved on the budget reusing my Dana 44 and am happy.
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
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From: Chino, CA
Definitely something to consider, I really hadn't even thought of that option. Now I believe my 49 has a Dana 41? I would imagine the same applies and I would be able to locate the ring, pinion and carrier. I was considering a 9" rearend form a 67-72 F100 but had concerns about having to rebuild it, depending on the condition. So your suggestion might be better since either way I would be rebuilding it. It also goes with my goal of keeping it as original as I can.
I've been in contact with H&H already
but might go with Evans Speed Equipment in El Monte. $$$$
I've been in contact with H&H already
but might go with Evans Speed Equipment in El Monte. $$$$
Elder User
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 751
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From: Cuba, AL (NO internet)
Definitely something to consider, I really hadn't even thought of that option. Now I believe my 49 has a Dana 41? I would imagine the same applies and I would be able to locate the ring, pinion and carrier. I was considering a 9" rearend form a 67-72 F100 but had concerns about having to rebuild it, depending on the condition. So your suggestion might be better since either way I would be rebuilding it. It also goes with my goal of keeping it as original as I can.
I've been in contact with H&H already but might go with Evans Speed Equipment in El Monte. $$$$
I've been in contact with H&H already
but might go with Evans Speed Equipment in El Monte. $$$$
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 155
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From: Chino, CA
So did you keep your Dana 41? If not, what did you swap it with? And what motor/tranny are you running?
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Fleet Owner
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From: NM
Is your D41 a 3.73 ratio (standard fitment) or a 4.27 (optional)? If you look at where you are with a 3.73, with reasonably tall tires, you won't gain much by swapping rear end gears. With the C4 you "could" go 3.25 in the rear, and be very comfortable cruising, not real peppy with a flathead tho. More common is 3.50, which is peppier and not bad on the freeway (about 2300 RPM at 55). A flathead will do fine at that RPM. Going to a 3.50 is at least $500 and only gains you maybe 200 RPM.
It's real hard to adjust to the RPM's these older vehicles turned when you are used to modern V8's that are geared way down for fuel economy. No one thought a thing about driving Mustangs, Camaros, etc with 14" tires and 3.50 gears with non-OD trannies back in the '60's. You won't likely get 200K miles out of any engine spinning them that way, that really isn't a concern for hobby trucks.
It's real hard to adjust to the RPM's these older vehicles turned when you are used to modern V8's that are geared way down for fuel economy. No one thought a thing about driving Mustangs, Camaros, etc with 14" tires and 3.50 gears with non-OD trannies back in the '60's. You won't likely get 200K miles out of any engine spinning them that way, that really isn't a concern for hobby trucks.
Elder User
Joined: Aug 2012
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From: Cuba, AL (NO internet)
Here is a thread with a good discussion and chart.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...-rear-end.html
Last edited by Wayne Waldrep; Jan 17, 2014 at 01:35 PM. Reason: added link to thread about our Dana rears
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 155
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From: Chino, CA
Is your D41 a 3.73 ratio (standard fitment) or a 4.27 (optional)? If you look at where you are with a 3.73, with reasonably tall tires, you won't gain much by swapping rear end gears. With the C4 you "could" go 3.25 in the rear, and be very comfortable cruising, not real peppy with a flathead tho. More common is 3.50, which is peppier and not bad on the freeway (about 2300 RPM at 55). A flathead will do fine at that RPM. Going to a 3.50 is at least $500 and only gains you maybe 200 RPM.
It's real hard to adjust to the RPM's these older vehicles turned when you are used to modern V8's that are geared way down for fuel economy. No one thought a thing about driving Mustangs, Camaros, etc with 14" tires and 3.50 gears with non-OD trannies back in the '60's. You won't likely get 200K miles out of any engine spinning them that way, that really isn't a concern for hobby trucks.
It's real hard to adjust to the RPM's these older vehicles turned when you are used to modern V8's that are geared way down for fuel economy. No one thought a thing about driving Mustangs, Camaros, etc with 14" tires and 3.50 gears with non-OD trannies back in the '60's. You won't likely get 200K miles out of any engine spinning them that way, that really isn't a concern for hobby trucks.
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 155
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From: Chino, CA
My truck is all original. Flathead, original 3 sp, original Dana 41 with 3.92 gears. I've swapped nothing yet and may not.
Here is a thread with a good discussion and chart.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...-rear-end.html
Here is a thread with a good discussion and chart.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...-rear-end.html
NICE!!! I got a 3 sp laying around (in parts that is) and originally thought of rebuilding but I have a C4 in great working condition I took out of my 71 F100. Trying to keep my cost down to rebuild the Flathead.
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
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From: Chino, CA
Last edited by ddiaz12; Jan 24, 2014 at 10:12 AM. Reason: Adding pic link
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Central Oregon
"Also found someone who installed a 302/C4 without cutting out the flatty motor mounts/arms. Just an update."
When I got my truck, it had a 289/C4 with the original motor mounts in place as well as an uncut trans crossmember. I ended up taking out the motor mounts as the oil filter on the 289 was really close and I wasn't planning on going back to a flathead.
I kept the crossmember original but welded in a flat plate to the rear for the C4 mount.
When I got my truck, it had a 289/C4 with the original motor mounts in place as well as an uncut trans crossmember. I ended up taking out the motor mounts as the oil filter on the 289 was really close and I wasn't planning on going back to a flathead.
I kept the crossmember original but welded in a flat plate to the rear for the C4 mount.