My 400 build
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 103
From: North Idaho
Slow going, but I did get the connecting rods finished this weekend. I'll have my machinist bead blast or sandblast the beams when the ARP rod bolts arrive.
These photograph a little nicer than they actually are. They are pretty nice though! The carbide burr working great again and I found a flapper wheel is the way to go for the final clean-up on the main portion of the beam. I wasted too many cartridge rolls until I tried a flapper wheel - sooooo much better! You still need cartridge rolls for the small parts around the pin and bolt areas, I even used a Dremel around the bolt areas on the cap and rod.
These photograph a little nicer than they actually are. They are pretty nice though! The carbide burr working great again and I found a flapper wheel is the way to go for the final clean-up on the main portion of the beam. I wasted too many cartridge rolls until I tried a flapper wheel - sooooo much better! You still need cartridge rolls for the small parts around the pin and bolt areas, I even used a Dremel around the bolt areas on the cap and rod.
FTE Legend
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 32,875
Likes: 48
From: Northeast, OK
They look pretty. You are having them balanced - right?
As for blasting, I'm interested in what media he uses. I have aluminum oxide but it is small enough that it really doesn't have much of an impact on parts. My walnut hulls have far more impact, but I'll bet it takes something much heavier.
As for blasting, I'm interested in what media he uses. I have aluminum oxide but it is small enough that it really doesn't have much of an impact on parts. My walnut hulls have far more impact, but I'll bet it takes something much heavier.
Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 103
From: North Idaho
Gary Lewis,
I finally caught up with my machinist and dropped off the rods - he can do actual shot peening so that's what they will get!
From what I understand, the purpose is to provide some compressive stress at the surface to help prevent cracks from forming. If using bead blast, or sand blasting, the more aggressive the better, turn up the air pressure all the way.
And yes, the engine is getting a balance job. While not a "max effort" for horsepower, there isn't going to be a lot left on the table for a 4x4 truck engine IMO.
I finally caught up with my machinist and dropped off the rods - he can do actual shot peening so that's what they will get!
From what I understand, the purpose is to provide some compressive stress at the surface to help prevent cracks from forming. If using bead blast, or sand blasting, the more aggressive the better, turn up the air pressure all the way.
And yes, the engine is getting a balance job. While not a "max effort" for horsepower, there isn't going to be a lot left on the table for a 4x4 truck engine IMO.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 883
Likes: 7
From: New-brunswick,Canada
Nice rods. Mine are stock with stock rod bolts and not balance. They do not balance engine in the shop i went. I hate it. For balance i have to go in annoter province because the one who use to do it just closes.money not threre yet. But the 408 still on engine stand.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 103
From: North Idaho
mustang81,
I am lucky on the shot peening. I think most shops around here can do a balance job. I'm getting the balance job for two reasons 1- I've been grinding casting seams off the crank and rods, and 2- I want this engine to last, even when turning 5,000 RPM.
I've read about dyno tests of unbalanced engines an it didn't seem to make a difference in horsepower. I expect no horsepower gain from the rods or engine balancing. Maybe I'll gain 1 to 2HP from all the junk I ground off the crank.
Horsepower from heads, cam, valves, pistons, intake, carburetor, and headers/exhaust. Maybe a few HP from an upgraded ignition. Things like the rods, ARP rod bolts, balancing, and roller timing chain are for durability and longevity.
I am lucky on the shot peening. I think most shops around here can do a balance job. I'm getting the balance job for two reasons 1- I've been grinding casting seams off the crank and rods, and 2- I want this engine to last, even when turning 5,000 RPM.
I've read about dyno tests of unbalanced engines an it didn't seem to make a difference in horsepower. I expect no horsepower gain from the rods or engine balancing. Maybe I'll gain 1 to 2HP from all the junk I ground off the crank.
Horsepower from heads, cam, valves, pistons, intake, carburetor, and headers/exhaust. Maybe a few HP from an upgraded ignition. Things like the rods, ARP rod bolts, balancing, and roller timing chain are for durability and longevity.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 883
Likes: 7
From: New-brunswick,Canada
SDDL-UP. Is that true i have to re-drill the rod bolts hole in the connecting rods to accept the ARP bolts?
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FTE Legend
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 32,875
Likes: 48
From: Northeast, OK
I know you didn't ask me, but here are ARP's instructions for those rod fasteners, and I don't see any suggestion of re-drilling the holes.
Part Number: 154-6001 & 154-6021
Application: FORD 351-400M V8
Press Fit - Rod Bolt Installation
[1] Please check the part-number(s) for your application
against the part-number(s) listed on the instruction sheet.
[2] Make sure that there is an adequate chamfer around the
top of the connecting rod bolt hole to clear the radius
under the head of the bolt.
[3] Press the bolts into the connecting rods and install the
rod caps.
[4] Use ARP Ultra-Torque Fastener Assembly Lubricant
to lubricate the threads of the bolt and the nut face. Then
install the nuts onto the bolts and tighten them hand tight.
[5] ARP recommends using the STRETCH METHOD when
tightening the bolts. Following the instructions for using a
stretch gauge, Stretch the bolts to . 0060 - . 0065 .
[6] If you do not have a stretch gauge, torque the bolts to
50 ft-lbs using ARP Ultra-Torque Fastener
Assembly Lubricant.
[7] The connecting rods should always be re-sized after new
rod bolts are installed.
[8] A log should be kept on the original non-torqued length of
each bolt. Bolts that have any permanent deformation or
have increased in non-torqued length by more than .001
in. should be replaced.
Application: FORD 351-400M V8
Press Fit - Rod Bolt Installation
[1] Please check the part-number(s) for your application
against the part-number(s) listed on the instruction sheet.
[2] Make sure that there is an adequate chamfer around the
top of the connecting rod bolt hole to clear the radius
under the head of the bolt.
[3] Press the bolts into the connecting rods and install the
rod caps.
[4] Use ARP Ultra-Torque Fastener Assembly Lubricant
to lubricate the threads of the bolt and the nut face. Then
install the nuts onto the bolts and tighten them hand tight.
[5] ARP recommends using the STRETCH METHOD when
tightening the bolts. Following the instructions for using a
stretch gauge, Stretch the bolts to . 0060 - . 0065 .
[6] If you do not have a stretch gauge, torque the bolts to
50 ft-lbs using ARP Ultra-Torque Fastener
Assembly Lubricant.
[7] The connecting rods should always be re-sized after new
rod bolts are installed.
[8] A log should be kept on the original non-torqued length of
each bolt. Bolts that have any permanent deformation or
have increased in non-torqued length by more than .001
in. should be replaced.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 883
Likes: 7
From: New-brunswick,Canada
[7] The connecting rods should always be re-sized after new
rod bolts are installed.
[/INDENT][/QUOTE
Why re-size??? Is that the ARP bolts are slightly bigger and deform the big end off the connecting rods ?
rod bolts are installed.
[/INDENT][/QUOTE
Why re-size??? Is that the ARP bolts are slightly bigger and deform the big end off the connecting rods ?
FTE Legend
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 32,875
Likes: 48
From: Northeast, OK
And, by the way, when I looked that up I picked up the shop manual and discovered I'd opened it to the right page.
Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 103
From: North Idaho
Not a lot of new things to report, but I did get the camshaft last week. I was expecting a billet cam, it's a hydraulic roller from Howards Cams, but not a billet cam so I don't need to run a special distributor gear. It's the same cam Silverstreak used - part number 233215-10 specs. Are 217 / 225 at 0.050" and .571" / .576" lift. Silverstreak was able to pull some really nice numbers with this cam, and my build will be pretty similar.
However... Upon inspection of the cam I noticed there seemed to be some fairly sharp edges on the lobes. The bearing surfaces were all nicely chamfered, but the lobes typically are not. So out comes the needle file...
That's right, some small splinters, shards, or shavings came off two or three of the cam lobes. I don't know for sure that they ever would have come off in a roller engine, but now I know I don't have to worry about it.
I think the same thing could happen to a billet cam, or to other cam manufacturers too. It's just being diligent in the assembly and preparation. Pay attention out there!
However... Upon inspection of the cam I noticed there seemed to be some fairly sharp edges on the lobes. The bearing surfaces were all nicely chamfered, but the lobes typically are not. So out comes the needle file...
That's right, some small splinters, shards, or shavings came off two or three of the cam lobes. I don't know for sure that they ever would have come off in a roller engine, but now I know I don't have to worry about it.
I think the same thing could happen to a billet cam, or to other cam manufacturers too. It's just being diligent in the assembly and preparation. Pay attention out there!