Fuel injector issue/Question
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Fuel injector issue/Question
Ok guys ive been having trouble with a fuel injector and I have a couple of questions for the guys that have dug into them a bit.
When doing an air leak test i have determined that the air is leaking from the injector oil exhaust ports.
So what i did was take the injector out put it in a vice and apply air directly into the injector. I was able to hear air coming out of the two top exhaust ports. Not crazy amounts but definitely enough to hear. I have already done the spool cleanup with 600 grit sandpaper and the spool valve moves nicely.
I took off the solenoids and manually pushed the spool valve back and forth, when i do this i can get the air to stop completely from coming out of the exhaust ports. Then i put one coil back on and with my finger pushed the spool valve against the coil, and i still had a slight amount of air going out of the exhaust port.
So i guess what i'm asking is this, is a small amount of oil/air supposed to leak out of the exhaust ports on top? Or do i have a problem with the spool valve?
When doing an air leak test i have determined that the air is leaking from the injector oil exhaust ports.
So what i did was take the injector out put it in a vice and apply air directly into the injector. I was able to hear air coming out of the two top exhaust ports. Not crazy amounts but definitely enough to hear. I have already done the spool cleanup with 600 grit sandpaper and the spool valve moves nicely.
I took off the solenoids and manually pushed the spool valve back and forth, when i do this i can get the air to stop completely from coming out of the exhaust ports. Then i put one coil back on and with my finger pushed the spool valve against the coil, and i still had a slight amount of air going out of the exhaust port.
So i guess what i'm asking is this, is a small amount of oil/air supposed to leak out of the exhaust ports on top? Or do i have a problem with the spool valve?
Hotshot
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 15,368
Likes: 121
From: Stuttgart, Ar
Did you get the spool back in the right way? It is directional, but I'm sure you know that. I'm not sure how to answer your question other than to say that the oil is SUPPOSED to leave there when the plunger comes up, but when the injector is in a static state I'm not sure what keeps the spools in closed position.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 19,055
Likes: 235
From: Saratoga Springs,UT
THERE ARE 2 COILS IN EACH INJECTOR
1. OPEN COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
2. CLOSE COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
OHM EACH COIL (+ AND -) IF GOOD SHOULD SEE 4 OHMS OR LESS
AND SHOULD BE OPEN TO EACH OTHER
Also a NOID Light may help see if the FICM and Harness are working but may need to test FICM Output to inject with a DVM
It shouldn't leak threw the oil exhaust port
Could be Injector FICM or Harness problems
You can Also Pull a VAC Test off the inject tip
Might just be Best to Replace it its a Far amount of work to get at
1. OPEN COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
2. CLOSE COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
OHM EACH COIL (+ AND -) IF GOOD SHOULD SEE 4 OHMS OR LESS
AND SHOULD BE OPEN TO EACH OTHER
Also a NOID Light may help see if the FICM and Harness are working but may need to test FICM Output to inject with a DVM
It shouldn't leak threw the oil exhaust port
Could be Injector FICM or Harness problems
You can Also Pull a VAC Test off the inject tip
Might just be Best to Replace it its a Far amount of work to get at
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Freshman User
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THERE ARE 2 COILS IN EACH INJECTOR
1. OPEN COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
2. CLOSE COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
OHM EACH COIL (+ AND -) IF GOOD SHOULD SEE 4 OHMS OR LESS
AND SHOULD BE OPEN TO EACH OTHER
Also a NOID Light may help see if the FICM and Harness are working but may need to test FICM Output to inject with a DVM
It shouldn't leak threw the oil exhaust port
Could be Injector FICM or Harness problems
You can Also Pull a VAC Test off the inject tip
Might just be Best to Replace it its a Far amount of work to get at
1. OPEN COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
2. CLOSE COIL WHAT HAS + AND - WIRES
OHM EACH COIL (+ AND -) IF GOOD SHOULD SEE 4 OHMS OR LESS
AND SHOULD BE OPEN TO EACH OTHER
Also a NOID Light may help see if the FICM and Harness are working but may need to test FICM Output to inject with a DVM
It shouldn't leak threw the oil exhaust port
Could be Injector FICM or Harness problems
You can Also Pull a VAC Test off the inject tip
Might just be Best to Replace it its a Far amount of work to get at
I know the harness is good, and the FICM checked out perfect. It's a bullet proof diesel 58v 6 phase.
I guess I'll have to do a video to show you guys.
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Freshman User
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Ok here we go.....
Ok so I found the issue. Two injectors leak like crazy out of the oil exhaust ports. See my video below. This will cause a hot no start, and also a long cold start in the morning. Bleeding pressure off.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 19,055
Likes: 235
From: Saratoga Springs,UT
Without Being Hooked up to the FICM the Spool Valve is Free to Move
Your Basicaly just blowing it open with Air pressure
That Spool isn't Spring Loaded so it MUST Have Power to Hold its Position
Just because that FICM Shows 58 volts Don't mean its Giving that Particular injector a 58 volt shot to move the spool Valve
This throws a Wrench into the HPO Air Testing Im seeing Now
Your Basicaly just blowing it open with Air pressure
That Spool isn't Spring Loaded so it MUST Have Power to Hold its Position
Just because that FICM Shows 58 volts Don't mean its Giving that Particular injector a 58 volt shot to move the spool Valve
This throws a Wrench into the HPO Air Testing Im seeing Now
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 19,055
Likes: 235
From: Saratoga Springs,UT
I guess in theory when Folks use SHOP AIR 120-150psi to test the HPO System its Not enough top Blow Open Spool Valves
Or Truck would Have to Be in KOEO to Hold that Spool Valve Closed
Or Truck would Have to Be in KOEO to Hold that Spool Valve Closed
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Oh I definitely understand what your saying about the FICM. I'm an electrical engineer by trade so I understand what you saying.
I also agree with you about the HP system testing. This is exactly why I did this. The one thing you can do is this, make sure when you assemble the spool valve the close solenoid is pulling the spool to closed position. The spool will pull to one side or the other based on magnitized field. I confirmed this. I even tested with the coils off with the same results on the bad injectors. The oil blew by the spool to the exhaust ports. It did not on the new injector or the one I replaced 6 months ago.
For me moral of the story is this, always check the injectors for leaks also.
I also agree with you about the HP system testing. This is exactly why I did this. The one thing you can do is this, make sure when you assemble the spool valve the close solenoid is pulling the spool to closed position. The spool will pull to one side or the other based on magnitized field. I confirmed this. I even tested with the coils off with the same results on the bad injectors. The oil blew by the spool to the exhaust ports. It did not on the new injector or the one I replaced 6 months ago.
For me moral of the story is this, always check the injectors for leaks also.
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Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 19,055
Likes: 235
From: Saratoga Springs,UT
SO when Injector was Plugged in the FICM Held the Spool Valve in the closed position with the Key ON
It should Have
What happened with the Key OFF?? Im thinking the Spool is Free to move "Was It"
It should Have
What happened with the Key OFF?? Im thinking the Spool is Free to move "Was It"
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Freshman User
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Yes with KOEO the injector holds the spool valve closed.
Yes I agree the spool valve is able to move freely but it is still has a slight magnetic field keeping it closed. And doesn't change when applying only 120psi air.
Yes I agree the spool valve is able to move freely but it is still has a slight magnetic field keeping it closed. And doesn't change when applying only 120psi air.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,833
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From: Jefferson, Iowa
Magnetism should only be present when there is current in one the coils. Is there a permanent magnet on the close side? We should be able to test with applying 12 vdc to the closed coil for a short period of time.
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Agreed, but every injector I've taken apart, if you put the open or close coil on first the spool will snap to it with slight magnetism. Test it, and you will see what I'm talking about.
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Actually Blade35 if this article I just read is correct, when the open coil is energized oil is pushed into the plunger and not out of the exhaust ports. When the close coil is energized oil is bypassed out of the exhaust ports. At least that's the way I read it??
http://dieselclass.com/Fuels%20Files/HEUI%201-08.pdf
http://dieselclass.com/Fuels%20Files/HEUI%201-08.pdf
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