Hi,

I'm new here but already have a problem I think you guys can help me out with. I very recently purchased a 1971 F100. It's got a 360. It was running and starting like a champ until this morning. When I went to start it,it turned over, but very slowly. Now it reluctantly turns over one time but does not start. And even when I give it some gas nothing happens. Brand new battery by the way, and the accessories are working. My neighbor did open up the points last night so that is where I think the problem may be. I am a super newbie,so I need some help. What should I be looking for and adjusting?

Nate

 

If you think it's your points you can check and set the gap with a feeler guage. The gap should be between .017"-.021" when the points are open. If you dont have one you can check to make sure that the points are opening and closing by watching them while you turn the engine over by hand. You wont have to turn it very far to be able to see the points move. The gap should be about 1/2 to 3/4 thickness of a dime. First thing to do is check to make sure there isn't a spec of dirt keeping your points from closing all the way. Does your engine sound like it's even trying to fire?

 

It's definitely trying to start. I'll take a look and see that the points are opening. According to the guy who sold it to me, the points and condenser are new, and they certainly look new. It may not have been the right thing to do, but I tried the solenoid screwdriver trick. The solenoid is making lots f noise when I try to start the trick. The screwdriver trick seemed to make it try a little harder but still didn't start it. I'm mostly sure I tried the trick right.

Thanks

Nate

 

Ok checked the points. They look clean. I do not have a gap tool but it looks like about 1/2 the width of a dime. I've noticed one of the cables in re solenoid is loose. I don't know the name of it, but it's the hot small wire ( not from the battery). When we jiggled it and tried to start it at the same time, the truck tried harder to start. Any ideas?

 

So I guess the question is where do I start with the troubleshooting?

By the way, you can see pics here: https://picasaweb.google.com/nate.ritchie/Truck (before she wouldn't start)

Nate

 

Ok. The point gap is probably good enough to let the engine start and run. The next thing I would do is connect a test light or volt meter to the (+)side of the ignition coil and check for steady voltage. The light should stay lit without flickering (or the guage shouldn't fluctuate) while the ignition is on. Voltage at coil should be 6-8 volts. If this checks out remove the air breather and with the ignition off,while holding the choke plate open, move the throttle linkage to wide open while looking into the carburetor. You should see a shot of gas into each barrel. Don't do this more than twice or you'll flood it. If you don't see any gas shooting into the throttle bores when you move the linkage you might have dirt clogging your carb's internal passages or you might need a new fuel pump. Before you pull off your carb to take it apart or go out and buy a fuel pump check your fuel line for a cracked or leaking hose on the suction side of pump.

 

Nate,

First, let me say that is one fine truck you have there!

Before you get too far into things, lets look at this logically. If it was running fine before, it may not be the points. You have messed with them, so they'll have to be adjusted properly later. For now, lets look at the starter system. Your battery is new, but that's no guarantee it is fully charged. Test to make sure. Your cables are also important, as are the condition of your connections. The starter solenoid has to be in good condition, and properly grounded. It grounds to the inner fender apron by it's hold down screws. The cable from the solenoid to the starter has to be in good condition, of correct size, and with clean connections. Lastly, your starter motor has to be in good condition to turn the engine over at sufficient speed.

As indicated in your original post, the starter motor is turning slowly. This needs to be addressed. The starter motor is held on by two or 3 bolts. It is easy to remove. It can be taken to any auto parts store and tested. Before you do that, make sure the battery, starter solenoid, and cables are in good functional condition. If they check out ok, the remove the starter motor and have it checked.

BTW, if the starter motor is dead, you have several options. You can replace it with a new or used unit, or you can buy a rebuild kit and fix it yourself. The rebuild kit will cost the least, probably around $20.00. Used starter at a wrecker, about $35, or new $$$.

If your lucky, the starter motor will check out ok. The solenoid is cheap, about $7 at any auto parts place. The point is to get the starter motor to turn the engine over at an adequate speed. Until that happens, I wouldn't mess with anything else.

Also, your no start situation could be caused by more than one issue. Fix the obvious first, and work your way through methodically, testing at each step to verify.

I don't know your level of skill, if you have a manual or trouble-shooting guide, or even if you've worked on engines before. I will help you as much as I am able.

Do you have any tools, or test equipment? Once the engine is running, you'll need to do a tune-up. Basically, you have to decide if you want to do this yourself, or if you'd rather someone else did it for you. It's not brain surgery, but if you're starting from zero, it's a bit of a learning curve.

You have a cool truck, a swell girlfriend(wife?), and a real dog. This tells me you are no fool. Everyone here is very helpful, and I've learned so much on this site. It's all here for the asking. Are you ready to dive in? Good! Check those things out and report back.

Cheers,

John

 

if you installed new points with out putting dielectric grease on the point cam ,they have probobley closed up.recheck gap.

 

Hi John,

Thanks for the very helpful post and compliments. I'm pretty excited about the truck. So it seems the battery was not as new as I thought. I replaced it and immediately the motor started to turn over more quickly, like when I bought it. But unlike when I bought it, it's not catching. I did mess around a little bit with the points and I'm wondering if they might need adjusted. Any tips here? I'm headed out to get a gapping tool right now.

My level of skill is low but my interest and willingness to learn is very high. So your help is much appreciated.

 

New battery + adjusting the points back closer to where they are = starts up like a champ. So now it starts, and runs (I did a short test drive), but it's a little rougher than before. Instead of a consistent "purr", it's a choppier sound and feel. Like there is a rhythm to
it. Do you think I need to continue to adjust the points? Any tips here would be great.

 

retime it,with the vacuum disconnected and plugged,then reconnect the vacuum and check to see if it's advancing when revved.

 

Nate,

If you've adjusted your point gap, you're half way there. Every time you adjust your point gap, the timing changes. In order to set your timing to factory spec, you need to use a timing light. If you are unfamiliar with how to use one, just google "timing light" and do a bit of reading. Your neighbour may have a timing light that you could borrow. The other thing you will need to do is find and clean your timing marks on the engine. Do you know where they are? If so, take a wire brush and clean the marks well enough to see them. You'll want to mark the TDC (top dead center) line with some white paint - anything to make it easier to see. Stock spec for the 360 is 6 degrees BTDC (before top dead center), This just means that the spark occurs 6 degrees (of crank rotation) before the number 1 piston reaches TDC. This is at idle. As the engine revs faster, the timing must be advanced further. There are two types used on your engine. Mechanical and vacuum. The mechanical bob weights are located beneath the points plate in your distributor. You will check to see if they're working when you have the timing light. The vacuum advance is located on the outside of your distributor. It is connected to the carb by a rubber hose. This is the hose sandman is referring to in the above post. Both the mechanical advance and the vacuum advance are automatic. You don't have to do anything except insure they're working .The idea is to turn the distributor until the 6 degree mark lines up with the stationary pointer. Then you tighten the bolt which holds the distributor in place and recheck. Once the timing is locked in, you can adjust the carb. Don't bother adjusting the carb until the timing is set. I know this may seem complicated, but really, it's not difficult. Once you've done it a few times, you won't even have to think about it. That's the basics. When you're setting the timing, the goal is to have the distributor deliver the spark to the cylinder at the precise time. There are many methods and folks will have different ways to do things. Keep an open mind. Find the way that works best for you. Keep those questions coming. You'll be an old hand at this in no time...

Cheers,

John

P.S. I always use a tach/dwell meter to do my point gap adjustment. I feel it's more accurate than a feeler gauge - although the feeler gauge method is easier...

 

Sandman and John,

Thanks for all the advice. I think I may try to tackle the timing early next week if I have time. Seems like a good thing for me to learn. And since I am learning all of this stuff, what is the best service guide to get? I've seen the Chilton's online for a decent price, but if there is something better let me know.

Thanks,
Nate

 

Nate,

I prefer the Chilton manual. You can also get the original Ford workshop manual (5 vol. paperback)for $$$, or the same one on cd from Detroitiron.com or hippo, I have both. 90% of the time I use the chilton manual - it's just easier... Between the two cds, the hippo 64-72 is less expensive - about $25.00.

Cheers,

John

 

Hey I'm glad you got it running. That is a real nice truck b.t.w. I just clicked on the link and looked at your pics. You said it's running kind of rough? Do you know what your points are gapped at? Should be .017"-.021" if your using a feeler guage. You could also have a misfire. When you have time it might be a good idea to remove your spark plugs and look at them to see if any of them are fouled. Sooty carbon deposits can bridge the gap so that the plug can't fire at all. Usually you can get away with cleaning the spark plugs and gapping them if they have less than 15,000-20,000 miles on them. Gap should be .035". I don't know how much you know about engines but this is what I'd check next if it were my engine.