As I was troubleshooting everything on my truck yesterday, I found out something kinda weird/funny...I'll tell the tale...

My truck had a bad surging idle...as part of the troubleshooting process I went to pull codes even though no check engine light had ever been on. So I jumped the self-test output to terminal E...and went to turn the key on to look at blinks. Turned the key on and...nothing.

So I figure the light bulb must be blown, and begin to pull the dash apart. Get the bezel off, hold it up to the sun to see where the "Check Engine" light was on the lens, found it between the left turn signal indicator and the "Engine" light. Looked in the dash cluster and...nothing. WTF? No bulb...no socket...no wiring behind the cluster leading to it. No traces of a Check Engine light.

We've had this truck since '93. When my great grandpa got her she was only 6 years old and had extremely low mileage. Totally unmolested and has remained that way. I'm pretty confident I was probably the first one inside that dash.

I was thinking about it last night, and I think I may have a possible explanation. Back in 1987 (truck was built in May 1987 as a 1987 model) the 5.8 and the 7.5 were both still carb'd...so if I'm thinking correctly, an 87 F-series with a 351 or 460 would NOT have had a check engine light. So I'm kinda thinking maybe there was a communication breakdown on this one and no check engine light was added?

Thoughts? Comments?

 

IF MEMORY IS RIGHT MY OLD 87 HAD A CHECK ENGINE LIGHT FOR THE EMISSIONS STUFF ONLY , IT WOULD TURN ON AT A CERTAIN MILEAGE TO REMIND YOU TO CHECK THE EMISSION JUNK !

 

Hmm....well I don't know then...I just know mine doesn't have one...weird as hell...

 

correct. an 87 with a 5.8 or a 7.5 engine would not have a CEL because they had carburetors did not have a computer.

 

Yep, I thought about it more and the light the guy above is thinking of is the Emissions light, which mine has. Check Engine was only on vehicles equipped with EFI/EEC

 

The first year of a CEL (Check Engine light) connected to a computer was 1988.

 

Well that makes sense...sort of. I still don't really get why any company would make a computer controlled vehicle with no Check Engine/MIL? Is there a way to wire in one? You could wire it into the check engine ground on the EEC or the self-test plug, couldn't you? Just run a light to the gauge cluster with an ignition-switched 12V+ and allow the EEC to ground/illuminate the light? I want a light like it should have had back in 1987. Thanks for all the input on this topic guys!

 

The test procedure for these early EFI trucks is to put a noid light on the EEC Test connector Self-test Out pin when pulling the codes.

 

87 460 did not have efi or a computer to do eec testing, so there will not be a check engine light or self test connector .

 

Yea, I tested it with a test light and got the codes, I knew about that way but a knowledgeable guy on another site and one of my friends both said it should have the light...and from my personal experience I'm shocked a computer-controlled vehicle didn't have a MIL. Not trying to start a "brand war" here (even though I am a GM guy), but you'll never find a computer-controlled GM without a Service Engine Soon light. Just makes troubleshooting easier. I'm gonna be adding one to this truck. I know how to make it work...

 

Like tjc said in Post #9 above, a 1987 460 did not have a computer from the factory, it used a DSII ignition with a carburetor.

If you have a computer, your truck did not come with a 460 from the factory.

Post your VIN and we can tell you what it came with.

As for what GM did, well, good for them....

 

Lol I know what it came with from the factory...exactly what's in it...like I said above, the truck has been in the family since '93 and it was all original at that point...I also know that an 87 460 didn't have a computer, hence why I mentioned in my first post that's why I thought the CLUSTER was a factory mistake. Because the truck had a computer and no Check Engine light. But I guess that was standard procedure for Ford in 1987. Whether it made sense or not.

But, again, let me clarify...I know the origins of this truck...totally and completely. We got it in 1993 and we know the original owner...it has it's original engine/transmission in it.

 

Not sure what ya got there.

87 F250 with carb has no computer hence no reason for a CEL, nothing to check codes for so connecting a light after the fact would be useless.

Has no EEC test port, dummy cap covers opening where computer would be in firewall.

There is the rabs test lead/port pull trouble codes for it however don't recall where it is on that one at the moment. There is a DSS test connector from the VSS on the rear diff on the drivers side inner fender but its used solely by the RABS module not for speedo input. Speedo is cable driven.

 

So, IF you don't have a carb, someone converted it to efi and forgot to put in a check engine light OR the factory mistake was putting efi in it. Your vin would help us understand, as would a pic of your engine bay. And it may be the original engine, and tranny, with Ford original parts, and still be a EFI swap. And it is a MODEL year '87, right? I'm not sure when model years started to be released the year before.

 

Interesting thread! is it a carb motor, is the computer plugged in, are there a lot of unused connectors leading from that harness?