ok, so i just finished up converting my 86 f-150 300 i6 to duraspark. i got the non-feedback carb on it. besides a minor idle problem, the motor seems to run nice. hot or cold driing slow, driving fast ect. good throttle responce. and sometimes it even pops right off just by touching the key. well my timing light broke so i just timed it by ear. sounded great, great idle. shut it off and went to restart it and it sounded like the starter was grinding and not catching the fly wheel (you know the sound when the starter aint catching). i have had cars out off time before that ran good but would start hard, really struggling to turn over, but this sounds like the engine is kicking back. i replaced the starter cleaned up all the connections but 1. the one from the solinoid to the starter( couldnt get it loose and didnt want to break it). is it possible the solinoid is bad and the starter is not getting enough juice to kick the gear all the way out ? or can it be so out of time its kicking back, even though it runs good once its started? or could it be a coincidence that the fly wheel would loose some teeth just after doing the conversion? sorry for the long post but i wanted to give as much info as possible. thanks.

 

Could also just be coincidence that the starter is acting up. Does the starter motor just wind up [Zzzzzzz]?

Regarding setting the timing, since you don't have a working timing light, most would recommend the use of a vacuum gauge. If timing is advanced too far, an engine will struggle to turn over. On the 300/4.9L, you turn the distributor clockwise to retard, so loosen the hold-down bolt and slightly rotate the distributor to the right, tighten the bolt and try to start.

 

That would be a good, quick check. Mark your distributor real well so you know exactly where you start. back off the timing a little and see if that's you're problem. If not, you know where to put it back and none of it cost you anything.

I'm still a little confused as to what your are discribing as the problem to be honest. You mention timing which leads me to believe the engine is struggling to turn over. Then you mention connections and the starter not kicking back out as well as mention of teeth on the flywheel.

So I'm not sure if you are having an issue with the engine turning over and starting or a problem with the starter actually engaging and disengaging. Different problems with different symptoms.

 

the first time i tryed to start it after the conversion, it popped right off. barley turned over. ater adjusting the timing and idle speed, i shut it off to see how it would start after the adjustments. the starte made a loud grinding noise and the engine turned a little but i stopped turning the key because of the noise. tryed it again and it made the same noise but turned the engine enough to start it.the only reason i thought it had something to do with timing is because i just put a new distributer in and never had a problem with the starter before. so i checked all my connections, samething. i replaced the starter, samething. i got the timing and the idle set and the trucks runs very good but still have the starter problem. i thought i had it figured out a couple times today. bad body ground , loose ground to the block. even retightened the starter. still grinds. and it grinds every time i try and start it. i cant believe that all the teeth would fall off the flywheel at the exact time i replaced the distributer. and if it was the stater not being lined up right, it should have worked fine with the old starter or changed when i put the new one in. the guy at the auto parts store said to shim the starter, but how did the old one get out of alingment when i didnt touch it, i just replace the distributer and harnesss? the only thing i can think of is the solinoid. maybe it is letting some juice threw but not enough to fully engage and the gear is not coming all the way out to meet the flywheel and just grinding on the side of it catching every once in a while.(and by catching i mean turning the engine enough to start. it doesnt sound like other times ive had a bad starter or bad spot on a fly wheel where you can hear the starter just free spinning, it grinds) today it didnt catch the first 2 times i tryed it and by the 3rd time the battery was dead. thought it was strange to drain a good battery with that little amount of cranking. i know it strange and its got me frustrated but i hope this clears up my question/symptoms a little. i might take a video of me trying to start it so you guys can see what i see and hear what i hear. thanks again.

 

Thanks for the explanation...sounds to me like this is a starter problem then.
It just may be a coincidence that it started at the same time.
It may be a pain in the butt but I would pull that starter out and have a look at the teeth on it as well as the flywheel. If it's grinding, continuing to keep trying is not doing those teeth any good.
I would think that if you're getting enough power to the starter to turn it, you should be getting enough to pull the drive in. The solenoid on the starter can get weak over time and not pull it in all the way. Normally when this happens, it just winds up. But it may be pulling it in to catch just a little and grind.
I personally wouldn't know or understand why you would shim it. That would only move the starter further from the fly wheel. On the Chevy's sometimes they have to be shimmed but that's because they bolt in from the bottom and that is to ensure radial alignment. You cannot shim for radial alignment on a ford....only axial.

 

thanks 82. i replaced the starter but i will be pulling it again in the morning to look at the fly wheel. i think i will test and see if im getting a full 12v at the starter . one of the reasons i thought it might be the solinoid was because besides disconnecting the battery when i was doing the duraspark conversion, the solinoid was the only thing i touched in the starting system. i tryed to clean up all the connections between the battery and solinoid. the only wire i couldnt get off was the one going to the starter. the nut would turn, but the stud tured with it, so i didnt want to break it and just left that one alone.

 

Ah...well that could be too. Maybe bad connection through the solenoid. Testing voltage may not tell you anything though. You may have 12V on the other side but through a very poor connection.
When you get into trouble is when you have a "high resistance" connection or the solenoid is not making full contact intermally. So you may not see the voltage drop unless it's under load.
What I would do is disconnect the batter going to the solenoid and jumper it to get it to pull in (close) and check resistance across the 2 main posts. You should get a pretty low reading...a couple ohms I would guess...if that.
You're talking about the nut and stud on the starer solenoid on the fender correct?

 

That is correct.

 

Try to start my 86 f150 300 i6 - YouTube does anybody thing i could be 180 degrees out? my starter dont gring if i pull the coil wire.

 

I have trouble with that as you state "once it gets started it runs great".

I can't imagine it would run great if it's timed 180 out...if run at all. Basically that means your plugs going to fire everytime your piston is on its exhaust/intake stroke and not it's compression/power stroke.

 

But with that said...if you take power off the coil and the symptom goes away...then to me that eliminates the starter.

I can see your carb backfiring in the video so I definately think you have a timing issue. Just don't think it's 180 out if it runs good once started.

 

My 86 f150 running - YouTube video of it running. seems to run good to me.

 

i just wanted to add that the starter doesnt grind when i first turn the key. the engine starts to turn and when it back fires like you seen in the video, its like the engine stops or kicks back and thats when i get that loud grinding noise.

 

I could be wrong but it sounds to me like your timing is significantly over advanced.

 

now if im correct, turnig the distributer clockwise would retard it? problem is im almost turned all the way clockwise and the vac advance is hitting. now do i have to pull the distributer and move it back counter clockwise and reinstall, or can i cheat by moving all the plug wires ahead 1 or 2 places on the cap and then rotate the distributer back counter clockwise until the roter lines up with the number one plug wire again?