Hi All,

Recently had Ex aligned and numbers were all perfect across the board. Put 1.5" leveling spacers under my front coils and took it back in. Just FYI, I used a grinder on the steering knuckles and on outside of the upper ball joint mount area like I have seen others do.... I didn't want any problems with alignment shop.

I know the guy who does the alignments, and while he is not a "lifted truck" expert, he has over 15 years alignment experience, and does a great job.

While aligning it, he ran up against the "metal to metal" problem in the places I had already ground down a bit (about 1/8th inch on all surfaces).
He worked at the total front end for over 2 hours (including installing the aftermarket caster/camber bushings that I brought with me). When it was all said and done, these are the numbers:

Caster LF: 3.6 deg. Caster RF: 5.2 deg
Camber LF: 0.2 deg Camber RF: 1.7 deg
Toe: LF: .07 deg Toe RF: 0.0 deg (Total Toe: .14 deg)

He said that was the best he could get it unless I ground out some more metal in those areas I mentioned. Said to bring it back to him when I do.
I REALLY don't want to pull the front end apart again to grind metal

So, are those numbers "liveable", or should I bite the bullet and grind more so he can set the numbers better?

ANY thoughts from those who have been here and done this, or who know way more than I do about alignment numbers and how they affect tire wear would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you all.

James

PS: I posted this question in the Super Duty section also because I think there are more 2WD owners there than here.

 

Specs for your truck are

Caster 4.0 with +/- 2 degrees total split 0 to 1 degree
Camber .62 with +/- 1 degree total split 0 to 1 degree
Toe 0 - total toe .03 +/- .25 degrees

So
Caster minimum 2 max 6 - no more than 1 degree difference side to side
Camber minimum -.38 max 1.62 no more than 1 degree difference side to side
Toe minimum 0 max +.25

So if I am reading your numbers right

Caster off side to side but within spec on each side officially but way off recommended on both sides and on outside edge of tolerances.

Camber out of the maximum range on right and also off side to side.

Toe within spec but still outside range of what I would want side to side.

IMHO - don't be driving it until you get this fixed unless you want to trash your tires.

It's got to be all all over the road with handling with those numbers?
I don't have a 2wd but I did happen to have the spec for both laying on my desk today because I'm having my 4wd aligned tomorrow.

 

Let us know what they did. Basically the only thing they can do it the toe in which I do by getting back and sighting with the rear wheels or using a string (been doing it since the sixties). The camber can be set but only by replacing the eccentric bushing at the top of the top ball joint and the caster is semi-permanently fixed by the position of the axle. So they will probably say; "it just needed a toe in adjustment". When I put my new ball joints in it went right into alignment by itself and after a quick front to rear sighting it was all good, and still is. It tracks like a freight train and the tires wear perfectly.

 

Thank you both for your replies!

sammie, you have told me what I think I knew in my heart already.
I appreciate your insight on this one... My alignment guy said if I could find a way to even use a smaller spacer (even a 1" instead of 1.5") that it would make a big difference because of the way the TTB setup works.

I'm torn between removing more material from the knuckles and beams, or taking out the spacers and shaving them down to 1" (they are Delrin and I have the means to make them shorter). Which would you do? And do YOU think dropping the front end 1/2" would make a difference in the numbers he can get?

EXv10, Thank you for the tip on setting the toe. Unfortunately, I have chosen to go down a path that is making my camber and caster horrible.

James

 

We both have 4wd so we can't be a lot of help, not me anyway. Alignment is not rocket science like many believe, as long as it tracks well, steers well, and wears the tires well there is nothing more you need. Most tracking and pulling problems are due to worn parts.

 

Like Brent mentioned we both have 4wd which are different animals, but I know that regardless of the vehicle when you change the height front compared to rear you are going to affect that caster setting. No expert but if it were me I would not remove anymore structure from components if I didn't have too. Removing spacers seems like the next step, if it doesn't help all you are out is the time to do so and then you can move onto "what's next".

IIRC your caster and camber are both really high numbers on the right side - why is that? Did you read the article and understand what both those are? Just asking you these questions to point you toward understanding what the settings are and applying that understanding to what on the right side of your truck is causing that difference. I see the major issue as the difference side to side not the overall numbers. If they were within the spec range but close to equal side to side I think you would be ok, like Brent said it comes down to does it drive well and do the tires wear right? So bottom line take a hard look and figure out why that right side is so far off.

 

Thanks again to both of you! You have been such great help on this matter.

I know why the right side is more wrong than the left, it is because that is the side that needed more material removed. He ran up against metal to metal sooner on that side.

Sigh... I am now going to go out and reduce the spacers down to just less than 1 inch. Hopefully that will give enough room to "play" with numbers. I agree with you in that I don't want to take off more metal.

By the way, in case anyone is wondering about steering components and such, I just replaced all balljoints, tie rod ends, etc about 4 months ago. I checked them again for good measure and they are all still tight. This problem is all in the coil and spacer setup.

Thank you both again so much!

James

 

Can you get drop brackets for the pivot end of the TTB? That's what we used to do when we did OBS lifts to TTB 4X4's to get the camber correct.

 

Just to update and put this thread to a close:

I looked at how competely jacked up the angle of the upper ball joint stem was (it was at it's farthest point of movement to one side) and thought about how stressed it would be running it like that under a 7000+ lb Ex. I sent pics of the joints and whole setup to a friend of mine back in MO who is REALLY into the pre-runner / desert racing / rock crawling thing. He's good enough that he has sponsors... anyway...

He replied and told me to "take that crap off now". He said if I had my heart set on going taller, then I needed to just drop the money and get a real kit (with the drop brackets like "fsmt" mentioned and all the proper hardware to keep everything in line like they were designed) and call it a day. He told me to stop trying to be cheap

So, I went out and dropped the coils, took the spacers out, cleaned everything up and repainted while I had it all apart. Put it all back together like it was born and took it to a local dealer where an old guy who has been doing alignments for 42 years (goodness) put it all back to perfection. Of course now it drives like an absolute dream.... but I STILL want 2 more inches of height!

This little learning experiment is over now. I won't revisit lifting my Ex until I can fork out the dough for a Fabtech or ProComp kit.

Thank you all for your help!

James