With 4 kids and hoping to add more soon, the wife and I are at the limits of what most vehicles will hold comfortably, so a 15 passenger van is going to be bought within a few weeks. She will be driving it and has said looks or year models or engine choices don't matter to her. She wants ease of entry into all seats, room for luggage, comfy seats and cup holders and side windows. Since I will be working on it, I want easy maintenance, easy access(easy for a van) to engine parts and reliability. I know engine options with the van were different than the trucks in some years(like the hp/tq being lower) but did the van get the 3v mod motors and torqueshift tranny or did they keep the 2v and 4r100? How easily accessible are the plugs on the 5.4 vs the 6.8? Any particular year models better than the others or have major problems? Any years have better access panels? I appreciate any info you all can give me

 

Let's see if this is worth 2 cents:

Seating for up to 6 behind the driver row is available in later models of Odyssey, Sienna and the GM triplets - Chevy Venture, Pontiac Montana, Olds Silhouette. I believe the GM triplets are out of production, particularly since Pontiac and Olds no longer exist. I'd give up engine access for a left side door in our Clubwagon. A left size passenger door is a rare option in later model GM full size vans - Express and Savana.

I can't comment on which engines are better. I'll take a Diesel any day even if maintenance access is torturous. I'm sure the consensus is condition is more important than maintainability when buying a used vehicle.

Although non-Sprinter Dodge vans have a 127" wheelbase vs the Econoline's 138", the Dodge seems to need about 10 feet more road width to hang a u-turn. A 6-lane boulevard was often not enough to make a u-turn in one sweep (turning from an inside lane). We had to back into most parking spots because we'd wear out the transmission backing out. The B3500 in top trim level has a noisy cabin - the headliner vibrates against the ceiling and the AC blower is loud. Non-Sprinter Dodge vs Ford, get a Ford. The GM vans come in 135" and 155" wheelbase.

For our purposes there's nothing like commuter van seating vs OE benches. Individually reclining bucket seats with armrests and reading lights shorten road trips. Our B3500 had 10 buckets over four rows and a huge trunk where the 5th row would be. The 5th row stayed at home when we needed cargo space. Check out this puppy - Ford : Other in Ford | eBay Motors - retired from Enterprise's vanpool fleet in SoCal, and this one - Ford : E-Series Van 14 Seat Luxury Captain Chair Van in Ford | eBay Motors . FWIW our Clubwagon has an extra row Chateau buckets in place of the fold-a-bed and a 4th row bench that seats 4. Legroom is tight in the 4th row because of generous legroom for the buckets.

Sixto
93 E150 Chateau 5.8 185K miles

 

E vans never got 3 valve engines; they were and are still 2 valve.

I believe the heads were improved in 2005 to keep them from spitting plugs quite as easily. Service access is not that great, but 100k mile plug change intervals keep maintenance needs pretty low--filters can be reached from the hood, oil changes are no big deal.

I bought my '02 E150 new in March, 2003; it's a mild conversion with 7 passenger spots and factory windows. The E150 as we used to know it (5 lugs) went away in 2007, so everything after that is basically an E250 "lite" with 8 lug wheels.

Our local Ford dealer has a bunch of off-lease 2012 E350's, short body 12 passenger XLT's, for about $20k with very low miles. Great deal IMO, but if you don't need towing capacity, something like a nice minivan might work better for you in terms of fuel mileage and parking, etc.

I have had a full size van (4 of them) since 1986, and am awfully spoiled--we use them for bicycling support, vacations, etc, and they were great for Boy Scouts, family vacations. This will be the last big one for me, I think, unless the new big Transit calls my name. My son is grown, etc.

George

 

Thanks for the replies. Currently we have 4 kids but are hoping to add another 3 or 4, so possibly going to have us plus 8 kids in the van at one time on a daily basis. Our parents like to travel with us, so 4 more from time to time. I am a Ford man all the way and I will never leta mini van sit in my driveway, so it is e series only lol. She will make a lot of short trips with it and both of us prefer my 5.4 to the 7.3 I had, so it will be gasser too. I am open to going as old as 1986 if it is low mileage and in good shape. I would prefer a 5.4 or 6.8, but would rather go with a 5.0 if the mod motors required crazy stuff like the 6.0 trucks cab removal, etc. I prefer the 2v engine over the 3v, so that is a good thing for me that the van never got it. We are looking to keep it under about $6,500, so I am thinking late 90's might be closer to our price range.

 

The 5th row of a 15 seater pretty much uses the rear windows as a head rest. Luggage has to fit under the benches (mind the spare on pre-92 vans) and under the feet of smaller passengers or ride outside. You can slide the 4-abreast 5th row to the 4th row position for 12 passengers and lots of cargo room but you might have to reposition seat brackets. IIRC 5 row vans have tighter seat pitch than 4 row vans.

Econolines got the 5.4 in '97 so that's your starting point unless you'll tolerate a Windsor.

Here's a start:

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/3678162632.html

1994 Ford Club Wagon 15 Passenger Van

2002 ford Econoline E350 15 Passenger van

This one seems lightly used - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/261195062456 - and with a 4.9 it probably was

Sixto
93 E150 Chateau 5.8 185K miles

 

having done a bit of work on various econolines from the era you're looking at, i'll say with confidence that its easier to change plugs and everything on a 5.4 in a van than it is on a 5.4 in an excursion, pickup, or the like. i absolutely LOVE having access to the rear of the engine, cause i've spent enough time fighting to reach the rear of the engine on too many other rigs

 

Regarding plug changing..........

They do NOT go 100K miles before changing! After 50k they're pretty much done and MPG's tend to drop quicker and quicker as they age, seemingly exponentially after the 50K mark. Add in the COP boots can also degrade causing minor misfire issues its just good maintenance practice to plan on this operation at 50K.

As a DIY project on either engine its not too bad but certainly different with the V8 or V10 modular engines, especially those in a van. I can easily reach the back six from inside, the front two from the front. Access is greatly eased by removing the two front seats (an easy operation in itself) but if you don't mind a bit of contortion maneuvering its just not that hard. After your first time you become a member of that club who say its easier than I ever though!

There are quite a few threads in the V8 & V10 forums and I have a list of links to various plug changing specific threads--glad to share that with you if interested. There is a short version too, one I use and have had good luck with so far.

I would add with your stated needs a 15 passenger version might have too many seats. Of course they can be removed and stored if not needed. Just my own $0.02 worth mind ya!

 

From looking at those for sale listings I would say something like that e350 with the v10 is the closest to what we are looking for. Vinyl seats and floors are a must with young kids too. We will be doing occasional towing, so a 250/350 with at least a v8 would be best. With a 15 passenger we could always take a row of seats out when we needed to, so that won't be a problem either. Thanks for the help everyone! I will post pics as soon as we get one

 

Wow, Josh, this thread brings back some fond memories of the epic "V10 vs. PSD" thread in the SD forum a few years ago!

Sounds to me like a 15-passenger E-series is the smart choice in your situation. Don't discount a minivan completely though, my wife's Sienna has more usable room than my Excursion does. It can also tow!

 

Tom, mini van is a no no word in our house lol. And I need a reason to justify to the wife why we need an e350 and a v8 or v10 instead of just that I want one . The last thing I want to do is start another 8,000 page thread like we had in the SD forum, even though it was one heck of a thread. We had looked at a few excursions but we are already at the limit for what they seat and would end up trading it in on something bigger in a year. So a van or school bus are about our best options

 

I understand your needs to carry your large brood, but would suggest that you add up the cost of gasoline for a V8 or V10 van for 10,000-15,000 miles per year or whatever you plan to drive it for. Gas is under $4 per gallon now, but in the next few years it might be likely we'll see $5 or $6 gas prices. "Big cool trucks" might be your hobby, and in 1975 I had an 8 mpg Hemi Roadrunner after a whole bunch of other 10-12 mpg musclecars--so I completely understand "wants".

But it seems to me that unless you are independently wealthy (and your van budget seems to indicate otherwise) that you at least consider operating costs here. How the hell are you even gonna afford as many kids as you propose? Braces, shoes, clothing, school books, and even food... What happens if you fall ill and can't work for a period of time? Unless you are gonna start a family sweatshop business and have the kids working for you

Good luck,
George

 

I would say the van will see probably 3-5k miles a year tops. It will mostly be used for running kids around town or to the park with the occasional long trip for vacations. Our van budget is mainly because I don't see paying good money for a vehicle only to have juice, milk, cheetos, mud, etc all over the inside of it in less than a week, which is why we want vinyl floor and seats . Kids really aren't that expensive either. We don't allow them to have things like cell phones or the latest gadgets, we don't believe in tv(all of our activities involve quality time as a family and are generally free) so we have no cable bill and no need for electronic stuff other than a phone, my wife and kids make their own clothes and what we can't make we buy at consignment stores, etc. We grow a lot of our food and make everything from scratch, so food doesn't cost us much at all. It isn't the lifestyle for everyone, but it works really well for us

 

Have you talked to your insurance company about covering a 15 passenger FORD Club Wagon?

With all the media attention given high capacity passenger van roll over accidents I'd heard premiums got jacked up. Some states are apparently worse than others.

 

It's typically not an issue, at least it wasn't in California, New York and Texas, as long as it's not a school bus or commissioned for kiddie transport.

Speaking of which, maybe Josh should consider a shuttle bus conversion.

Ford : E-Series Van Shuttle bus in Ford | eBay Motors

Ford : E-Series Van Bus in Ford | eBay Motors - ready for those aging parents!

Can you tell from the VIN whether this started life as a passenger van - Ford : E-Series Van BEST PRICE in Ford | eBay Motors ? It has OE passenger accouterments but those aren't OE seats. It would be great to find a 14 seater with center aisle. Then no one's stuck in a middle seat

For the heck of it - Ford : E-Series Van XL Ford Club in Ford | eBay Motors

Sixto
93 E150 Chateau 5.8 185K miles

 

Nothing about a 6.0 requires cab removal.