Has anyone else in the Norhtern or frozen half of the region (including Canada) with a private septic system had a problem with it freezing? Our Mound/Drainfield froze up from the lengthy run of sub-zero temps and lack of adequate snowcover halting any water from being pumped out of the tank causing it to fill up. We have had to cut off power to the pump and have the tank pumped out way ahead of schedule. And the way things are it probably will not be ready to use until it can thaw out and that may not be until April. I guess we are not the only ones in this area that have had this problem. At least it is starting to warm up in this neck of the woods.

 

I got to sympathize with you. No experience with your problem, but, man, thats gotta suck.

Growing up in the city, you take stuff like septic, water for granted.

Move to the mountains, well water (yummy), septic, no cable. I love it, except when I have to hike my cold butt 200 yards to the pump house and reset the jet pump at 5 in the morning when it is 0* outside. That's warm to you, but that's down right cold for me.

Maybe next winter I'll be used to it.

I feel for ya

 

Hey Derik, sorry to hear about your troubles! There was actually a deal on the news or in the paper a while back with several people having this same problem and if they didnt want to wait until the thaw it was a difficult task to open it up! The run of 60 degree weather we'll have over the weekend should speed up the process!

 

I love having a private well and septic. Our water is some of the best I have ever tasted and is not as harsh as city water with all of the chemicals. This is just a small problem that will work itself out. I'm more worried about the 70+ trees I planted last year surviving.

 

Yo Boss,

I remember my dad and grand dad telling me and then showing me how they dumped fresh cow (+goat, horse, etc.) manure over their well - water line to the house as well as the septic pit. Of course, since they had a farm in Union, ME the manure was readily avaialble, fresh and steamy!.

 

personally i'd say it's due to a poor design on the engineers part. if the septic was correctly built and installed you wouldn't have problems of it freezing.

like my grandfathers 50 year old, hand dug rock septic tank... only ever had it pumped once, and it really didn't need it...

yes i think regulations are needed, but most of the new septic systems are troublesome at best... my house just has a tank and a run-off in the woods... no problems, no smell, no need to pump it.
enough ranting. hope your system thaws soon, must be a real pita frozen.

 

Wow. Sorry to hear that. I've never seen a septic tank freeze before, but I've watched as my dad dug out the earth on ours to clear a clog. EEEEyyyyyukkkkk. I would agree with 'theonlybull' on poor design or installation. If it was deep enough I can't see it freezing.

But, I've got an idea that might speed up the thawing or help prevent future freezing. Here in Tulsa, the city provides free fresh cut mulch to anyone that can pick it up with a truck or trailer. I bet your city might have a program like that? My theory is that if you put a large pile of moist/fresh mulch over the ground covering your tank the internal heat and steam should help speed the thawing process. Have you ever noticed a large pile of mulch or sawdust emitting steam and heat in the early morning cool temps? As the bark and tree particles start to breakdown and chemical reactions take place the bottom and inside of the pile heats up and gives off energy in the form of steam and heat. Anyway, it might be worth a try.

Good luck!

-Ron

 

i drive for a portable toilet/septic company and asked everybody here if they had ever heard of a tank freezing and nobody had.

like someone else here(at FTE) said, if its deep enough in the ground, generaly 12-16 inches, it shouldnt freeze.

a few questions..........how big(gallons) is the tank? is it frozen solid or is there just a layer of ice on the top? is the line to the house frozen also? if thats the case then you will have to wait till it thaws.


if its the tank thats frozen, you have a few options. the mulch idea,if you can get it free of charge, is a good one(although, it will be a PITA for the septic driver and the hose). if you cant get mulch free then i, along with everybody at work, would suggest about 100 pounds of Hallite or common sidwalk salt. the hallite and/or salt will eat through the ice creating a hole that a septic truck will be able to get a hose into. Hopefully the tank isnt frozen solid which really isnt likely, but if thats the case then it will take more Hallite and more time.


good luck, i hope you dont have to wait till april!

 

Its not the tank that is frozen. We have a thick clay soil so we don't have a typical drainfield. We have a mound system. Basically it looks like we have a buried van in our yard. The pump in the tank pumps the liquids out of the tank and up into the mound which has a maze of pipes that run through it and it drains out into a combo of sand and rock that is put in to filter everything out. The solids stay in the tank and shoud be pumped once every 2 years so the warranty is not voided. Otherwise I think this tank could go for years without being pumped. What happened is I think some standing water froze up in the mound and therefore the pump cannot do its job and pump out the water. I am not a septic expert so I don't know how far this actually goes into the ground. Well the tank filled up with water and set off the alarm saying that it was full. I thought it was poor engineering at first too but I guess this is not the case. Or maybe it is. All I know is when it thaws we can turn the pump back on and it should pump out the water and everything should be ok.

 

12"-16" to keep from freezing? Around here (due east of Derick) we have 36"-48" of frost in the ground. The lack of snow cover early this winter helped the frost go pretty deep. i just hope it thaws soon so I can go back to work. A frozen septic isn't fun. Happened to my family when I was a kid. No inside toilet for 2 days.

 

This is part of the problem. The lack of snow and extreme freezing was just too much. We can still use the toilet we just have to watch how much. I seem to be using the back deck a little bit more than normal now. Basically what happens is, the more water we use, the faster the tank fills. So we just have to watch how much water we use. Once it thaws we can turn on the pump and be back in business.

 

12-16 inches is what i was told and WI was mentioned in the discussion. i dont deal with the septic side of the company which is why i asked arounnd. but even the "older" folks said they'd never heard of a tank freezing and 12-16 was the min. frost line.


im sorry boss, i just sorta scanned your original post, i should have read it compleatly. on monday ill ask the right questions armed with the facts and see what the guys come up with.

ill do my best to keep ya off the back porch! god knows that cant be fun on a cold winter night!

 

I actually deal with this on a weekly basis.

We have a loose sandy soil here for the most part, so we don't have mounds, but here's what I think:

It's an engineering problem. You have to have enough insulation around the pipeworks to keep it from freezing in any conditions, whether it's soil depth insulation or Frostex electric pipe heater. In any case, properly installed underground septic tanks should never even come close to freezing, because the design should allow the tank to be completely flushed every cycle, and if they are properly buried, they should stay at a constant temperature.
Your problem may lie in the pump, and it's inability to provide enough pressure and flow rate to cycle the lines. Unfortunately, you will always have SOME water in the lines, but you should try to find a way to minimize that.
Try the suggestions of others in the thread: get some kind of organic mulch and put a 6 inch layer over the lines, and consider making the leach area larger with more capacity, so the lines clear faster. Also, make sure that the geometry of the system is such that the pump can provide enough head to move the water as it was designed.
As a pump guy, it has also been my experience that sewage pumps can cavitate (microbubbles leave pits in the case and on the impeller) when the discharge pipe freezes, so if you still have problems after the lines thaw, you should check the pump, and also the discharge lines. The lines can crack when they freeze if they are PVC...
Good luck, man.
BDV

 

Just be glad that you have indoor plumbing, there are parts of Alaska that don't due to the permafrost.