Problems caused by idling?
More Turbo
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 538
Likes: 45
From: Lansing, MI
For some actual temps during non-SEIC cold start idling click on the rapid heat link in my sig. There is also a link in the spreadsheet that gives more background information on the data.
Looking at the data again it appears that the engine is still gradually warming up at the 10 minute mark. At some point I would imagine the data line flattens out so the optimum non SEIC idle time would be when the temp line starts to flatten. The oil temp line also flattens a little at the 4 minute mark. Perhaps that is a good time to start driving the truck.
Looking at the data again it appears that the engine is still gradually warming up at the 10 minute mark. At some point I would imagine the data line flattens out so the optimum non SEIC idle time would be when the temp line starts to flatten. The oil temp line also flattens a little at the 4 minute mark. Perhaps that is a good time to start driving the truck.
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 537
Likes: 8
For some actual temps during non-SEIC cold start idling click on the rapid heat link in my sig. There is also a link in the spreadsheet that gives more background information on the data.
Looking at the data again it appears that the engine is still gradually warming up at the 10 minute mark. At some point I would imagine the data line flattens out so the optimum non SEIC idle time would be when the temp line starts to flatten. The oil temp line also flattens a little at the 4 minute mark. Perhaps that is a good time to start driving the truck.
Looking at the data again it appears that the engine is still gradually warming up at the 10 minute mark. At some point I would imagine the data line flattens out so the optimum non SEIC idle time would be when the temp line starts to flatten. The oil temp line also flattens a little at the 4 minute mark. Perhaps that is a good time to start driving the truck.
some testing this weekend at 1200 rpm and I'll post back the time to reach diminishing returns on oil and tranny temps. In fact. I'll send you the data so you can add it to your sheet.
I am also going to track idle hrs on the dash over the next number of days to see if the ecu considers 1200 rpm non-idle time.
Senior User
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 436
Likes: 2
From: Salt Lake City, UT
Whew. Just got threw this thread. I have to say, the most interesting, entertaining and non-offensive thread I've seen on here in months. Thanks to all who contributed. Now I need to remote start my truck to warm up before I head out of the office....!!
Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 25,479
Likes: 738
From: Isanti, MN
Thirty seconds should be adequate regardless of the outside temperature as long as you use the block heater when required at -10° F or below. I normally spent that 30 seconds idling out to the road from the parking spot.
The important thing to remember is that you should go easy on it until the engine gets warmer. I was real light on the pedal until the temperature gauge started to move, and never applied full throttle until the engine was at, or at least close to, operating temperature.
These things start, run, and drive just like gas engines do with the technology that's used today. Maintenance is more crucial with a diesel, but letting it idle to warm up isn't necessary anymore. That went out with the introduction of the first electronically controlled diesel engines, which was 1994 for Ford.
New User
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Thanks Tom. Don't think we will see -10 degrees here in SE Va. Heck, I'm starting to wonder if we are going to have a winter at all this year.
Yeah, I've been idling mine too long, due to ignorance.
As far as making the cab comfortable, my truck came with the rapid heater option. I found if I set the control to 90 degrees, floor outlets on, and fan on high, the cab will warm up in no time.
I do wish the truck would of came with seat heaters (bought it as is /off the lot), that's the one option it was missing, that I would of liked. Maybe I'll get an aftermarket heated seat pad, that I can plug into the compartment under the center seat.
Yeah, I've been idling mine too long, due to ignorance.
As far as making the cab comfortable, my truck came with the rapid heater option. I found if I set the control to 90 degrees, floor outlets on, and fan on high, the cab will warm up in no time.
I do wish the truck would of came with seat heaters (bought it as is /off the lot), that's the one option it was missing, that I would of liked. Maybe I'll get an aftermarket heated seat pad, that I can plug into the compartment under the center seat.
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,664
Likes: 188
I don't have a steady work schedule here in Northern NH. My truck will sit for a few days until I need it. By then it's good a cold. Most mornings here down in single digits. I remote start it for 15 minutes. By then it's more comfortable to get in for my old bones.
Not much worse then the times I sit in traffic around Boston for hours but at least I keep my old bones in comfort. This is one of my highest priorities in life and nothing will change this at this point. Being I live in the woods no one cares.
Not much worse then the times I sit in traffic around Boston for hours but at least I keep my old bones in comfort. This is one of my highest priorities in life and nothing will change this at this point. Being I live in the woods no one cares.
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 537
Likes: 8
Some info I posted in another thread but probably belongs here....
I am sure the truck can be warmed up FASTER with driving but I can tell you when I first fired her up at -27C, she shook pretty bad. Even after 5 mins of high idle it was still a bit rough. At the 10 min mark, everything was as smooth as butter. Also, the fact that the truck got to within 20C of it's normal op temp (relative to the ambient that is) after 40 mins tells me that high idle does a pretty darn good job of keeping exhaust temps up. Hope this info helps others.
Cheers, JC
It was -25C and mine started with no issues this am although I had it plugged in.
It's been sitting all day unplugged and I'll be starting it in about 5 mins so I'll let you know. Still -25C out.
Truck said -27c outside. Didn't sound the best starting and was a hair rough but fired on 2 nd crank.
Immediately jumped to 1150 rpm and counted down for 22 secs before it said was ok to drive.
10 mins at high idle has my oil at 20C.
The interesting part is it never dropped out of high idle, even after the oil warmed up. Control Must be based on exterior temps.
Another interesting bit is that my run time just increased by 1 hr but my idle time didn't move so looks like high idle is considered running, not idling.
Data:
7:05 -24
7:07 -22
7:08 -20
7:09 -19
7:10 -14
7:11 -6
7:12 3
7:13 10
7:15 19
7:17 27
7:20 35
7:25 42
7:30 49
7:35 53
7:40 56
7:45 58
Ext -27c
1150 rpm
Driving:
7;50 70
7:55 75
8:00 78
8:10 81
A little later, exhaust filter cleanining kicked in at 78C oil temp.
I let her sit for a bit and then drove her easy and she came up to 69C. I stopped and high idled for about 10 mins or so and she only dropped to 67C.
It's been sitting all day unplugged and I'll be starting it in about 5 mins so I'll let you know. Still -25C out.
Truck said -27c outside. Didn't sound the best starting and was a hair rough but fired on 2 nd crank.
Immediately jumped to 1150 rpm and counted down for 22 secs before it said was ok to drive.
10 mins at high idle has my oil at 20C.
The interesting part is it never dropped out of high idle, even after the oil warmed up. Control Must be based on exterior temps.
Another interesting bit is that my run time just increased by 1 hr but my idle time didn't move so looks like high idle is considered running, not idling.
Data:
7:05 -24
7:07 -22
7:08 -20
7:09 -19
7:10 -14
7:11 -6
7:12 3
7:13 10
7:15 19
7:17 27
7:20 35
7:25 42
7:30 49
7:35 53
7:40 56
7:45 58
Ext -27c
1150 rpm
Driving:
7;50 70
7:55 75
8:00 78
8:10 81
A little later, exhaust filter cleanining kicked in at 78C oil temp.
I let her sit for a bit and then drove her easy and she came up to 69C. I stopped and high idled for about 10 mins or so and she only dropped to 67C.
Cheers, JC
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 537
Likes: 8
I'm curious as to how much it would have come up at regular idle as well but given I don't need to worry about that anymore, perhaps someone else can test it. I wonder if it would even have gotten past zero. Regardless, normal idle is not good for the truck anyway, that much is well established.
I was also thinking some more and figure that rpm alone (even without considering the improved combustion) would reduce wet stacking just by keeping the flow/velocities through the cylinder chambers higher, which might prevent any unatomized fuel from dropping out (especially at colder temps) and blow it out with the exhaust gases.
Tuned
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 482
Likes: 28
From: Southern Ontario
Very interesting TJ ...... after 5 mins of high idle the temps have only gone up 10 degrees but at 10 mins there has been an increase of 44 degrees. For those wondering 99 degrees is normal operating in Celsius. After 40 mins of idling you are only at 58 degrees. I will try and provide data on a start and drive if we ever get the temps that low here .... north of Toronto.
Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 25,479
Likes: 738
From: Isanti, MN
JC, thanks for taking the time to do this! Do you have any way of monitoring coolant temps?
So here we have an example of a truck running for 40 minutes under temperature. Had the truck been driven for half as long as it was idled it would have made it to operating temperature.
So here we have an example of a truck running for 40 minutes under temperature. Had the truck been driven for half as long as it was idled it would have made it to operating temperature.
Senior User
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
How much difference do you think it'll make if one was to install the grill
Insert style winter front, or the dreaded quilted blanket style. I plug mine in when I am home, but really can't at work, although sometimes I am able. I have noticed on the really cold nights lately. 10-20 F, it takes a long time for it to heat up to full temp on the dash needle when I leave work, 15 minutes of highway driving before it gets there, and that's with warming it for ~10 mins. SEIC 1200 RPM's. Glad I have heated seats; wish I had rapid heat. I'm considering getting the winter front just to speed up the time it takes to get to operating temp...
Insert style winter front, or the dreaded quilted blanket style. I plug mine in when I am home, but really can't at work, although sometimes I am able. I have noticed on the really cold nights lately. 10-20 F, it takes a long time for it to heat up to full temp on the dash needle when I leave work, 15 minutes of highway driving before it gets there, and that's with warming it for ~10 mins. SEIC 1200 RPM's. Glad I have heated seats; wish I had rapid heat. I'm considering getting the winter front just to speed up the time it takes to get to operating temp...
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 537
Likes: 8
I have no way to monitor coolant temps unfortunately.
I do have a winter front. I installed a black poly sheet behind the grille.
I will also say that at -27C ambient (-20F) I'd be surprised if the oil ever hits 99C. Maybe under heavy load but not putting around town. 83C seemed to be my max last night.
And yes, no doubt truck will warm up way faster but you need to be in the truck freezing your nads off for that. This at least confirms to me that it should be OK to high idle the truck to get it moderately warmed up before you get in. What it does tell me though is that 10 mins is probably ideal for my purposes. Any less and you're sitting in a stone cold truck for at least 5 mins.
The most important piece here is that if you only have a 10 minute commute, you can at least get 2/3 of the way to normal op temp without even getting in the truck. That means bybthe end of the commute you might actually have hit normal op for a short time. This is better than always driving it cold, at least in my mind. And the added benefit is that you don't have to freeze to death either.
I do have a winter front. I installed a black poly sheet behind the grille.
I will also say that at -27C ambient (-20F) I'd be surprised if the oil ever hits 99C. Maybe under heavy load but not putting around town. 83C seemed to be my max last night.
And yes, no doubt truck will warm up way faster but you need to be in the truck freezing your nads off for that. This at least confirms to me that it should be OK to high idle the truck to get it moderately warmed up before you get in. What it does tell me though is that 10 mins is probably ideal for my purposes. Any less and you're sitting in a stone cold truck for at least 5 mins.
The most important piece here is that if you only have a 10 minute commute, you can at least get 2/3 of the way to normal op temp without even getting in the truck. That means bybthe end of the commute you might actually have hit normal op for a short time. This is better than always driving it cold, at least in my mind. And the added benefit is that you don't have to freeze to death either.