Great heads up post. Reps given.

Stewart

 

Thanks for the new info Reps 2 u

 

I spoke with Roadmaster Tech support today about the changes in design and various "modifications" they have made between the Mk2 and Mk3 versions.

Here's what they told me: The Mk 2 version did see an "upgrade" to the Axle end socket cap screw (that's the bolt that goes thru the SS toggle or slug) from M12 to M14 (aka up to 14 mm from 12 mm). They are still Class 12.9 bolts but the newer M14 is 70 mm long versus old 60 mm for the M12. This moves the spring clsoer to the Spring hanger for a bit more clearaqnce as well as making a failure of this bolt less likely. They do have parts but prefer that Customers "upgrade" to the lastest model. I'm waiting on a call form the owner to see what sort of "deal" he might make me. They did confirm that the Cap screw failure is one of the more common modes. When they changed to the M14, they also changed the spring since the sping end mounting hole got bigger.

When they went to the new Mk 3 version (wrap around axle mount), the bolt remained a M14 but was lengthened to 140 mm. This "centers" the spring even more on the rear leaf but more importantly, this was done to gain more clearance on the newer trucks. They went to the new axle mounting because the biggest complaint they had was due to having to "remove" the Axle U-Bolts in installstion.

BTW - If you have a similar failure and need the socket Cap screws, Grainger has them in packages of 10 for less than $12.

Will update more if and when Roadmaster gets back to me.

D

 

TXSailor,

I've been getting ready to buy my RAS, and have been reviewing the install guide. Did you tension your RAS with the rear tires off the ground as they state? They want the tension set with the leaf springs in their
"most arched position" vs. tires on the ground and leaf flattened out?

 

The installation guide is correct and the springs should be "pre-loaded" withe the rear axle off the ground (truck supported by the frame) and the springs in their most arched position. The tires are not on the vehicle (they are in the way of the adjustment) and do not have any bearing on the pre-tensionig process.

If fact if you do have the tires and wheels on, then you will be "over tensioning" the pre-load since the added weight will tend to make the leaf spring arch just a bit more.

They suggest the use of a quarter as a guide which is ok however I suggest that you take your "measurements" at several places on the spring. I did and found that some "coils"are slightly different than the rest. I just "averaged" the guide "measurement" and then took one turn off for "safety".

I have no idea what the resulting tension is on the assembly after you put the tires and wheels back on and drop it to the ground. I'm sure it goes up. The "static" load is not the issue with failures but more likely the "dynamic" loading when you hit a sharp bump and the spring & components must react quickly. The ends must stay in alignment or yo subject the Socket Cap Screw and threaded rod to bending and shear loads.

I suggest you put a couple of tywarps loosely around the spring hanger bracket (and if there is room the other end as well). That way if there is a failure. the assembly has limited movement to "get away" and cause havoc wiht the truck components. When I mentioned this to Tech support, they thought it was a good idea as well.

Overall, I thnk it is still a good product/idea and the improvements have all been postive both in the product and the ride characteristics of the EX.

D

 

I have a brand new in the box old style RAS, now wondering if I should even install it.

 

I do also and I am installing it this weekend. I figure thousands are working just fine, so why not try it. If it was a huge problem we would hear more about it

 

Absolutely install it!!!!! These things work and I beleive in the product and concept.

The RAS guys called me back (they said they would) and apologized profusely for the trouble I have had. We went thru the various "changes/upgrades" that have happened over the years. The latest design (Mk3) only came out last year and according to Ryan (at RAS) they have tens of thousands of the "older styles" and thousands of the latest installed, and only a few probems. None have been reproted with the latest version so far and only a few wiht the Mark 2's.

They are sending me new Cap Screws for the MK 2 although they offered a smoking good deal on the Mk 3's so I went ahead and bought a pair.

I will be selling my Mark 2's if anyone is interested.

Once again, the RAS folks have provided abosultely superior service and support to me. They are concentrating their current product in the Fleet Market and acording to Ryan that is one of the reasons for the re-design (needed to make it easier to install and a bit more beefy foir that tough market).

D

 

I sent RAS an email asking about the old style and never heard a thing, but I will still install it.

 

I recieved my latest model RAS yesterday for the EX to replace my previous Mk2 version. It will be a week or so before I can install them as they left out one of the "cup bearings" that go under the adjustment end (threaded rod) on the Spring Hanger bracket.

It's a small piee but somewhat critical since it distributes the load and aligns the bracket with the axis of the spring. Won't be able to call them until Monday.

Once I receive the missing bearing, then I will do the "de-install" of the Mk2's and "Install" on the Mk3's. I'll take some side by side pictures to post and give a rundown on the changes then.

BTW- Roadmaster did send me two new Socket Cap Screws for the Mk2 to make them fully functional as well. I'll confirm the sizes, etc when I do the comparison.

D

 

TXsailer - extra kudos man for all this info!!!

 

As promised, here's the update on the Roadmaster mark 3 versus mark 2. I did the "de-install" of the Mark 2 in about 45 minutes. Major issue is to get the axle u-bolts loose (again). I am not a big fan of re-using these type of u-bolts but at about $17 each (and that is wholesale), it gets expensive to replace them. I was just very careful about torquing them back down. Once that was done, it was aobut 45 min to do the Mark 3 installs.

I've posted a picture of the Mark 3 and Mark 2 side by side in my Gallery. For some reason I am not allowed to post pics in the threads.

2002 Ford Excursion 4x4 - RAS (Mk 3 versus Mk 2

Here's the deal - They have up-sized both ends of the new model RAS units from 12mm to 14mm. They also made the spring hanger strap 1/2in wider (not sure this did much) and lenghtened the Cap Screw on the Axle end for more clearance. They now have a more complicated mount that "wraps around" the spring (which adds a total of 5 new nuts and bolts to the unit) but you no longer have to remove your axle u-bolts. They are all fitted w/. Nyloc nuts. The whole affair is held in place around the leaf by the tension on the coil spring.

The spring sizes (length, coil & deflection) appear to be the same on the mk 2 as the newer mk3. I measured my rear end height (at the wheel wheel) and it is exactly the same wiht the mk3 as it was with the mk2 (40.5 in). I got about 1 1/2 inches of lift out of both units at the same setting (2mm coil spacing).

Looks like I have my old mark 2's for sale if someone needs them. Roadmaster did send me two brand new Cap Screws for the Mk 2's.

D

 

As promised, here's the update on the Roadmaster mark 3 versus mark 2. I did the "de-install" of the Mark 2 in about 45 minutes. Major issue is to get the axle u-bolts loose (again). I am not a big fan of re-using these type of u-bolts but at about $17 each (and that is wholesale), it gets expensive to replace them. I was just very careful about torquing them back down. Once that was done, it was aobut 45 min to do the Mark 3 installs.

I've posted a picture of the Mark 3 and Mark 2 side by side in my Gallery. For some reason I am not allowed to post pics in the threads.

2002 Ford Excursion 4x4 - RAS (Mk 3 versus Mk 2

Here's the deal - They have up-sized both ends of the new model RAS units from 12mm to 14mm. They also made the spring hanger strap 1/2in wider (not sure this did much) and lenghtened the Cap Screw on the Axle end for more clearance. They now have a more complicated mount that "wraps around" the spring (which adds a total of 5 new nuts and bolts to the unit) but you no longer have to remove your axle u-bolts. They are all fitted w/. Nyloc nuts. The whole affair is held in place around the leaf by the tension on the coil spring.

The spring sizes (length, coil & deflection) appear to be the same on the mk 2 as the newer mk3. I measured my rear end height (at the wheel wheel) and it is exactly the same wiht the mk3 as it was with the mk2 (40.5 in). I got about 1 1/2 inches of lift out of both units at the same setting (2mm coil spacing).

Looks like I have my old mark 2's for sale if someone needs them. Roadmaster did send me two brand new Cap Screws for the Mk 2's.

D

 

TXSailor one question. I just received my MK3's and plan on installing them tonight or tomorrow morning (trailer leaves tomorrow). Would you recommend the smaller gauge spacer setting (white) or the larger gauge (black). They say you get (if I remember correctly) 25% more load capacity with white and 40% more with black. My rig is mostly a family hauler with about 5 trips per year towing our 35' TT with a tongue weight of about 850 lbs.

Don't want to sacrifice too much ride quality but I'm on the road to recovery from the severe wandering issue. First trips with this trailer were downright scary! I just had the sway bar bushings up front replaced, new Hellwig on the rear, and now with the RAS I'm hoping this weekend's trip will be a vast improvement.

 

I'd start with the smaller setting (1 mm) or maybe a bit in between 1 and 2. What I did was use the 1 MM setting , drop the vehicle and then measure what "gain" I had on the rear end (aka how much is being picked up by the RAS). That was done w/o the TT and load in the EX.

Since I had measured the height of the hitch, etc BEFORE installing the RAS, it was easy to see what "lift" was there. I then made a judgement call, to tighten it up more towards the 2 mm setting. (Yes you have to jack the thing up twice to do this.)

I ended up more than 1 mm but slightly less than 2 MM to get the additional height on the rear end I wanted. These things are really smooth in their operation however and I doubt you will see much "harshness" when the EX is loaded either way.

This is just the way I did it so it's only my "un-qualified" opinion.

D