Looking for advice on setting tile
Thread Starter
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Super Moderator
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 40,050
Likes: 1,524
From: Maine, Virginia
Looking for advice on setting tile
OK,
I'm replacing my kitchen counters with a prefab laminate. Before anyone says anything about laminate, I'll be outta here in less than 10 years and the stone counters that I want just won't bring that much more the sales table.
So,
I'm tiling the backspalsh and wall behind the stove from floor to cabinets. I've never tiled before but I'm pretty handy and a quick study. I've built all kinds of crap and do most anything around the house.
It seems to me that the hardest part may be the layout and once the plan is set, it's off to the races.
I'm tiling over drywall from counter backsplash to cabinet bottoms. I'm planning to use mesh backed 1x1 tiles.
Best adhesive? Best grout? Advice? Pitfalls? Things to be aware of?
Thanks for any comments.
I'm replacing my kitchen counters with a prefab laminate. Before anyone says anything about laminate, I'll be outta here in less than 10 years and the stone counters that I want just won't bring that much more the sales table.
So,
I'm tiling the backspalsh and wall behind the stove from floor to cabinets. I've never tiled before but I'm pretty handy and a quick study. I've built all kinds of crap and do most anything around the house.
It seems to me that the hardest part may be the layout and once the plan is set, it's off to the races.
I'm tiling over drywall from counter backsplash to cabinet bottoms. I'm planning to use mesh backed 1x1 tiles.
Best adhesive? Best grout? Advice? Pitfalls? Things to be aware of?
Thanks for any comments.
is a BAAAD MAN
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,738
Likes: 5
From: Winston Salem NC
OK,
I'm replacing my kitchen counters with a prefab laminate. Before anyone says anything about laminate, I'll be outta here in less than 10 years and the stone counters that I want just won't bring that much more the sales table.
So,
I'm tiling the backspalsh and wall behind the stove from floor to cabinets. I've never tiled before but I'm pretty handy and a quick study. I've built all kinds of crap and do most anything around the house.
It seems to me that the hardest part may be the layout and once the plan is set, it's off to the races.
I'm tiling over drywall from counter backsplash to cabinet bottoms. I'm planning to use mesh backed 1x1 tiles.
Best adhesive? Best grout? Advice? Pitfalls? Things to be aware of?
Thanks for any comments.
I'm replacing my kitchen counters with a prefab laminate. Before anyone says anything about laminate, I'll be outta here in less than 10 years and the stone counters that I want just won't bring that much more the sales table.
So,
I'm tiling the backspalsh and wall behind the stove from floor to cabinets. I've never tiled before but I'm pretty handy and a quick study. I've built all kinds of crap and do most anything around the house.
It seems to me that the hardest part may be the layout and once the plan is set, it's off to the races.
I'm tiling over drywall from counter backsplash to cabinet bottoms. I'm planning to use mesh backed 1x1 tiles.
Best adhesive? Best grout? Advice? Pitfalls? Things to be aware of?
Thanks for any comments.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 5,983
Likes: 2
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 40
From: EXTREME southwest CT
Tim,
It doesn't get easier.
It's not a floor or a shower stall.
You don't need to worry about, A) Traffic & B) REAL waterproofing.
A couple of tips.
Use a wood float or roller to level the mosaic. No tiles sticking up or cockeyed makes for clean and easy grouting.
Use a spacer (1/8" or less) at the countertop when you set the tile. Caulk this joint before you grout. (use special grout color matched caulk, or a caulk that matches the counter)
The wall and counter will always move independently.
Caulk will bond to both and is resilient enough to maintain a seal.
Grout will crack, or never bond to the counter, the crack will discolor and leak.
Epoxy grout WILL bond, but an amateur does not want to deal with the cleanup.
It doesn't get easier.
It's not a floor or a shower stall.
You don't need to worry about, A) Traffic & B) REAL waterproofing.
A couple of tips.
Use a wood float or roller to level the mosaic. No tiles sticking up or cockeyed makes for clean and easy grouting.
Use a spacer (1/8" or less) at the countertop when you set the tile. Caulk this joint before you grout. (use special grout color matched caulk, or a caulk that matches the counter)
The wall and counter will always move independently.
Caulk will bond to both and is resilient enough to maintain a seal.
Grout will crack, or never bond to the counter, the crack will discolor and leak.
Epoxy grout WILL bond, but an amateur does not want to deal with the cleanup.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,762
Likes: 536
From: barton city mi
Do not apply directly to the drywall!
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
Thread Starter
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Super Moderator
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 40,050
Likes: 1,524
From: Maine, Virginia
Do not apply directly to the drywall!
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
I've been told my some folks in the business that in a working man's neighborhood like mine, stone counters simply won't pay you back like they will in an upscale neighborhood.
But anyway, thanks to all for the tips and advice. The kitchen is my first project.
Soon, if all goes well with my kitchen, I'm doing a total gut of my main upstairs bathroom. It's currently tiled halfway up and 3/4's in the tub/shower section. Should be a fun project.
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Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,243
Likes: 2
From: Chicago and Mt Carroll IL
Do not apply directly to the drywall!
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
I'd use "Creteboard" as an underlayment. It's 1/4" thick, and screwed to your studs with drywall screws. Don't forget to countersink the screws. You can get a drill/countersink tool at any big box store. Thick set adhesive should be used for vertical surfaces. When you find the style of tile you want, there should be some matching bullnose tile available to cover the rough edges of the creteboard. You'll only need them for exposed edges.
What's wrong with high pressure laminate? I'll wager 90% of countertops out there are just that. I've done many of them myself.
But ya, granite is super nice!!
I've seen concrete even, I thought that was pretty cool.
bullnose mosaic??? mudbase???(thickset, as you referred) a countersink tool??? (Rock-it screws cut thier own countersink)
Tim, buddy....listen to Jim. Perfect job to learn how to set tile. If the mosaic is transparent light colored glass, try to use a white mastic. If you have a home depot nearby, I get great results with Customs' Omni grip.
OmniGrip® Maximum Strength Adhesive | Custom Building Products
Take your time grouting. Don't rinse too quickly or too wet or too many times. It weakens the grout and tends to pull it out of the joints. A smaller margin float works real well on smaller field mosaics and is easy to control. You'll do just fine. Trust your eye. Try to avoid sliver cuts although that's tough with a 1x1 and really won't be noticeable.
Post your questions if they arise.
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Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,243
Likes: 2
From: Chicago and Mt Carroll IL
As far as the grout choices, use UNSANDED. The 1x1 sheet mosaics are typically spaced at about 1/8". If the tile is glass, under no circumstances would you use sanded grout as it would scratch the finish.
Again, Custom building products grouts are user friendly, have good open time and are polymer modified so they do not require any additives. Mapei (carried by Lowes) is a comparably suitable choice.
Again, Custom building products grouts are user friendly, have good open time and are polymer modified so they do not require any additives. Mapei (carried by Lowes) is a comparably suitable choice.
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 40
From: EXTREME southwest CT
Excellent advice Ed! 
Especially the part about trusting your eye.
If it LOOKS right, it is right (even if it is not laid out to the nanometer)
If you need to rip cut some tiles, put the cut up under the cabinets.
If it's really little slivers sometimes it better to just have a wide joint up there. (looks cleaner)
When doing your layout, be aware of the wall plates of any receptacles.
... Maybe even trace them on the wall first.
A) You only need to get under the plate. (Avoid unnecessary cuts)
B) THIS is what you see, not the box itself.
So you can possibly avoid the odd 'sliver on one side' look.
Especially the part about trusting your eye.
If it LOOKS right, it is right (even if it is not laid out to the nanometer)
If you need to rip cut some tiles, put the cut up under the cabinets.
If it's really little slivers sometimes it better to just have a wide joint up there. (looks cleaner)
When doing your layout, be aware of the wall plates of any receptacles.
... Maybe even trace them on the wall first.
A) You only need to get under the plate. (Avoid unnecessary cuts)
B) THIS is what you see, not the box itself.
So you can possibly avoid the odd 'sliver on one side' look.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,473
Likes: 4
From: Lafayette, IN
When doing your layout, be aware of the wall plates of any receptacles.
... Maybe even trace them on the wall first.
A) You only need to get under the plate. (Avoid unnecessary cuts)
B) THIS is what you see, not the box itself.
So you can possibly avoid the odd 'sliver on one side' look.
... Maybe even trace them on the wall first.
A) You only need to get under the plate. (Avoid unnecessary cuts)
B) THIS is what you see, not the box itself.
So you can possibly avoid the odd 'sliver on one side' look.
Keep in mind, too, you may have to loosen the 2 receptacle screws to let the receptacle out a bit or fudge it over to one side. Best is to use an extension ring behind the receptacle, but if need be, you can also let the recep out, leave the screws loose, and use the cover plate to snug up the receptacle (this can also help you to fudge the receptacle to one side or the other to cover a small gap). This works best with the hard cover plates. The flexible, no-break ones just flex and look bad then.
Jason
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 40
From: EXTREME southwest CT
Collars are required by the National Electric Code if the box is recessed by 1/4" or more.
(cut and paste)
National Electrical Code 2011
ARTICLE 314 Outlet, Device, Pull, and Junction Boxes; Conduit Bodies; Fittings; and Handhole Enclosures
II. Installation
314.20 In Wall or Ceiling. In walls or ceilings with a surface of concrete, tile, gypsum, plaster, or other noncombustible material, boxes employing a flush-type cover or faceplate shall be installed so that the front edge of the box, plaster ring, extension ring, or listed extender will not be set back of the finished surface more than 6 mm (1⁄4 in.).
In walls and ceilings constructed of wood or other combustible surface material, boxes, plaster rings, extension rings, or listed extenders shall be flush with the finished surface or project therefrom.
If the box is more than 1/4" from the finished surface, you can use as many spacers as needed to mount the receptacle in such a way that the yoke is held rigidly at the finished surface.
Edit to add;
Not that it applies to you Tim -with your mosaic- but don't forget to get longer (truss head 6-32) screws to hold the devices in place.
A 1/2" thick splash and plastic box make for screws that are easy to strip and won't hold securely in the long term
(cut and paste)
National Electrical Code 2011
ARTICLE 314 Outlet, Device, Pull, and Junction Boxes; Conduit Bodies; Fittings; and Handhole Enclosures
II. Installation
314.20 In Wall or Ceiling. In walls or ceilings with a surface of concrete, tile, gypsum, plaster, or other noncombustible material, boxes employing a flush-type cover or faceplate shall be installed so that the front edge of the box, plaster ring, extension ring, or listed extender will not be set back of the finished surface more than 6 mm (1⁄4 in.).
In walls and ceilings constructed of wood or other combustible surface material, boxes, plaster rings, extension rings, or listed extenders shall be flush with the finished surface or project therefrom.
Edit to add;
Not that it applies to you Tim -with your mosaic- but don't forget to get longer (truss head 6-32) screws to hold the devices in place.
A 1/2" thick splash and plastic box make for screws that are easy to strip and won't hold securely in the long term