I'd love nothing more than to stay stock cause it does what I need it to do, but I don't like the idea of soot being dumped down the intake. Seems like that's just asking for a check engine light or some other costly maint. task that needs to be adressed as a result. I think the biggest problem with these trucks is the fact that these repairs are so stinking labor intensive. Most all of these repairs are so difficult to get to, and so many require that you remove the cab. If the repairs weren't so labor intensive they wouldn't be so costly and we wouldn't be looking at things like delete kits. Ergo, is bulletproofing worth the money or better yet, will bulletproofing save you money in the long run provided you stay on track with maint.

I wonder if you have to go thru all the extra steps like cab removal etc. to work on the other makes.

 

First of this is so far a very good thread. Some good opinions aswell. I have to add though I havebeen working on 6.0 scine 2003 when they came out. There is NO reason to pull the cab on any F-series 6.0 to work on the engine. Its more of a prefferance than anything else.I can do heads in cab or out and can pull the engine without removing cab or turbo if need be.Its not that hard.No where in the factory shop manuel does it say remove cab for engine repair or removal(6.0 engine).

 

Cost and value seem to be key issues for you. With that in mind, Vloney answered your questions regarding the components you specifically asked about (EGR systems, head gaskets, studs, intakes, exhausts, tuners). Most people have head gasket issues (actually the key issue is the head bolts) because they let other problems go unrepaired until those problems eventually impacted the head gaskets sealing ability. Similarly, most EGR cooler failures happened because the owner let other things go unrepaired until the EGR cooler failed. If you want cost effectiveness to be the key objective, then just keep up with the maintenance and install gauges so you can catch problems early. As an exception, I will say that due to the possibility of having casting sand in the system (a factor outside the owners control), a coolant filter mod is cheap, easy, and wise to do.

As I said, the EGR system is not the problem you are making it out to be, Recycling combustion gas will work for the life of the engine (300k+ miles), as long as you keep everything functioning well. Again - my statement is based on you asking about cost effectiveness.

Keep your coolant properly flushed. Do it every 50k miles if you use the Gold coolant and use distilled water in the flushing process. You can go longer w/ ELC coolant, but I hesitate to say it is cost effective to switch.

Be diligent in watching all of your fluid levels ........ so that if you have a leak anywhere you can get it fixed promptly. You don't want to end up driving it so far that you run it so low that you cause more problems (this is true for coolant, oil, tranny fuid, power steering fluid, etc).

Use OEM filters and at a minimum change them out at the frequencies in the manual.

Routinely drain the water from the HFCM.

As to gauges (I prefer electronic ones so you know what the PCM is seeing):
Watch the ECT and keep normal operating temps where they should be (190 degrees +/- a few is the typical coolant temp).
Watch the EOT so you can catch a plugging oil cooler oil early (but if you maintain the coolant, you shouldn't have an issue)
Watch fuel pressure because who knows when a batch of bad fuel can plug the filters.
Watch your system voltage so you can catch a battery or alternator that is failing.
Periodically check key sensors - for example you should compare the Baro, MAP, and EBP w/ KOEO to make sure they read the same (within 0.5 psi anyway).
Periodically check ECT, EOT, and IAT's at KOEO (after completely cooled) to make sure they are all reading close to each other.
Watch you boost gauge (or MAP readings) so you don't operate the vehicle w/ a sticking turbo that will eventually lead to an overboost.

Another key thing - don't be hard on you engine until it has fully warmed up.

All that said, I still recommend doing the "applicable" reliability mods that I mentioned in my previous post. Please note that some of them are only for certain model years. The only ones that probably aren't cost effective to do as a proactive step are the high pressure oil items (STC, dummy plugs, and standipes). You can probably wait until you see problems developing (hard start when engine warms), and replace them at that point. That being said, you might pay more if you have a failure on a trip and have to have it done by whoever is closest. Only you can decide if it is worgwhile to do these items ahead of time!

Find a good local mechanic (dealership or indy shop) and get some estimates for these repair jobs ahead of time. They do not need to be the $3k-$5k repairs that many experience.

Lastly - regarding tuners ................. as stated earlier, they simply are not reliability mods. In most cases they are the opposite. Ford did have some issues with some of their early software, but the latest flashes are pretty good (with the exception of some folks losing fuel economy with the re-flashes). If you do end up deleting your EGR system, then personally I would recomend a tuner at that point so the strategy can properly account for the missing components. As to the impact of a tuner on head gaskets and stock head bolts, etc. - some say you can do it safely and some have had problems. Probably depends on how you drive and your maintenance practices - but you are definitely increasing your risk factor.

(btw - good post ul37).

 

Bismic,

Thank you.Just get tried of people saying you have to pull cab to work on theese trucks.

But it pales in comparison to the posts you make.Very detailed, I like that, but I get frustrated typing (2 finger typer)

Joe

 

Great post as always! A couple thoughts as to why I think it is a bad design. The way the oil cooler sits in the engine valley, and the out port and in port are both on top only ends in one way. Clogged at some point. To the point that even ford came out with the 15 degree deltas and a check engine light to address the issue. But if you hadn't taken your truck in for the new flash you could be driving around in a stock truck and never know you are melting the egr cooler and flash boiling until it is too late. Including hydrolocking the motor , To me that is a poor design. Either include guages for it or make it a maintenance item to be changed after so many miles.
With that said the best advice I would give to someone who just bought a 6.0 is like you stated do all the maintenance items like fluids ,filters ,add coolant filter,

Then buy a scanguage 2 set it up to read ect/eot ficm power, voltage. Then drive it. If something fails then replace it with a " bullet proof" item. I would never recommend anyone buy a used truck and then dump thousands doing work that may be unecessary.Then only to have something not addressed fail and then be out even more money. I think this is what vloney was getting at. Don't fix something that ain't broke. But do I think there are some poor designs issues with the 6.0 yes I do, but I also realize that R&D continues on after production starts otherwise the truck would cost so much no one would be able to afford it.

 

You guys are awesome. I know it takes a lot of time to respond to stuff like this. I have several friends who are associates in my industry (Construction) and all run stock trucks and stay on top off their maint as do I. Although I can't speak for the fine details about their maint., which are abviously key, we have all had problems. I can tell that I have run NOTHING but ford filters and fluids, have run scheaffers fuel additive in my fuel, changed my oil EVERY 5000 miles, run a coolant filter, and had the dealer do my coolant flushes (we have one of the best ford diesel mechanics in the state here at our local dealership), I've still had headgaskets, and injecors fail. I did have the ARP head studs put in when the head gaskets were done at about 50,000 miles. I don't pull anything real heavy like some guys (about 4 to 5000 lbs) but I do work it cause I do have a heavy foot. I do not dog it when it's not warm! so I feel like I have stuck to the bible of care and maint with this truck. All of us that I know with this truck have struggled with having any confidence in the reliablity of this engine since it seems like no amount of maint seems to guarantee a trouble free operational life or should I say a low trouble life. We are all talking about eliminateing some of the problem areas, like the EGR valve since it seems to contribute to many of the big money problems that kill us. Therefore that's why I wanted to know what the mechanics think, not the people that sell these mods or the people that have bought them since they aren't always truely objective. Of course there are those that might say that mechanics can't be objective either since they benefit from all the work these systems create for them, but being in a business of remodeling and repairs myself I don't want to tell any of my customers anything that would not protect their investment. So I think most mechanics would follow the same belief.

vloney, I have been following a thread like that one you pointed out and thanks for pointing that one out.

ul37, thanks for pointing out the methods you guys can use that points out my misinformation on working practices.

bismic, well he(( what can I say, dang can you type! Thanks for taking your time to chime in with such great info and details.

I hope that others continue to chime in!

gotta go pick up my wife, her chrysler mini van won't start.

 

I have to agree with you Mark.

I normaly don't think about the upgraded Ford parts when someone ask about bullet proofing.

Those you mentioned I think are a very good idea to do as a prevenative measure. Blue spring mod, FICM, STC, standpipe, and dummy plugs (i'm on the side of don't mess with the HPO stuff unless you are already in there ie.. changing injectors, or you are having a problem).

I don't know about replacing the CAC boots though. Maybe that one is just me, but I have never had a problem with them, and haven't really read just a whole lot of theards of people having the problems. On this one I think I wouldn't mess with them unless your having a problem. If they are pretty oil soaked though I would say get a set from riffraff. The ones on my 07 a pretty oil soaked, but not having really any problems staying on. I did go ahead and order a new set from Clay the other day because of the oil soaked. So I could see a point in just changing them from the start. Just don't know i'm on the fense on that one

ICP update? Didn't realize there was an update. I know the early ones had a problem with it being under the turbo, but didn't realize there was an update to fix that problem.

 

Let me back up guys. I do have one guy I deal with who owns a power tool supply business and his son owned a 6.0. He did put a lot of highway miles on his and I think he traded when he had just shy of 300,000 miles cause it was starting to need major stuff like tranny etc. He ran the hell out of that truck and didn't have many problems if any motor related. So, I have to retract my previous statement on everybody I know having trouble. Seems that highway mostly milage is what these motors prefer based on what I've been reading and people I've talked to.

OK, let's approach it this way, if I was needing repairs on some of these problematic items would there any that you would not replace with OEM parts and go with a different part that would be more relaible, be it aftermarket or a different year OEM part. I think most would agree on the ARP's being a worthwhile investment, but how about other stuff other than what bismic already covered.

Want to post an oil question for you techs but I'm debating opening that can of worms cause those post just seem to get crazy!

Thanks guys

 

If your egr cooler was to fail, or you have to remove the intake for anything I would install the BPD egr cooler. There oil cooler, although I have not used it, would be another thing to consider if the intake was off. They are spendy but have great reviews. Other than that and the more obvious stuff like arp's, dummy plugs/standpipes, blue spring, FICM, and coolant filter. That would be my recommendations. I can't think of anything else right now, but I'm sure I missed some things.

 

FICM, is there an improved Ford FICM or are we talking about the aftermarket FICM running the higher voltages, or is it something else all together?

 

How about the powermax turbo, that's actually cheaper than the oem.

 

Having Ed at FICMrepair.com fix your FICM is usually what we mean by doing the FICM. There are some FICM tunes as well.

 

What I meant by FICM is having ED fix it. On his site he dosent recommend going higher voltage.

As at as a powermax I don't know that would call that a bullet proofing mod. It's also another mod that I don't personally have any experience with. I do plan to put one on my 06 eventually.

 

I've been reading a lot of these posts and I have a question. I am an Asst. Fire Chief at a Volunteer fire dept. In '07 we purchased 2 new vehicles. A ambulance on an F450 chassis, and an F350 DRW chassis we put a flatbed on and a water skid for grass fire control. The 450 has approx. 28k mi. and the 350 has 6k. Both of these vehicles have been in the shop (dealers) for the turbo sooting problem. When we pick them up they tell us not to idle them (for the ambulance) and drive it MORE for the grass rig. When ever these vehicles are out they get driven hard!! But while we are waiting to load a patient, the ambulance must idle or the batteries will die. Too much stuff to run in an ambulance while it's not running. Grass rig idles while extinguishing a fire and races to another hot spot and idles while extinguishing etc… Is there anything to cure this problem besides NOT idling these vehicles. Not good when you pick up a patient, and can only go 30 MPH because the turbo decided to "hang". Keep in mind these are Government vehicles so modding is a minimum.
Thanks in advance, Scott

 

One more thing, both vehicles have "fast idle" when e brake is engaged