?
are all cab chassis frames the same strength
Laughing Gas
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 939
Likes: 1
From: Central Kansas
No one there among the Ford Truck experts who knows about the new frame thickness? I found the Information on the website: Ford - Cars, SUVs, Trucks & Crossovers | Ford Vehicles | The Official Site of Ford Vehicles | Ford.com
But maybe those 6.7mm are only for the F-350 and i guess the enhanced frame on the options has a similiar added frame like the old version mentioned above?
Since this 19500lbs frame is the base of some armored military vehicles, i think it needs a little more than 6.7mm. But of course it is possible, that those military companys reworked the frame anyway.
Greetings
But maybe those 6.7mm are only for the F-350 and i guess the enhanced frame on the options has a similiar added frame like the old version mentioned above?
Since this 19500lbs frame is the base of some armored military vehicles, i think it needs a little more than 6.7mm. But of course it is possible, that those military companys reworked the frame anyway.
Greetings
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...sisCabs_SB.pdf
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 1
Thank you for this file!
Ok and do both versions of the F-550 share the same boxed front end? Or is the older chassis an open c in the front which is the same dimension as the rest of the frame? I think it is a little disturbing, that the huge f-550 shares a front part with the "puny" f-350.
But maybe i am wrong looking at this that way, mabe someone has a picture of the front part of such an 19500lbs f-550 to get a closer look at this boxed-open-c-mix-part.
Greetings
Ok and do both versions of the F-550 share the same boxed front end? Or is the older chassis an open c in the front which is the same dimension as the rest of the frame? I think it is a little disturbing, that the huge f-550 shares a front part with the "puny" f-350.
But maybe i am wrong looking at this that way, mabe someone has a picture of the front part of such an 19500lbs f-550 to get a closer look at this boxed-open-c-mix-part.
Greetings
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,104
Likes: 5
From: West Tx
Hello,
sorry to digg out this old topic, bit i find this pdf file really interesting!
But is it possible, that Ford decided to make the new frames a little thinner? As far as is understand those old posts above, the old Frame is 0.280 in the front boxed-section and 0.320 in the open-c rear section which is adding up to overlapping 0.600 where the to sections are combined, that is correct right?
Well the most important part i thin still is the rear open c, so the 0.320 section which would be 8.1mm.
I read on the ford hompeage some months ago (can not find the ****ing link again), that the new 2012 F-550 has a frame strengh of 6.7mm. This would still be pretty thick, but considerable less thick than before, so maybe they use a new kind of steel now? Dodge has 7.7mm in strengh but uses 50.000psi steel and the rails are much higher in the middle section (but the truck heavier in general).
Also to discuss the more effective way- open c alle the way long or the combination of the crash-approved box section + the open c- how about old f-550 frames? When the f-550 had leaf springs front and rear (do not know how long this time is ago), i guess it was a complete open c right? Did those frames had the normal 7.5x2.5x0.300 all the way?
Greetings
sorry to digg out this old topic, bit i find this pdf file really interesting!
But is it possible, that Ford decided to make the new frames a little thinner? As far as is understand those old posts above, the old Frame is 0.280 in the front boxed-section and 0.320 in the open-c rear section which is adding up to overlapping 0.600 where the to sections are combined, that is correct right?
Well the most important part i thin still is the rear open c, so the 0.320 section which would be 8.1mm.
I read on the ford hompeage some months ago (can not find the ****ing link again), that the new 2012 F-550 has a frame strengh of 6.7mm. This would still be pretty thick, but considerable less thick than before, so maybe they use a new kind of steel now? Dodge has 7.7mm in strengh but uses 50.000psi steel and the rails are much higher in the middle section (but the truck heavier in general).
Also to discuss the more effective way- open c alle the way long or the combination of the crash-approved box section + the open c- how about old f-550 frames? When the f-550 had leaf springs front and rear (do not know how long this time is ago), i guess it was a complete open c right? Did those frames had the normal 7.5x2.5x0.300 all the way?
Greetings
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 1
Ok so i guess the Frame did not change in the last two Generations then?
Does anyone has an idea about the 04 frame dimensions? As far as i know, the F-550 did not had the same payload back then, so i guess the frame was lighter too.
But is the Boxed-Front always the same? Still sounds i little scary that a part of the frame is "only" F-350-dimension. And what are the boxed-measurements? Is it 0.280 thick like the F-350 in general, which would be still pretty thick for a boxed frame part, or is it even thinner? I don't think they made it 0.320 boxed.
And what i still don't get, how can dodge reach the same weight class which so much thinner material? Is it just this 50.000SI Steel? And why is the dodge still heavier????
Greetings
Does anyone has an idea about the 04 frame dimensions? As far as i know, the F-550 did not had the same payload back then, so i guess the frame was lighter too.
But is the Boxed-Front always the same? Still sounds i little scary that a part of the frame is "only" F-350-dimension. And what are the boxed-measurements? Is it 0.280 thick like the F-350 in general, which would be still pretty thick for a boxed frame part, or is it even thinner? I don't think they made it 0.320 boxed.
And what i still don't get, how can dodge reach the same weight class which so much thinner material? Is it just this 50.000SI Steel? And why is the dodge still heavier????
Greetings
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,104
Likes: 5
From: West Tx
The front has a sleeve in the cradle for the front to stiffen where the horns are welded on. The gvwr for the 02 is 17,950 and 19,500 for new. Ill get measurements off the F550 when i get back. Ford uses 36kpsi last i checked. Just because a steel is higher strength does not dictate that it will flex as well and have better cycle to failure in comparison to a lower strength rating. It would be nice to see the composition. Open c channel allows for much better flexure in comparison to boxed which in some cases is fine and others not.
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 1
Hello,
So you are going to measure the boxed front end of the modern F-550 or the c-channel frame of the older F-550? Either way thank you very much!
But is the boxed front now always the same from 350 to 550 or does it also differ? And how is it exactly combined with the doubled 19500 frame? Are there 3 lays of metal where the frame changes from boxed to open c? Or does only the 0.320 part fit into the boexd part and the secondary 0.280 lay is weldet together with the overlapping boxed part?
Greetings
So you are going to measure the boxed front end of the modern F-550 or the c-channel frame of the older F-550? Either way thank you very much!
But is the boxed front now always the same from 350 to 550 or does it also differ? And how is it exactly combined with the doubled 19500 frame? Are there 3 lays of metal where the frame changes from boxed to open c? Or does only the 0.320 part fit into the boexd part and the secondary 0.280 lay is weldet together with the overlapping boxed part?
Greetings
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,104
Likes: 5
From: West Tx
Nope, just gotten really busy with work, been driving a lot and not been where the F550 is. Ill measure the frame as soon as i can, didnt expect ti be travelling this much!
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Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,104
Likes: 5
From: West Tx
Ok, so rough measurements.
Sleeved portion
Steering gear box
Rails under bed
There is a sleeve where the front section is added, boxed engine forward on both frames. The newer trucks had hybrid double frames where certain portions were boxed along the back rails which added to make the 19,5klb rating.
While the differences between the two may seem small, there is a significant difference between the two frames, no matter where you look. The front portion is significantly heavier built than the F350. So, there are NO "puny" F350 components on the F550 frame case closed.
Controlled crush holes on F550
Controlled crush holes on F350
F550 frame behind steering box
F350 frame behind steering box
F550 double frame sleeve
Some of the measurements are not exacting due to frame coating on F550.
Sleeved portion
- F350=13.5mm
- F550=15.4 mm
Steering gear box
- F350=7.1mm
- F550=8.2mm
Rails under bed
- F350=6.6mm
- F550=8.6mm
There is a sleeve where the front section is added, boxed engine forward on both frames. The newer trucks had hybrid double frames where certain portions were boxed along the back rails which added to make the 19,5klb rating.
While the differences between the two may seem small, there is a significant difference between the two frames, no matter where you look. The front portion is significantly heavier built than the F350. So, there are NO "puny" F350 components on the F550 frame case closed.
Controlled crush holes on F550
Controlled crush holes on F350
F550 frame behind steering box
F350 frame behind steering box
F550 double frame sleeve
Some of the measurements are not exacting due to frame coating on F550.
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 1
Damn why didnt i get the e-mail to inform me about your rexent answer?!
Well anyway thank you very much for those measurements! Interesting to know that even the boxed part is not entirely the same thing from 350 to 550.
But isnt the part below the steering gear box the "boxed-frame-part"? So is this really a ~8mm Boxed-Frame? Sounds pretty extreme to be honest but would make sense considering the fact that the rest of the frame has the same base thickness.
But how much of the complete frame is "doubled"? How long is this sleeve? Sorry if i did not understand you enitrely, for i am not a native speaker and this is a pretty special topic.
And does anyone knows something about the material, so which kind of steel this 30.000PSI-Steel is?
Greetings
Well anyway thank you very much for those measurements! Interesting to know that even the boxed part is not entirely the same thing from 350 to 550.
But isnt the part below the steering gear box the "boxed-frame-part"? So is this really a ~8mm Boxed-Frame? Sounds pretty extreme to be honest but would make sense considering the fact that the rest of the frame has the same base thickness.
But how much of the complete frame is "doubled"? How long is this sleeve? Sorry if i did not understand you enitrely, for i am not a native speaker and this is a pretty special topic.
And does anyone knows something about the material, so which kind of steel this 30.000PSI-Steel is?
Greetings
Post Fiend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,521
Likes: 11
From: Greenwood, SC
Wow, what are you getting at full size?
You speak of military spec, and you're really trying to work camodown pretty hard.
In our day and age, I can't help but wonder if you are trying to see if you can find out what it would take to blow up a troop carrier...........
You speak of military spec, and you're really trying to work camodown pretty hard.
In our day and age, I can't help but wonder if you are trying to see if you can find out what it would take to blow up a troop carrier...........
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 557
Likes: 2
From: Wheeling WV area
the 250-f550 have the same frames. the fronts are double framed riveted togerther. the sections depending if it is single or suber cab.
the cab chassis frame narrow right before it exits rear cab
cab chassis 34" v 37" for pick up
the f450 have 19.5" and is not double framed in back except if it has the long wheel
base
the 550 is double frames in the back. it has sleeve channel that slips over outer frame channel and it is riveted on It folds over the top reail but only goes downthe side 3/4 of the way
I will be chopping up a 02 f250 frame this week
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...8/IMG_0808.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...8/IMG_0809.jpg
the cab chassis frame narrow right before it exits rear cab
cab chassis 34" v 37" for pick up
the f450 have 19.5" and is not double framed in back except if it has the long wheel
base
the 550 is double frames in the back. it has sleeve channel that slips over outer frame channel and it is riveted on It folds over the top reail but only goes downthe side 3/4 of the way
I will be chopping up a 02 f250 frame this week
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...8/IMG_0808.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...8/IMG_0809.jpg
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 1
@ruschejj
I guess you are talking about the Oskosh Sandcat because you mentioned military stuff? I don't think that Oshkosh uses the Ford frame without some improvement and of course the armored body will not be much effected by the frame construction it is built on, so weather or not someone knows the frame details, it#s not going to help him to much i guess.
And no, i am not a terrorist
I am youst interestet in any kinds of frames in the weight area of 5000-20.000lbs right now, weather or not of an military or civil offroad vehicle, unimogs, pickups etc. because it is very interesting how diffrent they are, some stiff, some flexible, some semi-stiff, some seems to be pretty liht and thin, but using high quality material etc.
@mrblonde
Ahm i get this right, what you are saying is kinda the opposite to what camodown has written? I don't think that a F-250 has a 8mm boxed, front part??
Greetings
I guess you are talking about the Oskosh Sandcat because you mentioned military stuff? I don't think that Oshkosh uses the Ford frame without some improvement and of course the armored body will not be much effected by the frame construction it is built on, so weather or not someone knows the frame details, it#s not going to help him to much i guess.
And no, i am not a terrorist
I am youst interestet in any kinds of frames in the weight area of 5000-20.000lbs right now, weather or not of an military or civil offroad vehicle, unimogs, pickups etc. because it is very interesting how diffrent they are, some stiff, some flexible, some semi-stiff, some seems to be pretty liht and thin, but using high quality material etc.@mrblonde
Ahm i get this right, what you are saying is kinda the opposite to what camodown has written? I don't think that a F-250 has a 8mm boxed, front part??
Greetings
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 557
Likes: 2
From: Wheeling WV area
No. the 250 and 550 from cab up is exactly the same. the 55o from cab back is just regular channel with an outer plate riveted on to strengthen it up. I'm chopping up a 2002 f250 pick up i will take some pic for you.
But there is f250 f350 f450 f550 cab chassis which is straight railed behind cab all are 34 industry standard. picks up have different frame cab back they curve and have hump and are 37" inches i think.i will snap photo of my 2001 f350 SRW cab chassis truck also.
But there is f250 f350 f450 f550 cab chassis which is straight railed behind cab all are 34 industry standard. picks up have different frame cab back they curve and have hump and are 37" inches i think.i will snap photo of my 2001 f350 SRW cab chassis truck also.