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Won't fire

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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 12:01 PM
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Won't fire

I have a 91 ranger with the 3.0 engine. Recently the engine was not reving up when i stepped on the gas. But, it kept running and i got home. Then one day it just wouldn't start after i just shut it off. I've changed the distributor cap and rotor,fuel pump and filter.I have spark to all 6 plugs and good fuel pressure to the fuel rail.I'm leaning toward the timing. Last night I found the harmonic balancer will just spin freely. Will this stop it from firing?If it is the timing, how do i find tdc and where is the # 1 firing position on the distributor cap(no markings)?
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by fordster91
Recently the engine was not reving up when i stepped on the gas.
a dirty mass air flow sensor may cause this, try and clean it with some
crc mass air flow sensor cleaner, Note: disconnect the sensor before cleaning and some other products like carb cleaner may damage the maf.

 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 12:51 PM
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Pull the distributor cap off of it and have someone turn the key and see if the rotor under the cap is turning. If not start there. Either the camshaft is broken or the gear on the distributor shaft has broken. A no start condition is a pain to diagnose but if we can help we will.
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 02:45 PM
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Thanks for the reply. We pulled all six spark plugs and put each one in a different plug wire and turned the engine over. We got spark to all six plugs, so I'm thinking the distributor is ok.I'm still not sure what effect the loose harmonic balancer will have. We can reach down and spin it freely.
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 05:15 PM
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to answer one of your questions, dist cap off, turn crank CW to 0 deg on balancer, when the rotor is pointing approx 12 o'clock or toward the firewall it is at TDC compresson stroke #1 cylinder.
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 05:35 PM
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You can turn the balancer freely? Is the crankshaft turning with the balancer?

What does it sound like when you try to start it, does it sound like the starter is under load?
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 06:09 PM
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Yes, My son was under the truck and could just turn the balance by hand.It appears to be spinning around the center shaft if that makes sense.Of course it makes it useless to help in checking tdc.I'm wondering if we can check TDC without changing the balance if it is not neccesarily in need of replacement to get the truck to fire.
 
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Old Mar 6, 2012 | 06:33 PM
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In that case, that's your problem! The 3.0 balancer has a tone-ring on it (toothed ring), and the computer uses that to determine crankshaft position, and therefore when to spark.

Take the balancer off and see what's going on.

EDIT: Sorry, I missed the part where you had a distributor. In that case, I do not believe you have the tone ring and crankshaft position sensor on the balancer.
 
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Old Mar 7, 2012 | 04:39 PM
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harmonic balancer $58 rockauto, I think I would have to have one that isn't broke. Well you could always remove #1 plug and insert a screwdriver thru the spark plug hole though I prefer something softer like a straw.... turn the crank CW and when the distributor rotor is at about 12 oclock and the straw has moved up as far as it will go your at TDC that will tell you it is timed correctly. If the rotor dont move you prolly got a busted chain.
 
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Old Mar 7, 2012 | 06:29 PM
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We will check the timing this evening and hopefully get some good news.
 
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Old Mar 8, 2012 | 05:03 AM
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checked timing and it was correct,still no fire. Is it possible to have fuel to injectors and they are malfunctioning. Perhaps not allowing fuel to cylinders.I thought it would be unusual to happen to all six cylinders at the same time.
 
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Old Mar 8, 2012 | 06:44 AM
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Not all 6. See if you can verify the injectors have +12 volts to them while the key is on. The computer grounds the injectors to fire them.

Also, have you checked all the fuses, and do you hear the fuel pump cycle when you turn the key on?
 
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Old Mar 9, 2012 | 10:31 PM
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Have plenty of fuel to the rail. Checked compression on all cylinders. They range from 30 to 35 #. Not sure what they should read. Been getting answers from 35 to 100+ psi.Rotor turns when engine turns over. Blue spark on all six plugs. Can't use harmonic balancer to time.Sprayed starter fluid in throttle neck?? and still no fire.We believe we have the #1 piston at the top of the cylinder and put the distributor back in with the rotor @11 o'clock.Could we still have the timing off where it won't ever sputter. It just cranks over.I wasn't there but I was told we have 12volts at the injectors and they pulsed.
 
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Old Mar 9, 2012 | 10:47 PM
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35 psi isn't enough to light off anything. You should have around 135-160 PSI. Are you sure you did it correctly? You should do it until the gauge "pulses" 4-5 times, or it stops going up a significant amount each time. The throttle also has to be wide open during the test.

Was the loosing power gradual, or sudden? How many miles on the engine?

If you have an air compressor, you can rent a tool called a "leak down" tester from autozone. It basically has a couple of gauges on it, threads into a sparkplug hole, and connects to your air compressor. One of the gauges reads the regulated line pressure, the other one reads the pressure on the cylinder end. You divide the cylinder side pressure by the line side pressure to get the leak down percentage.

Each cylinder you test needs to be on top dead center of compression. (You can verify this by turning the engine until the distributor lines up with the sparkplug wire for that cylinder)

In addition to telling you how much compression leakage you have, it can tell you where its leaking out. If you hear hissing coming from the intake, you have leaking intake valves, hear hissing from the exhaust - leaking exhaust valves. Hear hissing from the oil fill cap? Bad piston rings/hole in piston. See/hear bubbles in your cooling system? Cracked head/head gasket failure.
 
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Old Mar 10, 2012 | 10:19 AM
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OK! We've got an old gear head coming over today to help out. We're going to recheck the compression with the throttle wide open. Which I'm not sure what that does. When we tested the compression yesterday we let the engine turnover until it didn't increase anymore.About 20 sec.I would think it would be unusual for all cylinders to be reading @ 35# when they should be @ 135#.Maybe the tester itself wasn't operating right.They are going to get one from Oreill'ys today.Also, we're still not sure exactly where the distributor should be facing since the harmonic balancer is of no use to us. This last go around we got the # 1 piston (front passenger side) to the top and dropped the distributor ( which has a square and a rounded cap- bolt down area)With the square side facing to the passenger side of the truck. I was told this was how it was when they first worked on it. WE set the rotor at 11'oclock.I would think the truck should at least backfire. But we got nothing.Thanks for the intel. Will give an update this afternoon.
 
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