Has anyone had any experience, good or bad, with these heads? I am getting ready to build a 428 for my 72 F-250 4x4 and am considering using aluminum heads. I will use it for general use and some towing. I am not building a hot rod for street racing. I do want it to move out in a 'sporting' fashion. Any suggestions????

 

I think most people would agree that their "off-the-shelf" breathing capability is a major leap over the standard cast-iron jobs, but with the larger valves and better machining, that shouldn't come as any surprise. I had a little fun with pulled out heli-coils on rocker-arm studs and a couple of intake manifold bolts. I suspect that my torque wrench might be partially to blame, but honestly expected a little more "beef" than what was there. You've GOT to use studs for the rocker shafts, and use the ARP specs for torque, not Edelbrocks! I also blew a head-gasket the first round, in spite of using the recommended Fel-Pro 1020 (not cheap) head gaskets when I torqued them to 100 and 110 ft-lb as recommended by Edelbrock. When I re-did them, I stuck to 75 ft-lb per ARP, and no more problems. I also gave up on the recommended Fel-Pro Print-O-Seal 1247 intake gaskets after losing them 3 (#&%*!!) times, with vacuum leaks and major oil consumption due to them distorting like pretzels. Metal reinforced seem to work great. There are rumors on the street that the Edel springs may not be the highest quality, but I can't speak to that since I went to Crane springs to match my cam. Speaking of that, the Edels probably breathe well enough on the exhaust side that a dual profile cam might not be necessary like with cast heads. Lastly, I used the Edels on my hard-working 410 with 10:1 CR, and that turned into a total disaster, in spite of persistent suggestions that you can push some extra compression with aluminum heads. Just didn't work with my heavily loaded truck.
I've probably droned on long enough to put you to sleep by now. Bottom line, I think they are a good piece, but probably warrant a look at the valve job and overall in general before you slap them on, and don't overtorque anything!!
Steve

 

I also lost some heli-coils on my first experience with Ed Heads. These were the exhaust bolt holes. I gave up and sent them back with a bolt cut off in one of the holes.

Now, I'm trying them again with the 428 stroker I just ordered. I'll fight that battle agin in about 8 weeks.

Your only real option is ported and rebuilt iron heads, and they cost about the same. And, you have to know what you're doing or find somebody that does.

Dove Heads are in a different price range all together.

If anybody else has advice on installing the Ed Heads, bring it on. I'd like my next attempt to be painless.

 

I went with ARP stainless studs everywhere I could on my E-bock heads; rocker stands (not stainless), carburetor, valve covers, and exhaust headers. Pricey but I didn't want to risk testing those helicoils. Header studs make the header and rocker shaft installations a lot easier anyway. ARP doesn't list an application for the valve cover studs for FEs but I found that their standard carb studs work out great; just buy three sets at 10.99 a set and you'll have two spares. In all it's close to $200 worth of hardware but it sure looks nice. (Just keep saying that over and over ).

 

Would you expand on this? What types of problems did you encounter?

Christopher

 

Christopher,
As I said, I use my truck quite heavily loaded most of the time, it's a hi-boy with slide-in camper setup so around 10,000# so had to add air bags, anti-sway bars, disc brakes, etc. What I encountered was that I couldn't de-tune it enough to get away from detonation, even using premium gas. I tried everything I knew to do including lazy dizzy curving, retarded timing, rich on the jetting, lower temp thermostat, 0.003" deck on block for optimum quench, ???.
I suspect that lighter rigs can better get away with high(er) CR's, but if you are spending much time grinding up significant slopes with a load aboard, a more conservative CR is advisable. Eventually, I lost some compression in two cylinders, so pulled it down and found broken #2 rings in those and one other hole. Expensive lesson. I finally went to custom forged pistons from Ross, big bucks, to get down to 9:1 on CR. I would liked to have tried around 9.5:1, but with all the problems I'd already been thru, decided to get down to a level that I was sure would work and have it over with, not to mention that I didn't want to invest in yet another set of custom pistons if it didn't work! Besides, if you look at the history of Ford and their truck engines they usually ran them down in the low 8's and even into the 7's for CR, so didn't want to push my luck!
Think that pretty well covers it! Steve

 

Hopefully I will get to avoid some of your problems. I am running a 390 with OEM replacement pistons, .030 over, so I am not worried about the CR being too high. I have not checked it for sure yet. I just do not want to risk warping these heads.

When you torqued down your heads, did you use the ARP lube? Is that maybe the reason for needing to use less torque? They publish a chart calculating the change in torque based on what lube you are using on the bolts. I spent nearly 100 bucks (w/tax) on the two head gaskets I have; I do not want to blow them.

BTW, why did you try to go high compression on a workhorse?

 

Christopher,
Yep, used ARP lube on the ARP headbolts, and those 1020 gaskets cost nearly that much here too, so it really hurt to have them go away. I think ARP specs lower torque because of the fact that their bolts have less stretch, plus they believe in their lube!
I batted around what CR to try for a couple of reasons. First was that just about anyone I discussed it with was convinced that the aluminum heads would take the edge off, but now I realize that they are all racer-guys, not haulers. Second, when I bought the original Silvolite 1139 pistons, I didn't have my numbers together totally to see what I was going to wind up with. And only then found the domes were too thin to do much with. I didn't do my homework ahead of time, unfortunately, just trusted "the guys" to keep me out of trouble, in spite of what my machinist tried to tell me, bad move. My entire 410 story has been a series of very frustrating experiences, and if it didn't have so much more torque than the 390 it replaced, I'd be in a really deep funk. Have to say that I have learned more thru the process than I ever thought existed, so maybe it was worth it in spite of the major jabs to the wallet. Who knows, I might even try for a Scat crank "extra stroker" FE some day, but I will have to let the wife come down off the ceiling first!
Steve

 

Hmmm...I originally bought a 428 crank to stroke my 390. I eventually dropped the project because I could not get a straight answer on compression, replacement pistons, harmonic balancers, flywheels etc. etc. The guys at Ford racing didn't have many answers, except for me to change over to a 460. So, with time running short, I just had my 390 crank turned downed and balanced. Figured I would get my 500 bucks back out of the crank too.

How did you do your conversion? More specifically, if I were to keep the crank I have, what else would I need to do the conversion?

BTW, what cam did you go with?

Christopher

 

Go to any parts store and order pistons (and rings) for a `76 4V 390 for a truck, as they were 410 pistons. Add these new pistons to your 390/428 rods and 428 crank, and voila, you have a 410 engine. Compression will be about 8.4:1 provided you don't cut the heads or deck of the block.

Simple as that, provided you rebuild your engine properly.

Oh, forgot to mention, you will need the 410/428 flywheel, or have the entire assembly balanced internally.

 

I think that if you used 390 (8.4-1) compression pistons with a 410/428 crank you would end up with more like 10.-1 compression.

 

weren't the 70's motors using low compression 7.4:1 pistons?

 

Duh, that makes sense. My turn to feel stupid.

Compression can be dealt with, though, by non-stock gaskets. Original factory gaskets were approximately .017 compressed, and you can get different gaskets upto .040. Not a big difference, but it does help. Also, pistons can be fly-cut to shave points off the CR too.

The 360 was 7.4:1, but I believe (may be wrong, though) that the 390 stayed over 8.0:1. I no longer have my 70's shop manual, though, so I'm trying to work from memory. I seem to remember the # 7.9:1, and that may be what the 390 ended up, but I seem to remember that being the earlier 360's. Again, I could be wrong.

Anyone else have an accurate manual?

 

Just back from a road trip, so getting caught up again.
If you are going to try to lower CR with a thicker head gasket, you need to be very careful of increasing the quench distance between head and top of piston to more than .04-.05". It can actually make the detonation situation WORSE rather than better to lose the quench even tho the compression is lowered. Both KB-Silvolite and Hastings have really good technical discussions on the ramifications of various twiddling with engine components. I believe the only practical way to keep the CR down is to do some whittling on the piston domes.
All that said, I am extremely pleased with the extra torque that the 410 makes over the 390, in spite of all the trials it took to get there. As stated previously, all it takes is a 3.98" stroke crank, 1.66" compression height pistons, an externally balanced flywheel, and you are in business. But before you do all this, take a careful look at the CR calculator on the KB-Silvolite site and figure out what your CR is going to be.
Good Luck. Steve