Injector knock cold/smoke
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 871
Likes: 5
From: Near Shenandoah Valley
Injector knock cold/smoke
'95 F-350 5 speed. Hard start, cycle several times and has inj. knock sound with lots of smoke, cold. Very rough idle. After engine reaches operating temp it quits smoking but feels like slight miss and has loss of power. A/E says inj buzz test "pass", after warm up, contribution test "pass". What should I be looking for? Truck has 174,000+\- and has turbo changed 15,000 miles ago, also changed UVCW outside pigtails and 2 inj. Previous owner did not change oil very often. Fuel filter has only couple hundred miles and I looked for but did not see any thing amiss in fuel bowl. Truck was used for 2 days pushing snow, no hard work but lots of low gear use and idle time.
With engine warm I will try to do compression check. Will post results later. Thanks in advance for any and all suggestions.
With engine warm I will try to do compression check. Will post results later. Thanks in advance for any and all suggestions.
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 11,132
Likes: 3
From: Southern West Virginia
I have the same issues with my truck. Going on for months now. I have tried everything except for maybe the MAP sensor. I'm getting new injectors, e-fuel and T500 HPOP hoping it will solve this problem. I did a compression test last weekend with the engine as warm as I could keep it, and with all 8 glow plugs out, and got about 250 psi on every cylinder.
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 11,132
Likes: 3
From: Southern West Virginia
The best way is supposed to be with the engine warm and all 8 glow plugs removed. It's hard to do it with these engines warm because of the time it takes to remove the VCs and glow plugs, so what I did was let the truck sit outside my shop and run for about 15 minutes, pulled it in the shop, shut it off and plugged in the block heater. I also put a magnetic heater on the bottom of the oil pan to keep the oil in the pan warm. Then I removed all 8 GPs and tested each cylinder.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 871
Likes: 5
From: Near Shenandoah Valley
Red, you will need a special adapter to screw into the glow plug holes. I will try to look it up but a few weeks back someone posted it on here, maybe a thread I had. Anyway, you should be able to google it under compression test 7.3 powerstroke. Anyway, warm engine, remove glow plugs and crank several revolutions for each cyl. That what I plan. Can not get the truck to the shop right now. The snow we had plus the soft ground, it don't float. maybe early morning with the ground froze.
Hotshot
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,377
Likes: 609
From: evansville in
hey Bill, Its good to see you have consistant comp. That is a good sign at least.I hope the inj get back soon!
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Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 11,132
Likes: 3
From: Southern West Virginia
Yeah, that was a relief. I was worried about that. I'm hoping my psi was lower than what I've read others being, because I did it with the engine warm and all 8 GPs out.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 871
Likes: 5
From: Near Shenandoah Valley
OK. have not checked compression yet but some updates.
Yesterday eve. with truck cold and since it's torn down awaiting comp. check I started it and unplugged each inj. while running, no change on #3 only.
Today, with laptop fully charged and truck, laptop shows #3 and #8 High low circuit out. This truck previously passed both inj. buzz and contribution test. Buzz test had no auldible change on any cyl.s.
Should have the setup tomorrow for compression test but I really fail to see how compression will affect a non-firing inj.
I was asked if there has been been a fuel press. problem, not since I have shimmed the reg. and changed out #3 inj (1) one year ago, however, I cannot say the driver switched tanks when needed in the last snow storm.
There are no cemeteries near by to my knowledge.
Yesterday eve. with truck cold and since it's torn down awaiting comp. check I started it and unplugged each inj. while running, no change on #3 only.
Today, with laptop fully charged and truck, laptop shows #3 and #8 High low circuit out. This truck previously passed both inj. buzz and contribution test. Buzz test had no auldible change on any cyl.s.
Should have the setup tomorrow for compression test but I really fail to see how compression will affect a non-firing inj.
I was asked if there has been been a fuel press. problem, not since I have shimmed the reg. and changed out #3 inj (1) one year ago, however, I cannot say the driver switched tanks when needed in the last snow storm.
There are no cemeteries near by to my knowledge.
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,647
Likes: 1
From: Exton, PA
hey guys (Bill and 540)
any movement on this topic lately? did you get your injectors back in Bill?
any answers present themselves 540?
I have a what I suspect to be a similar problem. sounds almost like a bend rod in my case, but the sound goes away at RPMS over 1000, whereas I understand that a bend rod would continue to sound the same (or worse) at higher RPM. I have no injector fault codes and will just be getting around to the buzz test and cylinder contribution tests this week.
I kind of suspect a bad injector, though but it seems like from the experience here, it might not be bad enough to show up on one of the self-diagnostic tests.
I guess a compression test would be next in line, but it'll be a while before I can pull that off...
just curious if you guys have come up with any answers.
And Bill: in other news - I finally located (and picked up immediately) a set of ECLB ZF 4x4 96/97 driveshafts for my E4OD to ZF5 swap! now I just need to find time to do it!
any movement on this topic lately? did you get your injectors back in Bill?
any answers present themselves 540?
I have a what I suspect to be a similar problem. sounds almost like a bend rod in my case, but the sound goes away at RPMS over 1000, whereas I understand that a bend rod would continue to sound the same (or worse) at higher RPM. I have no injector fault codes and will just be getting around to the buzz test and cylinder contribution tests this week.
I kind of suspect a bad injector, though but it seems like from the experience here, it might not be bad enough to show up on one of the self-diagnostic tests.
I guess a compression test would be next in line, but it'll be a while before I can pull that off...
just curious if you guys have come up with any answers.
And Bill: in other news - I finally located (and picked up immediately) a set of ECLB ZF 4x4 96/97 driveshafts for my E4OD to ZF5 swap! now I just need to find time to do it!
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 871
Likes: 5
From: Near Shenandoah Valley
Old wood, I put off working on it because my 6.9 broke the adapter plate the starter bolts to, I decided to change the trans to ZF5 and boy has that been a trial! I did perform the the comp. test cold first just to see and ran 290-340 all cyl. I am going to change out the IDM just to see how that affects the A/E test results. I did rig up a noid light and all the inj. Seem to fire with same intensity so, after that test I plugged up all inj. And they were firing???? That is why I am going to change out the IDM. But that will be after the trans. You ever done a ZF5 in an 6.9?
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,647
Likes: 1
From: Exton, PA
can't say I have. actually - I've never done a ZF5 into anything - though I hope to real soon.
50 psi max compression deviation doesn't sound bad, but I guess that spread might increase with higher engine temps (thinner oil)?
and you're saying that after your re-plugged all the injectors the issue went away? has it stayed fixed? I have a spare IDM i'm thinking of trying as well some day, but I want to eliminate as many other possible problems first as I hear that bad injector wiring can kill an IDM.
also - I did my buzz test yesterday and all injectors sounded the same to me and I got the P1111 pass code when it was complete. ...on to the cylinder contribution test, then compression test I guess.
oh - and another question for you, Bill - what are the glow plug threads? are they just 1/4" pipe thread, or something metric?
50 psi max compression deviation doesn't sound bad, but I guess that spread might increase with higher engine temps (thinner oil)?
and you're saying that after your re-plugged all the injectors the issue went away? has it stayed fixed? I have a spare IDM i'm thinking of trying as well some day, but I want to eliminate as many other possible problems first as I hear that bad injector wiring can kill an IDM.
also - I did my buzz test yesterday and all injectors sounded the same to me and I got the P1111 pass code when it was complete. ...on to the cylinder contribution test, then compression test I guess.
oh - and another question for you, Bill - what are the glow plug threads? are they just 1/4" pipe thread, or something metric?
Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 871
Likes: 5
From: Near Shenandoah Valley
Oldwood, the inj. miss went away but like I said, I pulled off the truck to work on the utility bed. I want to pull a buzz test and after warming up a contribution test. The A/E said pass on both these tests with a dead inj. Leading me to think bad IDM or maybe PCM? And in case Bill does get back to you soon. the glow plug threads are 10mm X 1.0 That was the adapter/fitting I bought. 10mmX1.0 with an 1/8" pipe thread. I screwed a 18" grease gun hose on it and an adapter for 1/4" for the air chuck fitting.
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